New England IPA "Northeast" style IPA

[SRJHops]

How long is everyone dry hopping?

Currently, I am dry hopping a small amount (2-3 ounces) near the end of fermentation, then soft crashing to 58/60, then dry hopping again 2-3 days before bottling (4-5 ounces).

I do believe that active fermentation with hops such as Citra (and the right yeast) can create citronellol, but I also agree with Dgallo that dry hopping during active can lead to greater hop burn. My question is whether I can thread the needle and get the best of both worlds, by reducing the amount during active (and adding at the end of fermentation) and then doing a larger final dry hop (cold) after a soft crash. My jury is still out, but I seem to get juicier results this way...

 

[stickyfinger]

has anyone compared these processes:

soft crash and dry hop at soft crash temp vs soft crash, warm beer up again and then dry hop?

 

[flintoid]

has anyone compared these processes:

soft crash and dry hop at soft crash temp vs soft crash, warm beer up again and then dry hop?

Yes. I've done a few experiments like this:

same recipe: 2-row base, flaked barley, a touch of golden promise
hops: citra, cascade, simcoe or galaxy

soft crash to 58F for 2 days

dry hop was 6oz total, one single charge into a purged keg.

dry hop method #1: 3 days at 58F with 20PSI of C02
dry hop method #2: 2 days and raise temp to 70F with 20 PSI of C02
dry hop method #3: 4 days at 58F with 20 PSI of C02
dry hop method #4: 4 days at 70F with 20 PSI of C02

notes:

method 1 was by far the least potent. Aromatics and flavors were subdued. But it tasted good, no astringency whatsoever. The dry hop added mostly aromatics over imparting any flavor.
method 2 was good, but aromatics didn't stick around as long as method #3. It had more of a "green" tone to the flavor than methods 1 and 3, but it was very slight. It was pleasant.
method 3 tasted good and had good aromatics, aromatics lasted the longest (5 weeks)
method 4 was quite astringent, potent. After astringency left, there was a little bit of a "green" hoppy taste that lingered. More than method 2.

Depending on my timeline, I shoot for a 4 day dry hop at 58F. After reading some of @Dgallo and others notes here, I'm going to dry hop at 2 days at 70F and then cold crash and do another DH at 58F for 1-2 days and see how it compares. I hope it makes the dry hop characteristics more complex and saturated.

 

[JustusLiebig]

Thinking about cloning this recipe, but replacing the Mosaic with Strata. Anybody have opinions on a Citra, Strata, Galaxy? I have heard that Mosaic is a bit more piney than Mosaic and that Strata has a good fruity character. However, I am worried about how resinous and harsh the beer might be with Strata and Galaxy.

 

[anteater8]

has anyone compared these processes:

soft crash and dry hop at soft crash temp vs soft crash, warm beer up again and then dry hop?

First time I soft crashed, I threw the hops in around 55 degrees and they all sank right to the bottom of the carboy. I noticed less hop aroma on that batch for sure. Ever since then, I will soft crash to 50 or 55, then let it rise back up to 60-65 before I dry hop.

This is based on different recipes, both NEIPA and west coast, so I don't have an apples to apples comparison.

 

[BeerFst]

First time I soft crashed, I threw the hops in around 55 degrees and they all sank right to the bottom of the carboy. I noticed less hop aroma on that batch for sure. Ever since then, I will soft crash to 50 or 55, then let it rise back up to 60-65 before I dry hop.

This is based on different recipes, both NEIPA and west coast, so I don't have an apples to apples comparison.

Similar to you, i tried dryhopping a west-coast ish ipa with an ounce of simcoe cryo and 2oz simcoe pellets at 58 and it was really subdued aroma. pulled the keg to room temp, added another 3oz pellets, let it sit at 65ish (room temp in late fall) and BOOM, aroma was awesome. previously all my dry hops were done around 65, and that's what ill be doing from now on.

edit: i ferment in corny's though so i have no idea if its cause they fell or not.

 

[Genuine]

I'm currently doing a yeast experiment with 12 other brewers and part of the recipe is to soft crash to 55-58 degrees before dry hopping for a day. I've yet to do that myself since I've always done it at 68.

 

[jturman35]

My first and only attempt at a soft crash and short 36hr dry hop failed miserably , absolutely no aroma whatsoever from the 6oz dry hop charge. I dropped the temp to 58 for a 48hr soft crash and then raised up to around 63-65deg for the dry hop addition.

I’m too cheap to make this mistake again. I will do 6oz total dry hop spread out at day 3, day 11 and in the keg. Spread the love!

 

[murphyslaw]

has anyone compared these processes:

soft crash and dry hop at soft crash temp vs soft crash, warm beer up again and then dry hop?

I think I've read that Mitch Steel did that at Stone.

 

[secretlevel]

I'm currently doing a yeast experiment with 12 other brewers and part of the recipe is to soft crash to 55-58 degrees before dry hopping for a day. I've yet to do that myself since I've always done it at 68.

Do report back, this sounds really interesting! What are the variables?

 

[Genuine]

Do report back, this sounds really interesting! What are the variables?

We all brewed the same beer recipe, making adjustments for each particular system to hit the same gravity, bitterness, etc. Used distilled or RO water and built the same water profile. The only variable is using different yeasts on the same wort. My batch will begin cold crashing tonight and then dry hopped Saturday, then kegged sunday.

 

[beervoid]

We all brewed the same beer recipe, making adjustments for each particular system to hit the same gravity, bitterness, etc. Used distilled or RO water and built the same water profile. The only variable is using different yeasts on the same wort. My batch will begin cold crashing tonight and then dry hopped Saturday, then kegged sunday.

The biggest problem I see (and have experienced) with this method is by soft crashing the yeast it becomes less active.
Then if the dry hops cause hop creep you could potentially get diacetyl problems.
The enzymes responsible for hop creep are still active even at lower temps.
If you have the ability to completely remove all yeast by dumping it, it might work but I wonder if a short softcrash would get enough yeast out of suspension.

 

[Dgallo]

Thinking about cloning this recipe, but replacing the Mosaic with Strata. Anybody have opinions on a Citra, Strata, Galaxy? I have heard that Mosaic is a bit more piney than Mosaic and that Strata has a good fruity character. However, I am worried about how resinous and harsh the beer might be with Strata and Galaxy.

A

The biggest problem I see (and have experienced) with this method is by soft crashing the yeast it becomes less active.
Then if the dry hops cause hop creep you could potentially get diacetyl problems.
The enzymes still are active even at lower temps.
If you have the ability to completely remove all yeast by dumping it, it might work but I wonder if a short softcrash would get enough yeast out of suspension.

has this actually happened to you? I can’t dump the yeast after crashing and I haven’t experience any Diacetyl problem. Not even when force testing

 

[beervoid]

A

has this actually happened to you? I can’t dump the yeast after crashing and I haven’t experience any Diacetyl problem. Not even when force testing

Yes, happened on 4 different beers, fermented at the same time split between conan and 1318.
It was not a diacetyl bomb but definately noticable. I'm very sensitive to diacetyl I have to say.
I havent given up on this method yet though, still experimenting more.

 

[beervoid]

A

has this actually happened to you? I can’t dump the yeast after crashing and I haven’t experience any Diacetyl problem. Not even when force testing

When do you typically start soft crashing? And how long and at what temp is the softcrash before introducing hopload?
Also how high do you mash?
Perhaps you have no u fermentable sugars to be converted if u mash low enough?

 

[bailey mountain brewer]

suggestion please guys, i am fermenting a neipa i just dry hopped this morning (wednesday) at 70 and plan to keg on saturday. i have it in a spike cf15 so i can crash and drop the yeast out. my thought was to leave it at 70 for today and tomorrow then soft crash friday morning. should i drop the yeast out right before kegging? ususally i ferment for a week then drop the yeast/trub but this time my fermentation was slow and lasted longer. i used white labs london fog yeast, my starter didnt have quite as much time to grow as i was pressed for time so i think thats why it was slow, but anyway this through me off my normal process so should any suggestions would be appreciated.

 

[beervoid]

A

has this actually happened to you? I can’t dump the yeast after crashing and I haven’t experience any Diacetyl problem. Not even when force testing

Just looked back. It might be the first dry hop 72h before soft crash releases all the sugars so you dont have this problem. Something I need to try out myself, I only do 1 charge.

 

[stickyfinger]

i'd be willing to bet that every single one of my heavily dry hopped beers would fail a force test, even if i left them for days and days. i haven't tried one after a soft crash however.

 

[jturman35]

Pardon my ignorance but what’s a force test?

 

[Dgallo]

Pardon my ignorance but what’s a force test?

https://spikebrewing.com/blogs/ask-a-pro/an-easy-diy-diacetyl-test

 

[DrGMG]

I dry hop at 68-70 degrees during days 2-3 for NEIPA and when I have 5-6 points left in fermentation on my regular IPAs. I've always read that dry hopping at colder temps (50-60) gives you more grassy flavors.

 

[nick sekerak]

What are your thoughts on this, i am probably over thinking it but still... I hate any chance of o2 getting in.

I am using loki yeast, fermenting at 96*F and just hit FG. I want to naturally free fall the temp to like 71/72 degrees for the yeast to clean up for a day or so.

Is there any risk of O2 suck back from a natural free fall???

 

[Dgallo]

What are your thoughts on this, i am probably over thinking it but still... I hate any chance of o2 getting in.

I am using loki yeast, fermenting at 96*F and just hit FG. I want to naturally free fall the temp to like 71/72 degrees for the yeast to clean up for a day or so.

Is there any risk of O2 suck back from a natural free fall???

It’s kviek yeast by running it hot, it cleaned itself up within hours of hitting fg so I wouldn’t worry at all about that. Now if you need to cool to dryhop then as long as you ambient temp is equal to that of the temp your dropping it too, it should not caused suckback

 

[nick sekerak]

It’s kviek yeast by running it hot, it cleaned itself up within hours of hitting fg so I wouldn’t worry at all about that. Now if you need to cool to dryhop then as long as you ambient temp is equal to that of the temp your dropping it too, it should not caused suckback

Well i feel dumb, I never heard that before about Kviek's thanks for the info. That will shave a two days of off my tank time.

 

[secretlevel]

Gents, I'm going to ferment a batch with A24 at room temperature (around 70F) as my fermentation chamber is tied up. I'm thinking about wrapping the fermenter in a sleeping bag and keeping an eye on the temperature to make sure it doesn't go over 75+. Has anyone done this with good results?

 

[bailey mountain brewer]

I dry hop at 68-70 degrees during days 2-3 for NEIPA and when I have 5-6 points left in fermentation on my regular IPAs. I've always read that dry hopping at colder temps (50-60) gives you more grassy flavors.

ok, thanks. i dont want the grassy flavor so ill leave it at 70 and just cold crash before kegging like usual. which means i should keg it a day early since it will be at the warmer temp.

 

[SRJHops]

Gents, I'm going to ferment a batch with A24 at room temperature (around 70F) as my fermentation chamber is tied up. I'm thinking about wrapping the fermenter in a sleeping bag and keeping an eye on the temperature to make sure it doesn't go over 75+. Has anyone done this with good results?

Not sure I understand the need for the sleeping bag? Could you set up a swamp cooler? Large tub with water and ice if needed? Works great to keep the temp down.

 

[secretlevel]

Not sure I understand the need for the sleeping bag? Could you set up a swamp cooler? Large tub with water and ice if needed? Works great to keep the temp down.

So I actually do want the temp to go up to 75 and stay around there, but not much higher. If it does go higher, I was thinking I can remove the bag.

 

[Dgallo]

So I actually do want the temp to go up to 75 and stay around there, but not much higher. If it does go higher, I was thinking I can remove the bag.

If you’re room temp is 65-68 it will have no problem reaching 75 on its own. It easily will gain 8*f during fermentation. With a blanket I’d bet you’d see close to 80*f or better

 

[secretlevel]

If you’re room temp is 65-68 it will have no problem reaching 75 on its own. It easily will gain 8*f during fermentation. With a blanket I’d bet you’d see close to 80*f or better

Alright, maybe no blanket then... Thanks guys.

 

[Dgallo]

Alright, maybe no blanket then... Thanks guys.

Good luck man. A24 is an awesome yeast. It is my house yeast. By far my favorite yeast for the style.

 

[tld6008]

It’s kviek yeast by running it hot, it cleaned itself up within hours of hitting fg so I wouldn’t worry at all about that. Now if you need to cool to dryhop then as long as you ambient temp is equal to that of the temp your dropping it too, it should not caused suckback

I would think the ambient (external) temperature would not play a role. If the beer temperature drops there will be a case for suck back or at least for a negative pressure in the space above the beer.

 

[jturman35]

Anyone else have issues with Imperial Juice attenuating down past 67%? I seem to always be stuck at 1.020. I usually do a 1-1.5L starter for 18-24hrs and pitch the whole thing.


I like the finishing gravity but would like to see how it turns out around 1.014-1.016.

 

[marchuk96]

Anyone else have issues with Imperial Juice attenuating down past 67%? I seem to always be stuck at 1.020. I usually do a 1-1.5L starter for 18-24hrs and pitch the whole thing.


I like the finishing gravity but would like to see how it turns out around 1.014-1.016.

Mash temp?

 

[jturman35]

Usually around 152 mash. Always ferment upper 60’s and my current batch I let it rip to 75 and according to my tilt and it appears going to end up around 1.020. I have been using BeerSmith for calculating starter size using a stir plate. I even oxygenated for about 60 seconds with pure oxygen on this batch right before pitching the yeast.

 

[marchuk96]

Usually around 152 mash. Always ferment upper 60’s and my current batch I let it rip to 75 and according to my tilt and it appears going to end up around 1.020. I have been using BeerSmith for calculating starter size using a stir plate. I even oxygenated for about 60 seconds with pure oxygen on this batch right before pitching the yeast.

Ok...do you use crystal malt in your recipe?...

 

[jturman35]

Zero. Pretty much always use the same base malt with small tweaks. I usually do a 1lb of flaked wheat/oats, but tried white wheat on this one. This is batch has the highest adjuncts of the other three batches. The beers come out pretty good but just don’t understand why they don’t at least finish around 1.018.

78% 2 row
13% white wheat
6% flaked oats
3% honey malt

 

[BeerFst]

Good luck man. A24 is an awesome yeast. It is my house yeast. By far my favorite yeast for the style.

My first use was with a fruited blonde ale and I didn’t think it brought that much to the party. But god damn, I just pulled my first hydro sample, pre dry hop, of what I brewed Saturday and good lord! WP 3oz mosaic and 1oz Columbus at FO. This is unreal. Also this yeast plus 50% oats is by far my murkiest beer ever. Granted this is pre crash but woah. Actually kinda wish I added some crystal just for color. It’s still going slow but seems to have stalled a bit. Thinking it may be the .5 pitch rate, 154 mash, or high oat content, likely all 3. 1.062 og, sitting at 1.022

 

[SanPancho]

Pardon my ignorance but what’s a force test?

Terms getting mixed up here. VDK is the diacetyl test. Force is -im assuming here based on experience- a forced ferment test. Tells what your FG will be by yeast action.

 

[marchuk96]

Zero. Pretty much always use the same base malt with small tweaks. I usually do a 1lb of flaked wheat/oats, but tried white wheat on this one. This is batch has the highest adjuncts of the other three batches. The beers come out pretty good but just don’t understand why they don’t at least finish around 1.018.

78% 2 row
13% white wheat
6% flaked oats
3% honey malt

Hmm..grain bill looks good....old packs maybe? Ever check the dates?...other than that you got me...ph may be the only other culprit...I've never had an issue with that yeast and attenuation...its usually done pretty quick too for me...