Newb scorches LME

[jdbrew]

Hi all, I've been coming across advice from Homebrew Talk pretty much every time I ask one of my many stupid questions so thanks for sharing the knowledge. I got a brewing kit from my wife a few Christmas's ago and so far everything has been more or less drinkable, so I have that going for me. Now I'm working on a brew in a bag set-up and plan on giving it a go this summer. I'm sure I'm going to need more advice when that gets rolling. For now, I'm just trying to figure out how to avoid scorching my lme again!

 

[mac_1103]

Yeah, standard extract kit instructions almost guarantee at least some scorching of the LME. What do they think is going to happen when you add thick heavy malt syrup to a pot of boiling water at high heat on your stovetop? Some of it almost has to sink to the bottom and scorch before you can get it mixed in well enough to prevent that. Try removing the pot from the burner while you add the LME and mix it. Then put it back on the heat for the boil.

Also search the extract brewing forums for additional suggestions for process changes. Lots of folks shorten the boil, add some or all the LME late, etc.

 

[fluketamer]

yes remove from heat dont add it all in the begining go for a late addition.
dont add it all in the middle of the pot i like to add it evenly around the kettle. then stir like crazy with teflon or wooden spoon making sure to get the whole bottom of the kettle with the spoon.

 

[jdbrew]

Thanks for your replies. I also read that some people heat up the lme by putting the containers in hot water first. I can see that being helpful with getting the sticky stuff out in the first place. Maybe if it was pre-warmed it would dissolve quicker too.

 

[BrewnWKopperKat]

I'm just trying to figure out how to avoid scorching my lme again!

Add it to warm (160F to 200F) water.

For my 2.5 gal recipes where I used LME, I added all the LME at around 180F before the start of the 30 boil. I didn't have to stir "fast and furious" to avoid scorching. I also warmed the plasic pouch in warm (120F-ish) water for about 20 minutes.

If I were doing late additions, I would either take wort out of the boil kettle to dissolve the LME or heat some additional water to 200F then dissolve the LME into the kettle.

Late additions of DME/LME appears to reduce the color of the wort by around 1 SRM. Personally, I don't worry about 1 SRM when my beers are already above 6 SRM.

When lowest possible color matters, I use BIAB.

If you are looking for the lowest possible color, use DME and check out this post (link). It confirms many of the things you'll find searching the "extract" forum (and you can avoid the relentless trash-talking of DME/LME that often occurred here in the later 2010s).

LME can age rapidly (due to heat and oxygen). There's a technique that is described in either "Advanced Extract Brewing" or "I brewed a favorite recipe tody" that discusses how to measure the quality of the LME. I've used it, it works (e.g. If your extra light LME is red, that's "not a good ign").

Yeah, standard extract kit instructions almost guarantee at least some scorching of the LME.

FWIW, most online stores provide additional instructional videos

Can we pleae stop throwing all kits "under the bus"?

 

[mac_1103]

I didn't throw any kits under the bus. I did throw the "standard extract kit instructions" under the bus, and I stand by that.

 

[jdbrew]

The progress we've made through what we've been sold has been a fun journey. The mistakes have been mostly my own and I'm looking forward to learning more. Thanks again to everyone for sharing your experience.

 

[Broken Crow]

I began with stove-top brews, so here's a messy one: I'm disabled so rather than move the huge pot off the burner to mix, I took my large SS dutch-oven (which I had thoroughly scrubbed with barkeepers friend inside and out) and wearing thick cotton gloves inside my rubbermaid gloves; dipped it into the pot to fill with boiling water, and mixed my LME in on the countertop...had to repeat a couple times till I got it all blended and yeah it dripped all over, but it worked and cleanup wasn't too bad.

 

[jdbrew]

I admire the dedication! My scorching problem came with the latest batch of weizen we brewed up. It was bad enough where my wife spent close to two hours cleaning the pot. We just sampled a little while bottling and couldn't taste anything wrong so I think we're okay. I'm willing to jump through a hoop or two to make sure it doesn't happen again though.

 

[BrewnWKopperKat]

I took my large SS dutch-oven (which I had thoroughly scrubbed with barkeepers friend inside and out) and wearing thick cotton gloves inside my rubbermaid gloves; dipped it into the pot to fill with boiling water, and mixed my LME in on the countertop...had to repeat a couple times till I got it all blended and yeah it dripped all over, but it worked and cleanup wasn't too bad.

Over in "I brewed a favorite recipe today" #11 (link) there is a description of a process for partial boil (2.5 gal boil for 5 gal batch) with late addtions (half the DME at the end of the boil).

The process uses cool water (and some time) to dissolve the DME then add the DME slurry to the kettle.

It seems like technique could be adapted for late additions of LME. It may helpful to heat the water (180F, then take it off the heat) to speed up the process.

 

[BrewnWKopperKat]

I did throw the "standard extract kit instructions" under the bus, and I stand by that.

Just be aware that the kit makers do provide additional information in links from the kit's web page.

 

[mac_1103]

Just be aware that the kit makers do provide additional information in links from the kit's web page.

Well sure, but I certainly didn't do a lot of web searching for additional information before I brewed my first kit and I suspect that most newbies don't either.

 

[BrewnWKopperKat]

web searching for additional information

One of the advantages of actually buying the kit is that the "links" to additional information are in the box.

In the case of just using the online recipe, the kit's web page can found in a search or two.

 

[IslandLizard]

To @mac_1103 and @BrewnWKopperKat
Please tone it down!
You both have valid points, keep the discussion civil.

 

[FloppyKnockers]

I suffered the same scorching problem as other extract brewers. The simple solution for me was late additions.

After steeping grains, if any, heat water up to ~150°, remove from heat, add about 10% of your extract, and continue the recipe as instructed. About ten to fifteen minutes left in the boil, remove from heat, and add the remaining extract, and return to heat. Don't worry if you don't reach boil again. You only need the wort to stay above 170° for 30 seconds to sanitize the remaining extract.

Since doing this, I can get me extract brews bright, light, and no taste of molasses or 'twang'.

 

[IslandLizard]

You only need the wort to stay above 170° for 30 seconds to sanitize the remaining extract.

pasteurize!

 

[FloppyKnockers]

pasteurize!

Sanipastize!

I think we're both right. Although both reduce harmful pathogens, pasteurization can only be achieved by heat.

 

[Rish]

I steep my grains, finish my boil, remove from heat then add all the lme or dme. Works well for me. I do put lme bags in the sink with hot water from the tap while doing the boil to make it easier to empty into the bk. Good luck!

 

[BrewnWKopperKat]

https://www.baderbrewing.com/content/boil-hops is another "all LME at end of boil" process.

At the end of the article, there's a tip for adjusting "traditional recipes" based on hop utilization:

Earlier, when I mentioned that I got good results with 30 min full volume boils, I forgot to mention that I boil at a lower intensity. The intensity is typically 1 or 2 based on this UT:

 

[ncbrewer]

I've found that the kettle makes a significant difference. With my thin-wall stainless kettle, I stir constantly when I'm bringing wort to a boil. It doesn't scorch, but I get rings of extract residue stuck to the bottom, corresponding to where the heating element coils are. With my heavy- wall aluminum kettle (3/16"), I just stir occasionally when I'm bringing wort to a boil. I get no residue on the bottom at all. In both cases I don't stir when it's boiling.