New bad lot of Nottingham yeast ???

[robertbartsch]

I have a few packets of this yeast.

I just don't see the need to document all the steps necessary to prove to the manufacturor that there is something wrong with their yeast. If this is happening with many users, then the manufacturor should pull an adequate sample from sellers' selves and test them.

As for now, I will not use Nottingham. It is not worth the potential problems I may have; for now, I'll just use something else.

If there is something wrong with Notty, they should recall the lot immeditately. I don;t understand why people are doubting others who are having issues. This company recalled a batch from a different lot last year; right?

 

[BBKing]

I've thrown away 3 packs with this lot #.

While I've enjoyed Notty in the past I'm not rich enough that I can afford to waste a $30 batch of beer because I want to be loyal. Sorry, just cant do it.

I'll spend the extra pocket change to go with US-05 and when this crap is all figured out I'll be happy to go back to Notty.

But until then, I just cant do it.

 

[inspector13]

I will apologize now. I'm at work and don't have lots of time to read. Pitched Nottingham, same lot #, into a batch of Eds Haus Pale wart at 68 degrees, split into two carboys. 72 hours nothing. No change in gravity. Will be going by AHS in a little bit. I'm going to get liquid yeast to re-pitch. Do I just aerate and pitch or what. Sorry but I need a quick answer. Thanks once again for the guidance.

I posted this question. I went to the AHS store to get more yeast, they asked what was going on and told me to raise the temperature to 75 degrees. What do you know 36 hours later the Nottingham is doing well. So the cure for me was temperature.

Forrest thank your guys for me!

 

[RavenChief]

For those folks who have actually contacted Danstar about the apparent problem with Nottingham, has anyone gotten a response? Because I have never recieved any response about this problem...

 

[Rover]

same here

 

[MickeyD]

I have received no response.

 

[stevedasleeve]

Yes I was contacted after I emailed Lallemand and I suggested I send them my packets, used and unused. They replied and I sent them off last week.

 

[JuanMoore]

Just wanted to update. I have continued using Notty, and have had several packets from the same lot# act perfectly normal, but then I got another one that smelled sour and sank to the bottom of the glass when re-hydrated.

I decided to try a little expiriment to see if my suspicions were correct about the last one I poured down the drain. I racked off some wort out of each of the fermenters into a 1 gal growler (I slightly overshot my volume anyway), and pitched ~1/3 of the sour smelling slurry.

Both large fermenters were at high krausen the next day, but the growler had no activity. After 72 hours I had given up, but was too lazy to dump it out. Sometime between 80 and 90 hrs after pitching it started fermenting vigorously, and I figured there was a bug or some wild yeast in there. I decided to let it run its course and bottled it at the same time I kegged the other 10 gal. At bottling it tasted fine! It's now carbonated and tastes great. It has a bit more ester flavor than I've previously gotten from Notty, but otherwise tastes perfectly normal.

IMO over 80 hr lag time is totally unacceptable, but of the ~10 packets I've used from this lot# only 2 have had issues, and the rest have been fine. Notty is so cheap, and such a great yeast, that I'll probably continue using it even if I have to toss a packet that smells funny every now and then. Not sure what any of this means, but I just thought I'd share.

 

[BobBailey]

Since an earlier post to this thread I decided to try Notty again. Rehydrated per instructions and pitched at 68 degrees. This was at 10:30AM on 9/8/2010.
72 hours later there was no sign if fermentation so I made a 400ml., .040 starter with another sachet of Notty. (made the starter just to proof the yeast. The starter fermented out in less than 24 hours. I did not rehydrate the yeast before pitching onto the starter.

Yesterday morning (9/12) ,at about 10:00, there was still no sign of fermentation. There was actually still a little negative pressure in the carboy from the drop to my 64 degree fermentation temperature.

I pitched the starter and when I checked at 4:30 this morning early signs of fermentation were present.



Recipe: Chinook IPA
Brewer: Bob Bailey
Asst Brewer:
Style: American IPA
TYPE: All Grain
Taste: (35.0)

Recipe Specifications
--------------------------
Batch Size: 24.00 qt
Boil Size: 28.57 qt
Estimated OG: 1.061 SG
Estimated Color: 13.9 SRM
Estimated IBU: 69.6 IBU
Brewhouse Efficiency: 75.00 %
Boil Time: 60 Minutes

Ingredients:
------------
Amount Item Type % or IBU
10 lbs Pale Malt (2 Row) US (2.0 SRM) Grain 76.92 %
1 lbs Caramel/Crystal Malt -120L (120.0 SRM) Grain 7.69 %
8.0 oz Acid Malt (3.0 SRM) Grain 3.85 %
8.0 oz Honey Malt (25.0 SRM) Grain 3.85 %
1.00 oz Chinook [10.21 %] (60 min) Hops 28.4 IBU
1.50 oz Chinook [10.21 %] (20 min) Hops 25.8 IBU
1.50 oz Chinook [10.21 %] (10 min) Hops 15.4 IBU
1.00 tsp Irish Moss (Boil 10.0 min) Misc
1 lbs Sugar, Table (Sucrose) (1.0 SRM) Sugar 7.69 %
1 Pkgs Nottingham (Danstar #-) Yeast-Ale


Mash Schedule: Single Infusion, Medium Body, Batch Sparge
Total Grain Weight: 12.00 lb
----------------------------
Single Infusion, Medium Body, Batch Sparge
Step Time Name Description Step Temp
60 min Mash In Add 15.00 qt of water at 166.4 F 152.0 F


Both of the sachets of Nottingham were the same lot and I picked them up from the LHBS at the same time, so they were subject to the same handling conditions. I'm convinced that the problem must be with the packaging and not the yeast.

Since Notty is one of my favorite yeasts as well as being inexpensive, I think I'll go back to using it as my first choice again. I will be making small starters with it as a way to cull out possible bad packs.

 

[RavenChief]

If everyone who uses Nottingham dry yeast will just start "proofing" thier yeast prior to pitching, I think we can solve this problem. I have not totally given up on Nottingham yeast, but I will never again just throw it in the fermenter and assume it's good...

 

[Rover]

If everyone who uses Nottingham dry yeast will just start "proofing" thier yeast prior to pitching, I think we can solve this problem. I have not totally given up on Nottingham yeast, but I will never again just throw it in the fermenter and assume it's good...

I agree,
I have four more packs of this lot# from a different LHBS,. I have two recipes on deck that I would like to use Notty with. I was going to do an experiment with the packs but Fletch78 all ready did. I am going to proof the packs to see if they are viable, and if they are not I have some US-05 ready to go.

I just wish Danstar would reply to the emails regarding the problems with this lot#. They tried but they responded with the wrong lot#

 

[devilishprune]

Yeah I just looked in the fridge, and I have 4 packs of this lot number. I'm waiting for the verdict on this before I do anything, so hopefully there is a response soon. Other than that, I have some US-05 on deck.

 

[Rover]

You can tell right away if it's bad or not when you rehydrate it. I would just check and see, and if it's bad save the pack. If Danstar does the right thing, they will replace it.

If the pack is good....Make some good beer

 

[BorisLobb]

Just thought I'd post some more anecdotal evidence regarding this yeast.
Used the same lot #, same expiry everyone else is reporting in a 5 gallon 1.04 OG all grain pale ale recipe. Got the packets at Niagara Traditions store in Buffalo. Pitched with 2 rehydrated packets of this stuff. I opened the packets and they both smelled funky (kind of sulfury, rubbery). The yeast sank to the bottom (just like others are reporting). Pitched on sunday evening, and it took about 18 hours until the airlock started bubbling (slow bubbles though). I'm going to wait another day and then I'll take a hydrometer readingif the bubbles stop. I'll let you all know how it tastes.

 

[JuanMoore]

You can tell right away if it's bad or not when you rehydrate it. I would just check and see, and if it's bad save the pack. If Danstar does the right thing, they will replace it.

If the pack is good....Make some good beer

+1. Even if Danstar doesn't replace them, Notty is so cheap that I'd continue to use it even if I had to toss a pack every now and then.

 

[SwampassJ]

Anyone else disturbed by people not caring if it's bad because it's cheap? If this was a brew store giving a less than ideal crush to coax another lb of two or base malt out of a batch you would all go somewhere else.

 

[BobBailey]

Anyone else disturbed by people not caring if it's bad because it's cheap? If this was a brew store giving a less than ideal crush to coax another lb of two or base malt out of a batch you would all go somewhere else.

The big difference is that we are making a decision knowing the facts and not getting any surprizes.

 

[Rover]

Anyone else disturbed by people not caring if it's bad because it's cheap? If this was a brew store giving a less than ideal crush to coax another lb of two or base malt out of a batch you would all go somewhere else.

It's not that I don't care.

It's just that...what else can I do? I have emailed Danstar with no response and I have four packs left of this lot. Chances are is that I have some good yeast out of the four. It's not like I'm going to stop making beer because I had a bad experience with Notty. When the packs are gone I won't buy it again till this gets worked out (I hope it does). Worst case scenario, I have a bunch of US-05 ready to pitch.

 

[SwampassJ]

It's not that I don't care.

It's just that...what else can I do? I have emailed Danstar with no response and I have four packs left of this lot. Chances are is that I have some good yeast out of the four. It's not like I'm going to stop making beer because I had a bad experience with Notty. When the packs are gone I won't buy it again till this gets worked out (I hope it does). Worst case scenario, I have a bunch of US-05 ready to pitch.

That was my point. You've obviously gone out of your way to let them and us know it's screwed up and obviously being sane don't want to continue to support them until it is fixed. On the other hand there are a lot of people in this thread who have no issue with them selling inferior products just because it's cheap.

 

[smizak]

If everyone who uses Nottingham dry yeast will just start "proofing" thier yeast prior to pitching, I think we can solve this problem. I have not totally given up on Nottingham yeast, but I will never again just throw it in the fermenter and assume it's good...

I didn't even need to go that far. I could tell both packets I had were bad because the yeast wouldn't hydrate. Were talking 45min-1hr in 90F water. I bought some US-05 on the way home from work the next day before I even looked in the fermenter because I knew it wouldn't be fermenting when I got home.

Why bother? I don't understand the loyalty. They're obviously selling a defective product. Is it "solving" the problem by buying even more of their crap and hoping at least some of it works? People need to not buy it at all so Danstar/Lallemand can get their **** together and figure out how they ruined their own previously successful product.

 

[Rover]

Why bother? I don't understand the loyalty. They're obviously selling a defective product. Is it "solving" the problem by buying even more of their crap and hoping at least some of it works? People need to not buy it at all so Danstar/Lallemand can get their **** together and figure out how they ruined their own previously successful product.

+1
I'm not buying any more of it, I'm just hoping that out of the four packs I have left, I have one that works. I just feel sorry for all the new brewers that have no idea that there's a problem and get turned off to brewing because of some $hitty yeast.

 

[mullenite]

I'll continue buying it because I like Nottingham and getting the liquid form locally can be hit or miss.

 

[dwarven_stout]

I pitched a sachel from the "bad lot" at 8 this morning into a batch of well-aerated 1.054 OG brown ale. When I got home 13 hours later, the batch was at full krausen (at 62 degrees, no less!).

 

[Rover]

Awsome!

 

[RavenChief]

+1
I'm not buying any more of it, I'm just hoping that out of the four packs I have left, I have one that works. I just feel sorry for all the new brewers that have no idea that there's a problem and get turned off to brewing because of some $hitty yeast.

Rover, I agree with you. The worst part about this problem is that new folks may get turned off to home brewing because of the problem. Also, buying extra packs of yeast from Danstar just rewards the company for not fixing their problem...

 

[Olddog]

I pitched a pack of this into a stout (OG 1.070) on 9/3 and didn't see any sign of activity until 9/6 and even then it was just a thin layer of stuff on the surface. I took a hydo sample yesterday and it was 1.031. Does that sound about right?

My target gravity is 1.014 so it still has another week or so anyway but I figured it would be lower than that.

 

[SwampassJ]

I pitched a sachel from the "bad lot" at 8 this morning into a batch of well-aerated 1.054 OG brown ale. When I got home 13 hours later, the batch was at full krausen (at 62 degrees, no less!).

Remember folks, if you want a successful fermentation with nottingham you must quote the bad lots to form a protective barrier that Danstar forgot to add, like so "bad lot".

 

[Rover]

AHHH, that's the trick. I knew I was doing something wrong!

 

[BobJones]

After 24 hours and no bubbles, I typed “Problems with Danstar Nottingham” into Google and this thread popped up.
I have brewed 10 batches of beer under identical conditions and this is the first batch that did not have vigorous airlock bubbles the next morning. This is the first time I have used Danstar.
So I went out to my trash can, dug around and located the Danstar package, scraped off the retail sticker and inspected the lot. 1080961099V. Exp 12 2011.
Quick fermentation starts are important to me as I believe they reduce the chance of infection and unwanted organism taking over the batch.
I immediately sprinkled package of Safale S-04. I will allow the yeast to set on top for 30 minutes and then I will shake vigorously. Bet she is bubbling like mad by nights end.
I was looking forward to this batch. 6lbs light, lme and 2 lbs dark, dme. 1OZ of Fuggles at 60 and 1OZ of Fuggles at 10 minutes.
The Safale04 should be decent substitute and retain the English Ale theme I was looking for.
BTW,
The airlock was tight as it had pulled a vacuum due to cooling. The original pitch temp was about 73F and the room temp is about 65F. Don’t blame this on an air leak or on any other factor.
Certainly this yeast may have taken off within 48 hours but waiting 2 days is not my style.
Cheers!

 

[Rover]

Welcome to the club, Now get ready for people to dismiss your technique. you did the right thing.

 

[smizak]

Welcome to the club, Now get ready for people to dismiss your technique. you did the right thing.

Oh snap!

 

[BobJones]

6 hours after repitching with safale s-04 there were some bubbles in airlock. This morning, she is going crazy. Both the Danstar and Safale were shipped together from California so I cannot blame it on the shipping. The Danstar got off to a very slow start (no bubbles or foam after 30 hours) and I was not about to wait around and see if it ever got it in gear.

Safale has worked for me every time. Wyeast smack packs are great but a little spendy.

 

[Teacher]

Not to be argumentative, but it could just as easily have been the Notty that was taking off.

 

[robertbartsch]

Has anyone heard back from the manufacturor?

Someone should consider sending them a link to this thread so they could read it. If I owned the company, I would want to know what people are reporting to others about my product.

I would gladly post the link in an e-mail to the manufacturor but I have not used any Notty from this lot yet. Someone that has had issues should do this, I suppose.

 

[Rover]

Has anyone heard back from the manufacturor?

Someone should consider sending them a link to this thread so they could read it. If I owned the company, I would want to know what people are reporting to others about my product.

I would gladly post the link in an e-mail to the manufacturor but I have not used any Notty from this lot yet. Someone that has had issues should do this, I suppose.

\Yeah, you don't really need to. I sent an email with this thread, the thread with the experiment, my experience with detailed brewing process.

Still no reply

 

[DryHeave]

I'm sure glad I seen this thread before I used 2 packs of Notty with the lot# in question. One of them has no air in it, as though it was improperly packaged. The other has a small amount of air as usual.

When I first started reading this thread, I first thought I'd make a starter to be sure, but now I'm having second thoughts about using it at all. I intended to use Notty (for it's dry finish) on 10 gallons of an English IPA I have planned, but I don't want to take the chance. I want a dry finish so I guess I'll have to mash at lower temps and use US-05 or WLP001 or put off this recipe until I can get some WLP013. My LHBS is 40miles away...

 

[Rover]

If you're used to the way Notty should act and you rehydrate, you will know right away if it's bad or not. Just make sure you have a backup.

 

[Brewham]

My LHBS has a whole bin full of the suspect lot. I can't bring myself to buy one and I don't know how to break the bad news to them. What to do?

 

[DryHeave]

If you're used to the way Notty should act and you rehydrate, you will know right away if it's bad or not. Just make sure you have a backup.

That's the problem, I don't want to paint myself into a corner on brew day. If the Notty is questionable come brew day, I'd have to know before I mash. I could pitch a backup (I have WLP001, WLP008, US004, US05, or Danstar Windsor) but I don't think any of them will give the dry finish I'm after unless I lower my mash temp to 146-148 instead of the planned 152. Or add some corn sugar, but I'd rather not do that. It's an English IPA so the dry finish is pretty important to me... So, I kind of have to know before hand.

 

[smizak]

If you're used to the way Notty should act and you rehydrate, you will know right away if it's bad or not. Just make sure you have a backup.

+1,000,000

I absolutely knew that the packs of Notty I had wouldn't ferment. I just sat in the warm water like grains of rice.

I also knew it was the US-05 I re-pitched with that was fermenting. The Nottingham wasn't even in suspension after 24 hrs in the wort. You could read a newspaper through the carboy, usually during the growth phase of yeast, just before airlock activity, the wort looks like orange juice because of all the yeast reproducing and in suspension.