Need Help Understanding my latest bottle bombs

[Paniller]

Well, I thought my bottle bombs were in my past. But my latest batch is all bombers. Maybe you guys can help.

My first bottle bombers were an amber, from a dry yeast packet. I noted that the yeast cake and movement took a while to settle, and the beer never fully cleared as usual. After they started exploding, I realized the problem was likely old yeast. It seems to have gone quiet and played dead, leaving unfermented sugars behind that later caused the bottle bombs.

My batches inbetween have been hit or miss. I've tried following the northern brewer priming charts, but every batch is either too carbonated or undercarbonated. I can't find any pattern to what I'm doing wrong. My thought was that the priming sugar did not dissolve uniformly. Though it seems more a batch to batch problem than bottle to bottle problem.

The latest 2 batches were different. I got tired of inconsistent carbonation and the risk of bombs, so I went back to my old school Mr.Beer carbonating measures. 0.75 teaspoon per 16 ounce standard bottle (or is it 12oz). The apple cider wheat hybrid I made is carbonated just fine. But, all the belgian tripples are explosive. Any thoughts of went went wrong?

-Sanitation should have been fine. Every bottle was rinsed twice, then a third time with solution
-The beer was aged a month in a secondary, then another 2 months in third carboy. I'd imagine the fermentation was complete (no OG or FG readings, sorry)
-The yeast was quality vial yeast, though reused from a previous batch 3 months ago.
- There is noticeable sediment on the bottom. Strange for something that was separated from any cake 3 distinct times.


I'm assuming this is just a calculation problem due to different beer styles having different thickness, and thus requiring different priming sugar levels. But shouldn't the calculators be accurate? And the same exact level of priming sugar explode a bottle with one style, and undercarbonate another?

 

[thadass]

You really should know your OG and FG, especially for identifying a bottle bomb issue. Consistent measurement of gravity with the date is going to be key to identify what could be happening here.

You list the time in secondary and thirdary, but leave out the most important one. How long was it in primary? (And how long do you leave them in primary on average?) If you do have the records somewhere, what were the gravity readings at each transfer?

The only real way that exact measured and evenly-mixed priming additions could create different results in different batches is if there was an inconsistency in fermentable sugars prior to priming. This means you are probably under-fermenting (primary fermentation) batches.

If it's not that, though, I dunno. Exploding beer and gushers is a waste and kind of depressing, but accurate measurements are required in my opinion to know what is happening.

 

[WissaBrewGuy]

If it's not that, though, I dunno. Exploding beer and gushers is a waste and kind of depressing, but accurate measurements are required in my opinion to know what is happening.

It is and I am sorry this is happening to you but I must say, the less-than-$20 investment in a hydrometer and measure tube is really worth saving the beer. I agree with the above post that primary is the most important time period for your beer and you may be racking the beer off of the yeast too early. I would like to point something else out, tertiary fermentation is a complete waste of your time, so is more than 2 weeks in secondary (many people would say any time in secondary is a waste!). If you can, try cold crashing your beer by sticking it in a refrigerator or equally cold area (attic, garage in the winter just take temp reading to be sure its not freezing) this will clear up your beer. The only reason for these secondary periods is to clarify your beer and there are quicker and easier ways to do it. Unfortunately since you haven't taken any gravity readings along your beers journey I (and probably everyone else here) will not be able to say for sure what the issue is.

 

[WissaBrewGuy]

To answer your more general questions about consistency:

1. Carbonation has nothing to do with the thickness of the beer as the thickness comes from unfermentable sugars (ideally unless you have unfermented fermentable sugars still left) and will not affect carb levels.

2. The calculators are accurate to a good degree. You see, there is CO2 already dissolved in the beer even when it is uncarbed. If you are aiming for say 2.5Vol CO2 in your beer and you already have 0.1Vol dissolved then you only need to add enough sugar to ideally get 2.4Vol. (0.1Vol (dissolved) + 2.4Vol (added from priming sugar) = 2.5Vol total). The calculators all know this issue but as usual, the dissolved CO2 in a beer is different batch to batch so the calculators take and average number and work with it. The inaccuracies will not be enough to over carb some and under carb others but it is still worth pointing out.

3. Unless you are filtering with a 2micron filter you are going to have yeast left in your beer but the question is: how much? The consistent way to ensure you have enough yeast in each bottle to eat the priming sugar is to add more yeast at bottle time. I, along with many pro breweries, use champagne yeast but you could also use the yeast originally used for your beer. This will guarantee that there is enough yeast to eat the sugar you add to the beer. Just to be clear, yeast won't overcarb the beer as they will only stay awake until they run out of food; however, not enough yeast could undercarb the beer as there are not enough critters to eat all of the food you gave them; they will eat it eventually but it could take months.

 

[Paniller]

You really should know your OG and FG, especially for identifying a bottle bomb issue. Consistent measurement of gravity with the date is going to be key to identify what could be happening here.

I actually have the tools to measure OG and FG. I just never use them because it seems like a lot of extra work. I'll start using them to see if I can find the problem. I assumed it was an unnecessary step, as the beer tells me when it's done fermenting when it clears and the yeast drop to the bottom.

You list the time in secondary and thirdary, but leave out the most important one. How long was it in primary? (And how long do you leave them in primary on average?)

As for the primary, I'd say it was in there for 3 weeks. I basically leave it in there until the activity stops, and the yeast flocculates(correct term?) to the bottom. Once everything settles and the beer clears, I move to a secondary or bottling bucket depending on how much cake and clarification I need. I go right to the bottling bucket for basic brews, and only use the secondary for clarification if there's a ton of pulp/cake such as a fruit brew. In this case, I wanted to try to get it as clear as possible and bulk age it, because it was an expensive triple that I wanted to get perfect.

I would like to point something else out, tertiary fermentation is a complete waste of your time, so is more than 2 weeks in secondary (many people would say any time in secondary is a waste!).

I never really do tertiary either. What I meant by tertiary is basically my bottling bucket. I have a few old Mr.Beer containers that I changed the spout on, and use them as bottling buckets. In this case, it was in there for months because I was busy and forgot about it. Typically I just give it overnight for any transfered sediment from the primary to settle below the spout so it pours clear.

I agree with the above post that primary is the most important time period for your beer and you may be racking the beer off of the yeast too early.

This may have been the problem. I may not have given it enough time in the primary, assuming that the time spent in the secondary is the same thing. My thought is that any leftover sugars from the primary would get consumed in the secondary anyway. But maybe there wasn't enough yeast population transfered to consume them. As thus, maybe it took until after bottling for the yeast population to grow large enough to finish those sugars, which could explain the sediment after so many months of sitting there.

If you can, try cold crashing your beer by sticking it in a refrigerator or equally cold area

Point taken. I'll start doing this. I notice a lot of sediment still sneaks by during bottling, but always shows up in the fridge. I was trying to make a fancy "show beer" this time, so did all the secondary and bulk aging. But it looks like cold crashing is still the best.

The consistent way to ensure you have enough yeast in each bottle to eat the priming sugar is to add more yeast at bottle time. I, along with many pro breweries, use champagne yeast but you could also use the yeast originally used for your beer. This will guarantee that there is enough yeast to eat the sugar you add to the beer.

I didn't think that would matter. I thought it would just take longer, worst case scenario. Won't the yeast just multiply and eat until all resources are gone (like humans).

 

[WissaBrewGuy]

Yeah this is a correct statement; the yeast will multiply and eventually eat all of the sugar. This is what I wrote in my very lengthy (I don't blame you for not making it to the end) assessment earlier.

Just to be clear, yeast won't overcarb the beer as they will only stay awake until they run out of food; however, not enough yeast could undercarb the beer as there are not enough critters to eat all of the food you gave them; they will eat it eventually but it could take months.

 

[Paniller]

Overall, I'm leaning towards too little time in the primary.

My theory:
1)There's heavy yeast action, a feeding frenzy
2)I see the action settles down and things get quiet.
3)I bottle
4)Things look quiet, but only when compared to the peak activity. Sugar is still left
5)Said sugar is in the bottle, plus priming sugar
6) Overcarbonation

It's like bottling the zombie apocolypse, where yeast are zombies and people are sugar. Sure, the main herd of zombies finished their feeding frenzy and fell asleep. Everything looks quiet. But, there are still survivors. Survivors like Rick. You don't bottle Rick

 

[Paniller]

Yeah this is a correct statement; the yeast will multiply and eventually eat all of the sugar. This is what I wrote in my very lengthy (I don't blame you for not making it to the end) assessment earlier.

Oh crap. My bad. Apparently I read it all except the very last line.

Either way, I think it's time to start using my hydrometer float thing again. The pain of using it is minimal compared to the embarassment and loss from overcarbonated beer.

 

[WissaBrewGuy]

Yeah that is a good idea. SPOILER: It looked as though the governor was going to bottle rick. Yeah, that didn't end too well for him. I love how everyone in that picture that you can make out is now dead.

 

[WissaBrewGuy]

Yeah that is probably a good idea. SPOILER: The governor tried to bottle Rick, yeah that didn't end well for him. I love how everyone except Rick that you can make out in this picture is now dead.

 

[MaltyHops]

i agree with the above post that primary is the most important time period for your beer and you may be racking the beer off of the yeast too early.

... as for the primary, i'd say it was in there for 3 weeks. I basically leave it in there until the activity stops, and the yeast flocculates(correct term?) to the bottom. Once everything settles and the beer clears, i move to a secondary or bottling bucket depending on how much cake and clarification i need.

If things were going "normally", 3 weeks should be more than enough time for a ferment to finish and clear up a beer (assuming an ale) so perhaps you have stalled ferments. In this case, you could perform a fast ferment test like THIS one - or a more thorough description is Braukaiser's Fast Ferment Test.

It goes without saying that you need to take gravity readings - it's the most reliable way to determine what stage of fermentation your beer is at - yeast can still be fermenting with little obvious signs like bubbling.

You need to be aware of the expected attenuation capability of the yeast you are using so that starting with an original SG (OG), an estimated final SG (FG) can be determined and your beer should get within a point of two of it.

Also there are some English ale yeasts that have a tendency slow down and almost stop but continue very slowly so if bottled when it looks like it has finished fermenting, the yeast will continue fermenting in the bottle over many months.

 

[kh54s10]

Three essentials for avoiding bottle bombs:

1) take the gravity readings so that you KNOW fermentation has finished.
2) allow enough time for the fermentation to finish.
3) get a scale and weigh out your priming sugar. It is a LOT more accurate than measuring by volume.