My ciders with commercial yeasts are boring . . . Time to go wild. Thoughts?

[Ted123]

I've made a few ciders, and they all seemed dull next to my Saisons and whatnot where I've used Brett and sometimes Lacto/Pedio as well . .. Maybe these ciders were boring, because they had Campden Tablets prior to pitching the commercial yeast.
BUT, the most interesting cider I've made was with the Wyeast Lambic blend . . . So that got some Brett notes, but very little tart.

I wanna let 'er rip . . . Go run naked in the surf!

I've been digging around on the web, and there is VERY very little on "wild" ciders . . . Mostly saying don't do it, or I'll get vinegar, etc.
BUT, I hear tell there's all sorts of naturally fermented ciders in Spain (Basque?) and France.

So, I'm wondering what kind of steps I can take to "control" the bucking bronco in the Rodeo of my wild ferment . . . Maybe keeping the temp cool (65?) to inhibit bacteria so the yeast can get a head start? Maybe only using half the recommended Campden tabs (1 tablet per 2 gallons?) so maybe only the worst of the bad guys are hindered?
I'm picking all sorts of varieties of apples from the trees around me in Sonoma County, CA.

Other strategies?

 

[brwagur]

One thing I've been thinking about doing with my next batch of cider is adding a small amount of brett with my regular yeast. Maybe some Orval dregs (because I'm only doing a gallon batch and a bottle of Orval is cheaper than a vial of B. brux). I also have a cider fermenting with some saison yeast and a wide variety of bugs/dregs, but it's only been going for a few weeks now.

 

[youreanimpulse]

I'm doing a saison yeast cider (WLP565) which I'm pretty happy with so far. After kegging I'll have a gallon left. Probably going to try some Brett, maybe throw some of the yeast cake in there for Brett food. I'm thinking Brett L.

 

[user 141939]

There is a place in Maine (UFF) http://www.urbanfarmfermentory.com/.

They make the spontaneously fermented farmhouse ciders like the ones from France. They are wonderful. I think the yeast from the apples is the kind of yeast you want anyways. I have no iea about temps or anything. You might be able to contact them and have them help you out a bit... They are all very cool over there.

 

[Osedax]

Wild ciders are the way to go in my opinion. I made an all brett clausenii one that was amazing.

Right now I have one that is fermenting using wild yeast cultivated off of a dwarf lime, White Labs brett c, White Labs Belgian Sour 1, and Nottingham (I think). Can't wait for that one. I had a lot of leftover cultures.

Vinegar shouldn't be a problem as long as you keep oxygen exposure low. A lot of Spanish ciders have a hint of pickle or vinegar anyway. Go for it and see what happens!

Start small if you are worried. Cider is cheaper than beer to make most of the time. At least it is in Pennsylvania.

 

[brwagur]

Any thoughts on making a gallon of perry and fermenting it slow and cold using only the dregs from a bottle of Orval? I recently discovered that my grocery store has organic pear juice but I'm also cheap and my LHBS has a poor selection of bugs anyway.

Or would it be better to splurge and go all brett? What brett strain gives the best "earthy" or "musty" flavors?

 

[hirschb]

I found this post incredibly helpful:
http://www.funkfactorygeuzeria.com/2013/06/cider-fermentation-panel-bottling.html
I'm planning on doing 6 1gal batches on different brett strain(s) in a month or so. I only wish I could get good cider (like from a mill) in Florida!

 

[TopherM]

One of the best ciders I've ever tasted, which I judged in a BJCP competition, was a cider made with Brett that was aged in a French Oak Bourbon barrel. It scored a 46 in first round, won the cider category, and finished 4th for best in show.

 

[Max_Chavez]

How about making 3-4 1gal batches spontaneously fermented, then using the dregs/cake of your favorites to start larger batches?
I pitched Spanish sidra dregs into a batch recently, along with a little brett.