Might throw in the towel

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Jrblessing1

Jrblessing1

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Brewed 2 mr beer kits and brewed 2 partial mash kits. Not impressed almost same flavor which don't taste like beers I like
 
Pale ales and IPA. Screwed up on my first partial mash brew. Learned from my mistakes. Similar off taste in both partial mash brews
 
On the second one I used a wirflock tablet and liquid yeast. Both fermented 3 weeks @ 72 degrees
 
Any chance you can try out a BIAB?

Honestly, with any extracts I have used, they tend to come out darker, and sweeter than I would like. I made a Black IPA that tasted like cola...smh. With BIAB, I have had much better looking and tasting beer, and the jump from extract or partial mash isn't huge, but IMO the improvement in the end result is.

When you say the taste isn't what you like...what about is is off?
 
On top of what ozarks said. My $30 mini CL fridge and $15 controller made the biggest change in my brewing. The other thing that really helped was going ghetto all grain, its a small cooler undersized pot (i have to watch non stop for boil overs) ....It got rid of that burnt extract taste, which I do not care for but seem to achieve with great success even with a late addition lol. I'm not knocking extract, I just couldn't pull it off.
 
I will admit Im a 20 gallon 3 pot herms all grain brewer "but" Ive been brewing a light beer in a cheap 5 gallon pot with extracts for months and its fantastic, Ive brewed it 3 times this spring and summer but Ive been where you are and overcome what your going through so I kind of I know what im doing, your best bet is to find someone in your area to buddy up with and experiment, the first mistake people make is trying exotic beers right off the bat, you have to first learn to make the same mild beer twice then move the the next level a little at a time
 
I thought about BIAB I'd have to upgrade to a bigger pot and get a Burner bout I'm afraid to spend more money at this time
 
I'm guessing those beers are chock full of suspended yeast, which might be the off flavor (but of course there's a lot of those). My beers are always a LOT clearer than that. I HATE the taste of yeast - I don't even drink hefeweisens and styles of beer that feature the yeast.

How to get rid of the yeast? Easy - crash-cool your fermentor in a fridge, and add gelatin when you do. Lots more on that subject around here. That will clear the beer pretty quickly.
 
Jrblessing1 said:
I thought about BIAB I'd have to upgrade to a bigger pot and get a Burner bout I'm afraid to spend more money at this time
Click to expand...

I tried brewing many times with extract, with various different techniques and methods. I managed to make some really good beer, but it wasn't quite close to what I wanted. I was about ready to give up (for a second time) until I decided to give BIAB a shot. I'm still pissed at myself for not trying it sooner. I finally got what I was looking for.

You don't have to start with large batches, try a small batch and see if you like the results. I started with 1 gallon batches! You can use the Mr Beer fermentor and chances are you have a pot large enough to try.

Good luck!
 
Jrblessing1 said:
On the second one I used a wirflock tablet and liquid yeast. Both fermented 3 weeks @ 72 degrees
Click to expand...

That's too warm. How did you measure the temp? Ambient? Or temp of the actual wort?

If the ambient temp was 72 degrees, your wort was probably 5-10 degrees warmer. Yeast is exothermic, i.e., makes heat, and a too-warm fermentation is not a recipe for a good beer.

There are ways to control fermentation temps, from a higher level like using a refrigerator and heat belt using a controller like an Inkbird, to a swamp cooler chilled either by pure evaporation or helped along w/ frozen water bottles.

I think you'd also benefit from a better kit and/or better recipe.

************

Most of my beers (except lagers) are fermented about 64 degrees; that's a controlled 64 degrees in a fermentation chamber, i.e., it's the wort that's 64 degrees, not the ambient temperature. Your beer may well be fermenting at 75 or 78 or even higher.
 
See if there is a homebrew club in your area. More than likely, there are people on this board near you and brew often. Ive found home brewers love to help out and also show off their stuff. This is a great way to learn and also get involved in brewing really great beer. Hold onto the towel for now, listen to other users advice here and don't give up.
 
Assuming the grist supplied with the kit wasn't in error from the jump, I don't think even scorched LME would explain that "white ipa".
Oxidation, otoh, would...
 
Just to second what mongoose said, you probably will not like the beer unless you can keep fermenting temps in the 60s; and the swamp cooler is as easy as sitting the fermenting bucket in a larger container (like a plastic tote) of water.
 
I had the same experience with my first 5 beers. They were all extremely similar even though they were partial mashes of different styles. I have gone on to brew probably another 10 batches and am glad I stuck with it. As the others have stated above, fermentation temps are important and 72 seems a little high. Ferm temps aside, I went brew in a bag (BIAB) for my 6th batch and won't go back to extract. I know many on this forum make great beers with extract so YMMV. If your willing to try BIAB, I suggest a 1 gal batch. Your costs will be low and you may be able to do that in the kettle you already have. Good luck :mug:
 
Sansnom said:
You don't have to start with large batches, try a small batch and see if you like the results. I started with 1 gallon batches! You can use the Mr Beer fermentor and chances are you have a pot large enough to try.
Click to expand...

+1 to this idea. Buy a cheap BIAB bag, brew in the biggest pot that you have, whatever size that happens to be. Target a batch size roughly 50-70% the size of your pot. So if your pot is 3 gallons, you are good for 1.5 - 2 gallon batches (the amount that goes in the fermentor). To scale a recipe you can take a 5 gallon recipe and divide it by your batch size accordingly. You do not need any other special equipment that you don't already have so your risks are minimal. Plus ingredient costs for AG small batches are minimal.

I really recommend sticking with this - it does not take most people long to be making beer that is as good or better than what you get from the shop. But I don't think anyone makes commercial quality beer on batch 1 and 2, especially if you normally drink nice IPAs. For me it was a bit easier as I was drinking the cheapest commercial lagers available.

Hang around here, ask questions, or find a brew club where you can sit in on a brewday. It's a really worthwhile hobby once you get past the fairly heavy learning curve.
 
Mary is right get control of fermentation temperature. Use a swamp cooler it is cheap and simple you are looking for 65 more or less. The temperature can vary 2degrees and not greatly affect the flavor. After you have done this then considerable grain ECT.:D
 
Are you adding the extract at the beginning of the boil? That will darken it and make it taste nasty.

What liquid yeast was it? 72 degrees is probably too warm for most yeast.
 
Don't want to be that guy that skims through the posts and says read a book, BUT if you haven't already I highly recommend getting the new edition of How to Brew, I don't own a copy but i have read the online version and it doesn't stay updated, I personally want to get the latest edition because i have been Biab'ing for four years and i want to read John Palmer's section on it plus there is always something new to learn

Good luck and listen to the advice on here HBT has improved my beer big time [emoji482]
 
Jrblessing1 said:
White labs California ale 001
Click to expand...

I just finished a batch if blonde ale with this yeast. This yeast is a very good attenuator that works well if you keep your temps constant.
I don't put my glass carboy in a temperature-controlled chamber - I don't have a small refrigerator to use yet, so it's seasonal brewing at ambient for now. It's been unseasonably cool so far in Jersey and that's how I've managed to get away with doing one last spring brew before summer hits.
The carboy sat in my bedroom over the course of three weeks and temps never got above 70F until the last couple of days before bottling ... helpful, actually.
The WLP001 did a good job. No off flavors and the 1.046 wort ended up around 1.004, right on the money.

Don't give up, just adjust your game.
My extracts were OK, the partial mashes better. The first all grain beat both methods. My means dictate my methods, but that doesn't mean I let that control my brewing.
 
triethylborane said:
See if there is a homebrew club in your area. More than likely, there are people on this board near you and brew often. Ive found home brewers love to help out and also show off their stuff. This is a great way to learn and also get involved in brewing really great beer. Hold onto the towel for now, listen to other users advice here and don't give up.
Click to expand...

If you can find a home brew club in your area attend a meeting and meet the group. Most of them (if not all) will be more than willing to help out. Bring a beer or two and ask them for their feedback and what they would do. Here we can only make suggestions on what you tell us, but when you have feedback from others who taste it, that feedback is invaluable.

The AHA has a portal that allows you to lookup home brew clubs in your area. https://www.homebrewersassociation.org/community/clubs/find-a-homebrew-club/ Also, if you can join a group brew day or brew with some other brewers who have been brewing longer than you, they could help out, offer suggestions, etc... Hell, if you were in western NY I would say come brew with me some day or join our brew club for this month's meeting. Don't give up after a few batches, keep at it a little more.

Look into a "Swamp Cooler" to help maintain fermentation temps. You may have all that is needed to setup a swamp cooler. Google it or search it out on here and see how well it works.

Regarding BIAB you can do it cheap at first. Use a paint strainer bag and try a small BIAB batch with your current setup. You could get about 2 (+/-) gallons into your Mr. Beer fermenter. During the winter months I sometimes do a small BIAB batch on my stove inside. Here I use my old turkey fryer kettle and a 5-gallon paint strainer bag. Heck, I still use my old Mr. Beer fermenter when I do small batches or split larger batches.

Since you tried a Pale Ale and an IPA (I believe I remember that correctly from the OP's original post) try this recipe from Northern Brewer for their 3 gallon BIAB recipe. http://www.northernbrewer.com/documentation/allgrain/BIAB-AG-DeadRinger.pdf NOTE: I'm not advocating for Northern Brewer (AKA AB Inbev) but for a newer brewer this would be a good recipe to try your hands at for BIAB. You can print it out and get all the ingredients from your LHBS. You could probably scale it down a little if you needed/wanted to.

Anyways, I will stop the rambling but seriously see if you can find a local brew club and join them some night. They can be some of the nicest people you meet who want to share and help others who share the desire to brew. Cheers!
 
One of my friends made a Kolsch that looked just like that White IPA. His mistake was adding the extract while it was still on the flame. If the extract isn't mixed in really well, it will caramelize on the bottom of your pot.
 
Sorry man. It sucks when you don't like a batch - and even more so when it's your first two batches. And then a bunch of helpful folks come in with "temperature control" and "BIAB" and a bunch of other stuff and it just gets so confusing! And then it's throwing money at a hobby that you are already thinking of getting out of!

Let it sit for a couple of weeks. My first batch was a hefe that was all banana and minimal carbonation after 3 weeks in the bottle. Now that it's two months in the bottle, it has gotten a lot nicer.

Finding a homebrew club is a great suggestion - and ask to brew with someone - to me beer is learning by doing. All-grain seems complicated but after doing a demo class at my LHBS, it is not nearly as complicated as it sounds. And that's pretty much everything in brewing.

I am still a novice - my fourth batch is fermenting right now - so it can get confusing and weird. I still don't know what half the acronyms mean. But the hobby can be very rewarding if you stick with it and have some friends to share it with.
 
passedpawn said:
I'm guessing those beers are chock full of suspended yeast, which might be the off flavor (but of course there's a lot of those). My beers are always a LOT clearer than that. I HATE the taste of yeast - I don't even drink hefeweisens and styles of beer that feature the yeast.

How to get rid of the yeast? Easy - crash-cool your fermentor in a fridge, and add gelatin when you do. Lots more on that subject around here. That will clear the beer pretty quickly.
Click to expand...

While cold crashing and such might help, i've had no issues with my beers without any gelatin or cold crashing.

my guess is temperature control issues, maybe some oxidation.

here is a pilsner I did recently without anything more than basic swampcooler and then storing bottles in the cellar for a week or 2.

pils.jpg
 
Jrblessing1 said:
On the second one I used a wirflock tablet and liquid yeast. Both fermented 3 weeks @ 72 degrees
Click to expand...


72° seems a bit high especially considering the temp in your fermentor was likely higher.
If you can manage to keep the fermentor at 66°-68°
I think you'll improve your outcomes.
 
IMO, going to BIAB might get you from good beer to great beer, but it won't get you from problem beer to good beer. Seems to me that some other improvements would be more likely to help:
Water - treat with campden for chlorine if necessary
Fermentation temperature
Oxidation
Yeast health - maybe aerate after pitching
Possible chill haze - try Irish Moss in the boil
Other - depending on what the off flavor is?
 
You are getting lots of good information here albeit a whole bunch of ideas and thoughts to absorb at one time. Typically new brewers are busting a gut to pop a cap and sample that first beer...which usually sucks because it is way too early to drink. Some beers are probably more forgiving young, but the beers you show likely need some additional conditioning time.

Like one poster said, just let it lay a bit and go back to one of those beers later and note the improvements. Extract is unlikely to give you commercial quality results so set your expectations realistically. Keep plugging away, learn by reading and researching, and most of all, be patient as beer cant be rushed w/o quality losses.

Even experienced brewers forget the rule of time and conditioning equals good beer. I made a Cream Ale just a few weeks ago. I kegged it and sampled with a picnic tap about a week into the conditioning phase. It had an odd sharp edge and I thought I'll be dumping this beer soon. Lo and behold, 3 weeks later it is smooth and mellow and a lovely Cream Ale. Just a bit of time did the trick.
 
Another thing from personal experience with extract, check the freshness/expiry.

One of my first batches with extract was given to me by the person I bought my kit off of when they got out of the hobby and it ended up being nearly 1.5yrs expired. Gave it a much darker colour and a relatively strong molasses taste.
 
Morrey said:
You are getting lots of good information here albeit a whole bunch of ideas and thoughts to absorb at one time. Typically new brewers are busting a gut to pop a cap and sample that first beer...which usually sucks because it is way too early to drink. Some beers are probably more forgiving young, but the beers you show likely need some additional conditioning time.

Like one poster said, just let it lay a bit and go back to one of those beers later and note the improvements. Extract is unlikely to give you commercial quality results so set your expectations realistically. Keep plugging away, learn by reading and researching, and most of all, be patient as beer cant be rushed w/o quality losses.

Even experienced brewers forget the rule of time and conditioning equals good beer. I made a Cream Ale just a few weeks ago. I kegged it and sampled with a picnic tap about a week into the conditioning phase. It had an odd sharp edge and I thought I'll be dumping this beer soon. Lo and behold, 3 weeks later it is smooth and mellow and a lovely Cream Ale. Just a bit of time did the trick.
Click to expand...

And of course, there are always people saying, "I go grain to glass in 10 days." I believe them, but in my experience, my beer might be drinkable, but not good. Last year, I had a pale ale that I fermented for (I think) 10 days then kegged. I tried to speed up the carbonation so it would be done in a week. It was carbonated (too much), and it tasted pretty gross. Like beer, only not good beer.

After a few more weeks, I got the carbonation under control and it mellowed out. So it ended up not saving any time.
 
I agree with @ericbw and @Morrey about letting the beer condition some. My latest batch was a NE IPA and it needed another week before it started to be a good beer. It was the fastest grain to glass (3 weeks). The beer was undrinkable IMHO. A week later I had my brew club meeting and was anxious to find out what was wrong with the beer. When I shared it with the group and took my first taste since the first time a week earlier, it was a completely different beer. It turned out to be a pretty good beer. No problems except it was a little too bitter for a NE IPA. It's been a hit with other friends too, but wow what a change in just a week. I will say another week later it was even better I thought and tastes great now.

So yes some additional conditioning time can make a big difference too! I'm glad you decided not to throw the towel in so fast! Cheers! :mug:
 
pshankstar said:
I agree with @ericbw and @Morrey about letting the beer condition some. My latest batch was a NE IPA and it needed another week before it started to be a good beer. It was the fastest grain to glass (3 weeks). The beer was undrinkable IMHO. A week later I had my brew club meeting and was anxious to find out what was wrong with the beer. When I shared it with the group and took my first taste since the first time a week earlier, it was a completely different beer. It turned out to be a pretty good beer. No problems except it was a little too bitter for a NE IPA. It's been a hit with other friends too, but wow what a change in just a week. I will say another week later it was even better I thought and tastes great now.

So yes some additional conditioning time can make a big difference too! I'm glad you decided not to throw the towel in so fast! Cheers! :mug:
Click to expand...


It really is amazing what a bit of time will do for a beer. I tried a taste test with a Cream Ale that I had cold conditioning in a keg over a three week period. I took notes of my impression of the beer basically as if I were judging it in a competition. The beer went from unacceptable to exceptional during this span of 3 weeks.
 
Patience....it's the only thing needed for brewing that I can't sell in my store:D When I tell prospective customers they need to plan on allowing 6 weeks for the process to complete to drink beer, many give up before they start. Too much "Eat it here: Eat it now!" philosophy in the world.....

I agree about the finding a local club or take your samples to the LHBS. Either one should be able to offer some advice and impressions, though you have received most of the advice here already!:D
 

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