Meat is not a protein source

Yakima 728
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CreamyGoodness said:
Haha! Really, soy isnt dangerous in the manboob way unless you are eating/drinking tons of it (ie in protein shakes). Having soup with tofu in it or a nice bowl of edamame isnt going to hurt ya.
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Agreed. Which is why, for me, it's an occasional food item and not a main protein source
 
I am carnivore. My Wife laughs because when I look at animals, I see them with the dotted lines drawn for the cutting of roasts, steaks, ribs, etc. When I look at plants (animal food) I don't see dotted lines for slicing and dicing.
I admit, I probably eat more meat, fish and fowl than most people each week but I do include fruits and vegetables, preferably home grown or foraged.
 
CreamyGoodness said:
Haha! Really, soy isnt dangerous in the manboob way unless you are eating/drinking tons of it (ie in protein shakes). Having soup with tofu in it or a nice bowl of edamame isnt going to hurt ya.
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Tofu, is that like head cheese, but only made from toes? MMMMM head cheese
 
daft said:
Arggh, a pitch by a company making meat substitutes got me mad (even as a veggie) in how it panders to misconceptions.

What is the appeal of meat eating? I say it is irrelevant as a protein source, rather it is a comfort food. Not only do lentils have a higher density by weight of protein than meat, but EVERY veggie food other than fruits has all the protein you can use... per unit of calories. Even a lettuce diet crams you full of proteins because you have to eat so much of it to get the calories you need for survival. Some might argue about getting the "right" kind of protein, but your body reconstructs it anyway.

Besides fatty oils, meat has certain savory and addictive elements that I hear is shared by olives, mushrooms, and cooked tomato sauce. I forgot the name of those... can anyone say? If a company wants to make a healthy meat substitute, I think it should target those rather than the "mouthfeel" of gristle, veins, muscle (yuck). I think people like meat not for protein or gruesome mouthfeel that they THINK they are appreciating, but for those magic elements with they associate with the former.

Meat is not an ideal that should be approximated in mock health products. Rather the ideal is attainable without meat, and meat is the crude approximation. It's like ice cream vs real gelato. Ice cream is a crude, pathetic shadow of real gelato. Gelato uses high density, fine crystallization, and higher temperature to give richness instead of the neanderthal butterfat of ice cream. Don't judge on the basis of ersatz gelato which cannot be manufactured right here due to prissy health laws, or the crap gelato from tourist traps.

We should free ourselves from second rate but comfortable habits. Make your own gelato! Make your own meat alternative that transcends meat! However if this involves mushrooms, ignore the common myth that they shouldn't be washed. They're often grown in horse crap for goodness sakes, and it is a proveable falsehood that they get soggy if you wash them. Just some ideas that may hit home for do it yourselfers.
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I'll make my own meat too. No worries. I don't believe a word anyone says ever.

I am very free. The air smells like chicken poop, but chickens have to poop, am I right?
 
Just to pitch in...

Near the nadir of my first marriage I ate true-vegetarian (these days we'd call it vegan) for six months to try and placate the woman. I got colds all the time, had no energy, my digestion was terrible, and I put on fat while losing muscle tone. I also got some of my worst job reviews: couldn't focus, was distracted all the time. Wound up not sleeping well, and things even ground to a halt in the bedroom. :eek:

I was careful to eat "whole proteins" and even began supplementing with double daily vitamins near the end. I was as informed and careful about eating veggie as it was possible to be in the mid-'90s. Heck, I even enjoyed a lot of the foods.

...But I couldn't keep it up. When I went back to meat (and lots of it), my health improved radically within a span of 2 weeks. It might very well be that some people can eat vegetarian and thrive. I'm not one of them. :mug: :rockin:

-Rich
 
Echoloc8 said:
Just to pitch in...

Near the nadir of my first marriage I ate true-vegetarian (these days we'd call it vegan) for six months to try and placate the woman. I got colds all the time, had no energy, my digestion was terrible, and I put on fat while losing muscle tone. I also got some of my worst job reviews: couldn't focus, was distracted all the time. Wound up not sleeping well, and things even ground to a halt in the bedroom. :eek:

I was careful to eat "whole proteins" and even began supplementing with double daily vitamins near the end. I was as informed and careful about eating veggie as it was possible to be in the mid-'90s. Heck, I even enjoyed a lot of the foods.

...But I couldn't keep it up. When I went back to meat (and lots of it), my health improved radically within a span of 2 weeks. It might very well be that some people can eat vegetarian and thrive. I'm not one of them. :mug: :rockin:

-Rich
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Obligate carnivore. That is what felines are.
 
its a well known fact that fish is the healthiest source of protein containing the best amino acids and essential fats for processing carbohydrates into energy as well as the many benefits of consuming fish oil on a regular basis. The problem with non meat sources is that they do not contain these amino acids and essential fats. You don't eat meat just for protein, and to say meat is a comfort food is just plain wrong. Some meats are much better than others (i.e. turkey chicken, fish and lean beef vs. pork, sausage, fatty beefs, and dark poultry meat)

If you dont want to eat meat that's awesome, go for it. But vegetarianism and veganism are fad diets without optimal health in mind. Eating a perfect diet is more complicated and specific to each individual than "i only eat this" or " i never eat that".It's a careful balance of eating protein and carbohydrates from the right sources in the right proportions as well as getting your daily intake of vitamins, minerals, amino acids and essential fats.

Veggie diets can be and many times are healthier than the alternative of not following a healthy dieat, but dont mistake the health benefits of eating vegetables for "health benefits of not eating meat". You are not unequivocally healthier by not eating meat.
 
Since the thread started with a troll-ish title ("the sky isn't blue" is incorrect, "the sky isn't my preferred shade of blue" may be correct), I'll entirely ignore the original intent and instead weigh in with my general eating perspective here... I've read the China study, lots of articles on various ways of eating, you name it... Trying to find the truth, but all I found were contradictions and confusion. In the end, I settled on something that sort of resembles Paleo. Not because of the hand-wavy, foaming at the mouth anti-grainism, but simply because my personal weight problem was caused by eating too much grain-based stuff. Body gets low on energy, body freaks out, tells your mind to make you eat something super carb-rich to replenish (We're not starving, we have a pantry full of white bread! Go eat some!). Inevitably you overeat by a bit, and that extra gets stored as fat. If I don't grab some toast or cereal as a snack and instead grab an apple, I get full enough but still don't have enough carbs to fuel myself, so my body is forced to burn fat for energy. Plus, the apple sneaks in tons more other types of nutrition my cereal or muffin snack would not have. Or so my potentially flawed understanding goes. Found the info in this great article: http://www.nerdfitness.com/blog/2010/10/04/the-beginners-guide-to-the-paleo-diet/

So I don't eat ANY bread, pasta, etc. at home. When I'm out with friends - whatever, who cares, what I do today isn't the problem, what I do *every* day is the problem. At home, I eat mostly fruit, nuts, vegetables (not many) and meat. I eat eggs, coconut water, and maybe a banana or two for breakfast. I have one major meal a day, usually in the afternoon (soy steak and brocolli stir fry, etc), and graze the rest of the day - some nuts and raisins here, a raw bell pepper there, an apple and some almond butter over there.

Net result, lost 7 pounds in the first 2 weeks, felt much better. It works, and I'm not hungry by any means. When I stopped freaking out and trying to find the exact right thing, and instead started doing *something*, it worked. "The perfect is the enemy of the good."

May work for you, may not. Take it as you will. :mug:
 
techbrewie said:
its a well known fact that fish is the healthiest source of protein containing the best amino acids and essential fats for processing carbohydrates into energy as well as the many benefits of consuming fish oil on a regular basis.

The problem with non meat sources is that they do not contain these amino acids and essential fats.
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Fish (sea food) is very healthy with a good balance. But than again they contain mercury. And tell you not to eat when prego or to feed to small children depending on fish and its levels.

http://fishcooking.about.com/od/howtochoosefreshfish/bb/mercury_fish.htm



Veggies actually do contain your amino acids. Just certain veggies in lower levels. But you do get your amino acids. As for essential fatty acids you get most from nuts.

http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Complete_protein
 
andycr said:
Since the thread started with a troll-ish title ("the sky isn't blue" is incorrect, "the sky isn't my preferred shade of blue" may be correct), I'll entirely ignore the original intent and instead weigh in with my general eating perspective here... I've read the China study, lots of articles on various ways of eating, you name it... Trying to find the truth, but all I found were contradictions and confusion. In the end, I settled on something that sort of resembles Paleo. Not because of the hand-wavy, foaming at the mouth anti-grainism, but simply because my personal weight problem was caused by eating too much grain-based stuff. Body gets low on energy, body freaks out, tells your mind to make you eat something super carb-rich to replenish (We're not starving, we have a pantry full of white bread! Go eat some!). Inevitably you overeat by a bit, and that extra gets stored as fat. If I don't grab some toast or cereal as a snack and instead grab an apple, I get full enough but still don't have enough carbs to fuel myself, so my body is forced to burn fat for energy. Plus, the apple sneaks in tons more other types of nutrition my cereal or muffin snack would not have. Or so my potentially flawed understanding goes. Found the info in this great article: http://www.nerdfitness.com/blog/2010/10/04/the-beginners-guide-to-the-paleo-diet/

So I don't eat ANY bread, pasta, etc. at home. When I'm out with friends - whatever, who cares, what I do today isn't the problem, what I do *every* day is the problem. At home, I eat mostly fruit, nuts, vegetables (not many) and meat. I eat eggs, coconut water, and maybe a banana or two for breakfast. I have one major meal a day, usually in the afternoon (soy steak and brocolli stir fry, etc), and graze the rest of the day - some nuts and raisins here, a raw bell pepper there, an apple and some almond butter over there.

Net result, lost 7 pounds in the first 2 weeks, felt much better. It works, and I'm not hungry by any means. When I stopped freaking out and trying to find the exact right thing, and instead started doing *something*, it worked. "The perfect is the enemy of the good."

May work for you, may not. Take it as you will. :mug:
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Got to plus one this. I feel the exact same way. Its not about how much more hipster your diet is but what works for you. I have to say I havent felt better in years
 
There is a slight flaw with the OP's reasoning though. All proteins are not created equal. Meat proteins contain different amino acids and other lipids that a human needs but cannot produce naturally. There are also enzymes that are absorbed from meats that are used in cell growth and healthy cell regeneration. By eating meat your body ban absorb those nutrients and keep healthy cell growth. Not that eating all veggies can be done for a lifetime, genetically humans are created to eat a variety of foods to gain the needed sustenance from it all.

I do think the highly modified foods of today are problematic and that all the extra hormones added to meat is probably more detrimental to our health than the benefits of the meat to begin with; but you can find good grass fed, no hormone meats and fish.

I'm also not sold on the safety of genetically modified crops and think that eating just that could be worse than a steak or tasty tasty bacon burger. Or the In & Out burger I am eating as I write this post.

Just my .02¢

Now I think I need to smoke a nice ten lb pork butt.
 
If our creator hadn't intended us to eat animals they would not be so delicious.

Anyone ever had Kale.... ? blech

I was definitely not meant to eat that...



Humans are omnivores. We ave the luxury of being able to survive on meat and/or non-meat.

Also, complaining about an ad for a vegetarian product on HBT is about as silly as complaining about an ad for tampons.

jus sayin
 
This is a great thread. Nobody is going on saying you HAVE to eat this way or you HAVE to eat that way. I'm no nutritional expert by any stretch, but somewhere along the way I got the idea that not one single diet will work for everyone. What you eat and in what proportions are individual to the consumer.

A lot of the stuff that I've read on here rings true with me. I haven't cut out breads and pastas but I cut WAAAY down on them. I try to eat more veggies but not very successful with it, and when I do I try to minimize the cooking time, unles it's integral to the food, such as when I make homemade soups. A lot more fruits, I keep bananas, apples, and oranges in stock at all times. I try to keep nuts on hand as well as yogurt for quick snacks. This was all intended to replace chips and cookies as snacks. All this and other various tricks to minimize overeating like serving food in the kitchen but eating at the table to prevent table grazing, smaller plates, etc...

Any which way, I can't stand the militant anything types. I've met a few people who gave me a dirty look for ordering a burger for dinner, but not many militant meat types. Except one guy at work, who happens to be an avid hunter. We were talking about food, and I brought up the idea of trying to instill a meatless day into the diet, like a Wednesday. He literally stood up and berated me for having one of the stupidest ideas ever and walked out in anger. I have no idea where it came from, but he lost my respect forever with that little spectacle.
 


I have no problem eating an occasional vegetarian meal. I really like Indian food, and they have a lot of veggie dishes that are so good, I hardly notice the lack of meat. Would I make a permanent diet change of it? Hell no. I still love a big slab of ribs, or a bacon cheeseburger, but I don't make a daily habit of that either. Everything in moderation.

What it comes down to is, I don't think any one diet plan works for everyone. We all have different body types, metabolisms, and ethnic backgrounds that affect what food we should be eating. Figure out what diet works best for you, whether it's vegetarian, vegan, paleo, omnivore, or if you must, meat-and-potatoes, and stick with it.
 
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I'm sorry.

you would be deluding yourself if you think ANY vegetarian meal can reach anywhere NEAR the level of awesomeness that is my dinner tonight

go ahead... you can be jealous

IMG_7221.jpg

and, to accompany... Hardywood Hoplar IIPA
 
I love meat. But the fact that we have to cook meat to eat it without getting sick is pretty compelling evidence that we did not evolve to eat it. Nature certainly had no way of knowing we would create fire and char the **** out of other animals and then eat them. As much as I love a good steak or juicy cheeseburger, eating large amounts of meat every day is not part of a healthy diet. There is absolutely nothing beneficial in meat or dairy products that you can't get from a fruit, vegetable or grain. Obesity related illness is the number one cause of death in North America, and it is 100% because of our diet. I say this after eating two BBQed cheeseburgers. They were fantastic. Now that's probably the most meat I'll eat in a sitting for a week or more.
 
Eat a raw chicken breast and let me know how you feel after.
 
Goofynewfie said:
I can point to a lot of plants you cant eat raw or cooked.
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Absolutely, there's lots of plants you can't eat.

Would anyone eat a raw pork chop, chicken, or ground beef? You can eat raw steak, if it is prepared properly, because the bacteria is only on the outside. Fish and seafood is eaten raw when it is fresh and prepared right away (or frozen of course..) so bacteria can't grow. Eating raw chicken could kill you. That doesn't sound like something we were meant to eat in the grand scheme of things, as much as I love chicken. I like my meat as much as the next guy, but I don't understand the mentality some people have that eating large slabs of meat as a primary source of nutrients is fine. It is not, and our medical system and culture of obesity is proof of that.
 
No, meat is not the culprit. It is grains. In the history of man, cultivated grains, (and corn) are a blip on the timeline. We did not evolve to eat grains. Meat (flesh proteins), vegetables and the occasional seasonal fruit are what our bodies evolved to subsist on. The only place that grain is appropriate is beer.

Ya'll can carry on with your fallacies.
 
FourSeasonAngler said:
If our creator hadn't intended us to eat animals they would not be so delicious.

Anyone ever had Kale.... ? blech

I was definitely not meant to eat that...



Humans are omnivores. We ave the luxury of being able to survive on meat and/or non-meat.

Also, complaining about an ad for a vegetarian product on HBT is about as silly as complaining about an ad for tampons.

jus sayin
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Tampons? Why pick on them? You like pads better?!?!?

I'm a "primal" eater for my diet. I'm thin, lean, healthy,middle aged with great blood test results, and drink tons of beer. Life is good.
 
Rubes said:
I like my meat as much as the next guy, but I don't understand the mentality some people have that eating large slabs of meat as a primary source of nutrients is fine. It is not, and our medical system and culture of obesity is proof of that.
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Agreed, we have evolved to eat meat, just not in the quantities that we do. Our diet is meant to be plant based and supplemented with meat.
 
Rubes said:
Eat a raw chicken breast and let me know how you feel after.
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I am sure that if you eat raw chicken it is not 100% certain that you will get food poisoning.
But there are plenty of other meats you can eat raw.

I think the biggest thing on this is if you are vegeterian why the f**k would you want those nice tasty fresh colourful vegetables to be turned into a slab of brown "stuff". Fake meat does not sound appeling to me, but a nice vegetrerian lasagne or soup or plenty of other dishes do.
 
The enzymes that are contained in flesh based protein have been proven to have been the catalyst for the level of intelligence that human beings express. These enzymes affected the development of the human brain when we first started dining on our fellow earth walkers. If humans had not accepted flesh based proteins as part of our diet, we may have ended up as no more than biped cows for the tigers.

Weaker ones to the edge of the herd. This concept applies to evolution as well.

Now for a reality check....Does the thread starter hate lions, tigers and wolves because they eat flesh? I feed my wolves live mice and rabbits, along with raw salmon, chicken and beef. My companions NEEDthis for survival. If killing is so bad, why is mother nature so full of it?
 
I would trade a celery stick for some elk back strap any day. Nothing says yum like wild game!
 
what's down right dumb is all this veggie/non-veggie bashing. it's personal preference. just like everything else in life. my wife is a vegetarian, I am not. neither of us feel the need to argue or debase the others (or anyone else's) eating habits. that would be down right arrogant. of all the misconceptions floating around on either side of your fence, the worst one is: "I'm right, you're wrong." you know what they say about arguing on the internet. I'll get all your medals shined up & ready.
 

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