Make me buy a conical. Please.

[hokieengr]

I myself am the type of person that will buy the good stuff and do it right. I do not like shortcuts or half @$$ing a job. So, naturally, I wanted to buy a conical because that is what the pros use and there has to be a reason.

So, I thought about this. I briefed SWMBO on the upcoming purchase. I researched refrigeration options. But then I started thinking some more and realized that I could not justify the purchase, and was curious how anyone else does it. Here's my argument:

Point: Racking to a secondary becomes unnecessary because the trub can be dropped out the bottom.
Counter Point: Who really puts anything but the occasional lager, some dry hopped ales, and EdWort's apfelwein in a secondary anymore?

Point: Yeast can be harvested easily.
Counter Point: Yeast can be purchased for $2-6. This means that, at current prices, one could purchase 100-300 packets of yeast with the money one would have spent on a conical fermenter. Assuming one brews one batch per month, this supply of purchased yeast would last 8.3 to 25 years.

Point: Stainless steel.
Counter Point: None.

Would someone please tell me what I'm missing so I can spend all my lunch money!

 

[RDWHAHB]

Hard to move and control ferm temps

 

[DrawTap88]

Pro: Temp Control which will help you make BETTER beer than you're currently making (assumed that you're not using temp control at all). Should you already have a fridge or freezer for temp control, that can be modified into a kegerator or keezer (another pro).

Con: Need to make 10 gallon batches (also assuming you're getting a 15 gal conical).

 

[Squirrels]

I don't have one yet... I would say

Pros: No Light to skunk, Easy to clean, Scalable (buy a 14 gallon, only one fermenting vessel, less to clean, brew less often, use less energy), Pressure transfer direct to Cornies directly through a filter.

I'm sure there are more.

Cons: Cost,

 

[Ace_Club]

Point: Racking to a secondary becomes unnecessary because the trub can be dropped out the bottom.
Counter Point: Who really puts anything but the occasional lager, some dry hopped ales, and EdWort's apfelwein in a secondary anymore?

You rack apfelwein into a secondary?? Seriously, I don't really see this as a reason to get a conical. Like you mention in your counterpoint, the times you actually secondary are fairly slim. Plus, if you only have one conical, why would you secondary in it?

Point: Yeast can be harvested easily.
Counter Point: Yeast can be purchased for $2-6. This means that, at current prices, one could purchase 100-300 packets of yeast with the money one would have spent on a conical fermenter. Assuming one brews one batch per month, this supply of purchased yeast would last 8.3 to 25 years.

You can easily harvest the yeast after transferring the beer from the primary, maybe not AS easily, but you need to weigh the cost/benefit of that.

Point: Stainless steel.
Counter Point: None.

Why not just buy a bunch of Sankes and slap an orange carboy cap on the outlet? Then you have 15.5 gallon SS fermenters for a fraction of the cost of a conical.

 

[Randar]

Point: Racking to a secondary becomes unnecessary because the trub can be dropped out the bottom.
Counter Point: Who really puts anything but the occasional lager, some dry hopped ales, and EdWort's apfelwein in a secondary anymore?

Secondary for dry hopping or other additions like fruit is FAR simpler and you only dirty one vessel (which is also quite a lot easier to clean, saving you time)

Point: Yeast can be harvested easily.
Counter Point: Yeast can be purchased for $2-6. This means that, at current prices, one could purchase 100-300 packets of yeast with the money one would have spent on a conical fermenter. Assuming one brews one batch per month, this supply of purchased yeast would last 8.3 to 25 years.

It is quite a bit easier to harvest yeast and dump trub from a conical than any other method. You can selectively get only the good "middle" yeast which takes considerably more effort when capturing from a Sanke (for argument's sake).

Point: Stainless steel.
Counter Point: None.

Sankes are SS but cleaning is a lot more involved and I had to build a keg washing station for them.

I honestly stopped using my Stout Tank 14.5 gal conical and sucked it up when dry hopping using the Sanke and just stuffed the nylon bag in there (and fight with it to get it out). Ease of moving them around and more compact storage size (and fewer parts) has some appeal. Plus I am able to pressure-transfer more easily with the Sanke's than the stout tanks.

Having used both, the Conical has some advantages, but have 6 Sanke fermentors for half the cost of one Conical.

 

[Randar]

You can easily harvest the yeast after transferring the beer from the primary, maybe not AS easily, but you need to weigh the cost/benefit of that.

I would argue that the yeast harvesting is FAR easier in Conical. You can do it mid batch with one vessel and get only the best yeast. In Sanke, you have to rack off the cake to another vessel (to bottle/keg or secondary), wash out and collect yeast, decant/settle it out, remove the top and bottom layers from the cake, and then you are left with the good yeast you would have had by simply using the dump valve.

And if you are one to be worried about trub, nothing you can really do in a Sanke about that. Makes whirlpooling and/or coarse straining more important.

 

[Ace_Club]

I would argue that the yeast harvesting is FAR easier in Conical. You can do it mid batch with one vessel and get only the best yeast. In Sanke, you have to rack off the cake to another vessel (to bottle/keg or secondary), wash out and collect yeast, decant/settle it out, remove the top and bottom layers from the cake, and then you are left with the good yeast you would have had by simply using the dump valve.

And if you are one to be worried about trub, nothing you can really do in a Sanke about that. Makes whirlpooling and/or coarse straining more important.

True, that's why I said you have to do a cost/benefit on that. On the one hand, $35 SS fermenter but you have to do some work to harvest the yeast. On the other, $400 SS fermenter with almost no work to harvest the yeast. Personally, I don't mind a little work.

 

[JuanMoore]

I've seen a 1/2 bbl sanke that was inverted, 2" tri-clamp dump port on the neck, racking port on the side, corny lid welded on the bottom, and a spunding valve for pressurized fermentaion. Not a 60 degree cone, but I still thought it was a pretty slick set-up. Of course making one reasonably cheap would require being good with a TIG welder or friends with someone who is. Hmmm, maybe I just found another good reason to buy a TIG welder and start practicing.

 

[Randar]

I don't think the grade of the cone on a Sanke is going to "funnel" the yeast and sediment to the dump valve (aside from whatever settles there to begin with), so it essentially defeats the purpose altogether.

 

[JuanMoore]

I don't think the grade of the cone on a Sanke is going to "funnel" the yeast and sediment to the dump valve (aside from whatever settles there to begin with), so it essentially defeats the purpose altogether.

True. I really do like the idea of welding a corny lid onto a sanke though. Would make dry-hopping way easier and cleaning/inspecting a little easier too.

 

[Randar]

true, but that is a significant effort to do it and get it to seal properly I would guess. Meanwhile I build a modular washing station in roughly an hour, so YMMV with worrying about the corny lid.

 

[zymurgy101]

Cool factor is way high...as well as cost. My MoreBeer 14gallon conical was about $1200 with all the lights, bells and whistles...WITH a 10% off coupon. If you click on my profile, you should see some pictures of the conical in the 'Latest Gallery Images' section in the lower right hand corner. Click on one of those to enlarge and for more pictures. Thus far, I really like using the conical over glass.

 

[schweaty]

Buy a conical or tomorrow we come back and cut off your chonson!
I said we'll cut off your johnson!
Yeah and maybe we stomp on it and squoosh it, Lebowski!

 

[Beer:30]

LOL - Too funny Sweaty, too funny. Oh, and nice marmot!