Low Efficiency Questions (and a couple of others)

[rivercity_homebrew]

I have done three All-Grain batches so far- one Centennial Blonde, one of Jamil's Ordinary Bitter, and one of Jamil's 60 Schilling Scotch Ale. The first batch I had a yield of a little over 70%, but for the Ordinary Bitter and 60 Shilling I have been around 60%. I'm not quite sure what is going on.

Details about my process:
-I have been using Ajdelange's method for adjusting pH because I can't afford a pH meter at this time. I use RO water and adjust from there because my water is super alkaline.
-I use Beersmith to calculate everything as much as possible.
-I buy grain at Northern Brewer Milwaukee and crush at the store.
-I use a 52 quart Coleman Xtreme cooler for a mashtun. I have been preheating it. I am pretty sure I have been hitting my temps. I did calibrate my thermometer before my last batch to make sure. Last batch was a scotch ale mashed at 158, so even if I was low I should have had good conversion.
-I usually end up about 1.25-1.5 qt/lb for mash thickness (depending on how badly I do hitting my mash temp with the initial addition, still dialing that in).
-I batch sparge in 2 steps with roughly equal amounts of water. The water is heated to 170 before sparging.

Here are my questions:
1- How likely is this to be a grain crush issue? Are the Northern Brewer mills doing a good job or not? Any experience there would be helpful.
2- How long should my batch sparge take? After vorlauf, should I be running it fast or slow?
3- Any other ideas as to why my efficiency is low?

Side issue not related to efficiency
I have been adding whirlfloc and using my immersion chiller to create a whirlpool. I leave it sit for 10-15 minutes and I have crystal clear wort until I reach the bottom inch or two of the brew kettle.
-Should I be waiting longer for all of the break material to settle? How long does it usually take?

Thank you for any help you can provide.

 

[hopkid]

I have been doing all-grain for 3 years now and have pretty consistently over the past year or two have been getting around 68 % efficiency. I had tried several things to try an increase my number just by a little but no matter what it seemed to stay the same.

What I have found, just in the last 2 batches, is that I was not stirring my mash long enough. One reason was just plain laziness but also when I would start to fall below my mash temp I would stop stirring. I my next to last batch I overshot my mash temp quite a bit so I had to stir it down which took longer than normal and then calculated my efficiency and it was just over 80%. On the last batch that I did yesterday I overshot on purpose to give myself more time to stir and again hit 80%.

So make sure you are stirring your mash long enough. I would say no more than 10-15 minutes should be plenty. Although it could be your crush as that is a big key the stirring seemed to be my culprit.

 

[funnycreature]

Did you adjust your equipment profile correctly? I usually get the expected mash efficiency but my brewhouse efficiency is often low. This is because of all the loss that I have in the kettle etc. I am also impatient with draining my mash tun apparently since I always get almost a gallon after I stopped running it into the kettle.

Have you ever done a starch/iodine test to check your conversion? I have had all kinds of crushes and it appears that never was an issue. I think Braukaiser did a small experiment on that (can't find it right now but here's something else that might inspire: http://braukaiser.com/blog/blog/2011/03/04/conversion-progress-in-a-single-infusion-mash/). Good luck! Troubleshooting and dialing in my system is something I should do myself but I don't get the opportunity to brew that often so I just deal with ~70% brewhouse efficiency.

 

[rivercity_homebrew]

I'm basing my efficiency on what Beersmith calculates I should get for yield before the boil vs. what I actually get for yield (volume and gravity of wort).

I haven't done any brewhouse efficiency calculations because my gravities have been so off. It would just be depressing to see what it is after brew kettle losses

 

[ajf]

1- How likely is this to be a grain crush issue? Are the Northern Brewer mills doing a good job or not? Any experience there would be helpful.
Many people say that grain crush makes a big difference to efficiency. With my set-up, it makes a very small difference. I don't know about the Norther Brewer crush, because I buy my grain by the sack and cannot afford to buy from Northern Brewer.
2- How long should my batch sparge take? After vorlauf, should I be running it fast or slow?
After the vorlauf, you can drain as fast as you want
3- Any other ideas as to why my efficiency is low?
You do stir the mash really well after adding the sparge water don't you? If you don't you will get lousy efficiency. If you do, then try doubling the stirring time, and see what effect that has.

-a.

 

[duboman]

1- How likely is this to be a grain crush issue? Are the Northern Brewer mills doing a good job or not? Any experience there would be helpful.
Many people say that grain crush makes a big difference to efficiency. With my set-up, it makes a very small difference. I don't know about the Norther Brewer crush, because I buy my grain by the sack and cannot afford to buy from Northern Brewer.
2- How long should my batch sparge take? After vorlauf, should I be running it fast or slow?
After the vorlauf, you can drain as fast as you want
3- Any other ideas as to why my efficiency is low?
You do stir the mash really well after adding the sparge water don't you? If you don't you will get lousy efficiency. If you do, then try doubling the stirring time, and see what effect that has.

-a.

THIS!
Next time try to crush twice and follow the other suggestions as well.