Low carbonation and deficient head

[tiredofbuyingbeer]

So I've got this bitter that I carbed relatively low (1.6 vols, I think) to simulate a cask conditioned ale. The carbonation tastes OK, but I'm not seeing any head. Granted, I'm only drinking them two weeks in the bottle, so maybe they'll carbonate more and get more head. But I thought maybe it would take less time to carb a beer with less priming sugar. Is this a problem I should expect to clear up after a bit more conditioning, or is this beer just going to have a disappointing presentation? (The original recipe called for over 10% invert sugar--I used Lyle's golden syrup.)

I should also mention that I did the little medicinal syringe trick to simulate the nitro widget that comes with some beers, to try to get the nitro head. First, I have to do it a bunch to to see any head, and that throws almost all of the carbonation out of the beer. Second, the head is weird: when it dissipates, it leaves behind what looks like scum or break material. I assume these are protein structures that form when agitating the beer. Is that normal? I wonder if that's a sign that I've still got a lot of chill haze material that hasn't fallen out?

 

[SkewedBrewing]

What was the recipe?

 

[Chanoc]

Don´t despair...
My excellent english bitters... (to me) come right at 2.4 vol´s and my friends complain of LOW carbonation...
They are used to commercial beers having a little more...
On your second comment, I am sure you´ll get some feedback from a more advanced member...

 

[RM-MN]

So I've got this bitter that I carbed relatively low (1.6 vols, I think) to simulate a cask conditioned ale. The carbonation tastes OK, but I'm not seeing any head. Granted, I'm only drinking them two weeks in the bottle, so maybe they'll carbonate more and get more head. But I thought maybe it would take less time to carb a beer with less priming sugar. Is this a problem I should expect to clear up after a bit more conditioning, or is this beer just going to have a disappointing presentation? (The original recipe called for over 10% invert sugar--I used Lyle's golden syrup.)

I should also mention that I did the little medicinal syringe trick to simulate the nitro widget that comes with some beers, to try to get the nitro head. First, I have to do it a bunch to to see any head, and that throws almost all of the carbonation out of the beer. Second, the head is weird: when it dissipates, it leaves behind what looks like scum or break material. I assume these are protein structures that form when agitating the beer. Is that normal? I wonder if that's a sign that I've still got a lot of chill haze material that hasn't fallen out?

Give your beer a bit more time in the bottle. Some of mine seem to take some time to get to where they produce good heading.

 

[tiredofbuyingbeer]

What was the recipe?

6.75 lbs Maris Otter
2/3 lbs Medium Crystal Malt
1 lb Invert No. 2
1 oz. first gold (7.2% AA) @ 60
1 oz. EKG (5.1% AA) @ 60
0.5 oz. EKG (5.1% AA) @ 15
0.5 oz. EKG (5.1% AA) @ 5

Fermented with Nottingham for 3 weeks in the low 60s.

Edit: I also added yeast nutrient, because I was worried that the large percentage of invert might make a wort deficient in nitrogen or some other thing yeast need. I worry now that it was also deficient in head-producing proteins.

 

[tiredofbuyingbeer]

Yeah, so give it time is good advice. I should have asked, though: is the problem likely more that the beer hasn't fermented all of the fermentable sugar left after bottling, or is it that it hasn't absorbed the (relatively small) amount of CO2 in the headspace? If the problem is the former, then I should leave them for longer at room temperature. If the problem is CO2 absorption, then I should start putting some in the fridge, I would think.

 

[Yooper]

Yeah, so give it time is good advice. I should have asked, though: is the problem likely more that the beer hasn't fermented all of the fermentable sugar left after bottling, or is it that it hasn't absorbed the (relatively small) amount of CO2 in the headspace? If the problem is the former, then I should leave them for longer at room temperature. If the problem is CO2 absorption, then I should start putting some in the fridge, I would think.

The issue isn't either of those- it's that 1.6 volumes is flat. It's great in a cask with a beer engine, but not so great out of a bottle for people used to a higher level of carbonation like you'd fine with a bottled beer.

It's not deficient in head-producing grains- the medium crystal will give you what head there is- and the recipe looks great.

 

[tiredofbuyingbeer]

The issue isn't either of those- it's that 1.6 volumes is flat.

Well, live and learn, I guess. I like cask conditioned beers, but I want them to have a head. Maybe if this thing were actually coming out of a cask, and the line had one of those little agitator things on the end, it would be different. I tried the syringe trick (Guiness used to be packed with a syringe instead of a nitro widget to agitate the head and simulate a pub pour), but it resulting in a weird effect, almost like a bunch of protein or starch settled on the top of the beer instead of bubbles.

 

[RM-MN]

Yeah, so give it time is good advice. I should have asked, though: is the problem likely more that the beer hasn't fermented all of the fermentable sugar left after bottling, or is it that it hasn't absorbed the (relatively small) amount of CO2 in the headspace? If the problem is the former, then I should leave them for longer at room temperature. If the problem is CO2 absorption, then I should start putting some in the fridge, I would think.

I think (only think) that it takes a bit of time for the proteins to "coagulate" so they can capture some of the CO2 in bubbles. Sort of on the order of paint drying. They need to cross-link.

Your beer fermented all the priming sugar within 36 hours and the CO2 was produced right in the beer so it doesn't need time to absorb into the beer.

 

[SkewedBrewing]

The issue isn't either of those- it's that 1.6 volumes is flat. It's great in a cask with a beer engine, but not so great out of a bottle for people used to a higher level of carbonation like you'd fine with a bottled beer.

It's not deficient in head-producing grains- the medium crystal will give you what head there is- and the recipe looks great.

What Yooper said. The recipe looks fine. Must be undercarbed.

 

[Yooper]

Well, live and learn, I guess. I like cask conditioned beers, but I want them to have a head. Maybe if this thing were actually coming out of a cask, and the line had one of those little agitator things on the end, it would be different. I tried the syringe trick (Guiness used to be packed with a syringe instead of a nitro widget to agitate the head and simulate a pub pour), but it resulting in a weird effect, almost like a bunch of protein or starch settled on the top of the beer instead of bubbles.

Yeah, a sparkler tap or a beer engine is what is used at pubs (or some of us at home have them) to give that cascading creamy head in a real cask ale. It's impossible to recreate that in a bottle, so if I'm bottling a beer like that, I"ll still carb it up like a commercial bottled beer.