Lagering -- don't believe everything you read.

[highgravitybacon]

I don't know why people insist on complicating lager beers. It's really not that hard. And the whole lagering thing. These times I see where people are doing one, two, three month lagering. What the hell?

A few months ago, I made a classic american pilsner with WLP940. First, WLP 940 is an excellent lager yeast and if you're not using it, you're asking for more trouble than you need. The beer fermented in two weeks at 52F pitch, raising to 55F, then 58F. I lagered it for maybe a week or two at near freezing. Hit with some gelatin.
Done.

A month grain to glass. Crisp, clean, clear, and most importantly -- full of hop flavor and aroma.

I thought, well this is a decent beer. So I put it in a comp. Mailed it off and hoped for the best. 550 entries. Mini BOS, and medalled.

Point here is this: you can make a lager a lot faster than people would have you believe.

 

[DSorenson]

Some of that is experience and skill talking!

Congrats man

 

[4D_Glenn]

Kudos on the BOS and thanks for posting your process.

 

[Weezy]

Stepping the temps is the trick. I start at 10C (50F), and bump it 1C every three days for two weeks, ending when the beer hits 60F. We're forcing the yeast to clean everything up quickly. Starting low keeps ester and phenol production low, like you want out of a lager.

Good post! I'm doing more lagers for this very reason.

 

[Setesh]

What you are describing is a modified Narziss method. This is what I have used to make all my lagers, and it works great. Why ferment for a month when it isn't necessary? I try to pitch at 45, then after 24 hours slowly raise the temp to 50 for 3-4 days. When fermentation begins to slow I will begin increasing the temp a degree every 12 hours until I hit 60. I will let it rest at 60 for 3 days. Total fermentation time is about 11 days. I will then keg it and crash to near freezing for 9 days. I will add gelatin after day 2 of this crash. By the end of the crash the beer is clear and is ready to drink

I think this method will catch on more and more, kind of like the switch to no secondary has. The traditional method of lager fermentation works great and takes less involvement from the brewer, but the time penalty is hefty.

I do have to disagree with you that extended lagering isn't worthwhile though. As you say, something hop forward like a Pilsner is going to be better young. I have a Pilsner crashing right now in fact, one more week and I'll be drinking that sucker! But in my experience malt forward beers like Dunkel, Oktoberfest and Schwarzbier benefit greatly from additional lagering time. About 8 weeks seems to be the sweet spot IMO. It just rounds the beer out and melds the flavors together. YMMV, but that's my 2c. Thanks for posting your experience!

 

[VladOfTrub]

I agree with bacon on not believing everything written about brewing lager and pils. A decent book about brewing can cost a couple hundred bucks. So, what do you get from a 10-15 dollar book? I agree with the brewer that mentioned that experience comes into play. Experience, is what makes the brewer know not to believe everything written. The problem with a lot of cheaper books that mention brewing lager, is that the writer builds one paragraph out of a text that may be 20 pages long that explains a part of the process. It is possible, the writer has little comprehension of the entire text and writes having limited understanding of the text. The writer may use one umbrella to cover a process. Brewers tune in to the paragraph and assume, that it is the way to brew the beer. The part about aging lager or pils has been written about for a long time. It kinda goes by the gravity of wort. The lighter the beer, shorter length of aging needed. A good lager is produced from a good process. The wort has to contain enough nutrients, maltriose, to sustain yeast throughout the aging process. The beer has to be stable to be lagered. If the beer contains excess starch, protein, poor yeast. The lagering stage has to be shorter. That's when boiler to belly in six weeks works well.

 

[osagedr]

Congratulations. Winning that medal is a huge deal and certainly qualifies you as an expert on how to brew lagers. Well done! I know I'm going to thoroughly re-examine my own procedures based on your incredibly successful CAP experience.

 

[highgravitybacon]

Congratulations. Winning that medal is a huge deal and certainly qualifies you as an expert on how to brew lagers. Well done! I know I'm going to thoroughly re-examine my own procedures based on your incredibly successful CAP experience.

Unlike yourself, I didn't degrade into name calling or needless sarcasm. Is it an insecurity where you feel the need to belittle someone? I certainly did not. You are free to continue whatever process you want to make lagers. I want to make beer, not be beholden to sacred dinosaurs.

 

[Wolfbayne]

Nice KISS method! Congratz!

 

[DSorenson]

Congratulations. Winning that medal is a huge deal and certainly qualifies you as an expert on how to brew lagers. Well done! I know I'm going to thoroughly re-examine my own procedures based on your incredibly successful CAP experience.

Sarcasm?

 

[NewWestBrewer]

Congratulations. Winning that medal is a huge deal and certainly qualifies you as an expert on how to brew lagers. Well done! I know I'm going to thoroughly re-examine my own procedures based on your incredibly successful CAP experience.

Give him a break..he is from Manitoba...the butthole of Canada. He needs to lash out to feel better about his situation.:cross:

 

[IL1kebeer]

I don't know why people insist on complicating lager beers. It's really not that hard. And the whole lagering thing. These times I see where people are doing one, two, three month lagering. What the hell?

A few months ago, I made a classic american pilsner with WLP940. First, WLP 940 is an excellent lager yeast and if you're not using it, you're asking for more trouble than you need. The beer fermented in two weeks at 52F pitch, raising to 55F, then 58F. I lagered it for maybe a week or two at near freezing. Hit with some gelatin.
Done.

A month grain to glass. Crisp, clean, clear, and most importantly -- full of hop flavor and aroma.

I thought, well this is a decent beer. So I put it in a comp. Mailed it off and hoped for the best. 550 entries. Mini BOS, and medalled.

Point here is this: you can make a lager a lot faster than people would have you believe.

I feel the same way about people who say a 3 week primary and a 3 week conditioning period for ales is the law of the land.

Good job with your medal. Feels good winning one while going against conventional wisdom, doesn't it?

 

[Beernik]

I'm going to bookmark this thread. I haven't done many lagers because I haven't had the temperature control.

My Dort could have probably benefited from this method. But the Amarillo in my Vienna had a sharp flavor for a long time and would have needed to age out anyway.

 

[ManhattanProjectBrewing]

Hehe... I like it! And, consequently I do a modified method in the same light...

I pitch at 70F to get stuff moving then place into a 40F chamber. From the time it takes to get down to 40F fermentation is active. Once activity is evident I raise the temp by one degree until I reach 50F (11 Days total) then to 55F (One day-ish) Then to 60F and hold for 2 days (14 Days total from pitching). At that point I drop fining (Gelatin) and hook up to gas (14PSI). After a few days I start tasting... When it hits that "Oooooooo" stage, I am ready to drink... Won a gold with my last batch of Citrus Chamomile Lager. I have lagered in this fashion for the last year and just (with the comp results) gained the confidence / validation for my method. If ya think about it "Lagering" just like any other brewing method is steeped in tradition. And by tradition I specifically mean "getting it done." Traditional Lagering (To store) was done because they (Germans) had to.....In Caves, mind you.

Modern methods evolved because of technology (Leading to cost effective considerations) not because it was inherently "better." I feel the same about turbid mashing, yeast strategy, and sanitation... With technology came a certain "profile" or flavor that mimicked traditional methods but were... Easier. Not better. You want old world "flavor" you want old world methods... And those methods were simply getting it done. Brewers just used what they had, had available, and had at their disposal... It was because it just was... And they did it WELL.

I got caught up in the science of brewing because I could not wrap my head around it and I am a "why" guy. I was so stressed and confused for years because I thought beer was so complicated. THEN I started studying history. And my findings? Old, worn-down, dark, dank, unsanitary conditions wrought with responsibility to the "job" not the best beer on the planet. Don't get me wrong, modern methods, equipment, and the questioning attitude are hallmarks of progress and success but at its core [beer] is a beverage that had purpose. The purpose being a safe beverage to drink and a little "buzz" was a nice perk when imbibing.

Find a method, prove that method, and enjoy beer for what it is... A lifestyle soaked in tradition, law, and... Really good people!

Cheers,

-JM