Just got home from the LHBS!

[Grimster]

I bought:

2 "bottling buckets"
2 Lids with the hole already in it for the air lock
2 air locks
2 bags of "bottling sugar", corn sugar, each is enough for a 5 gal batch
Hydrometer and test tube
3 bags of the sanitizer stuff, makes 2.5 gallons per bag
2 1 lb bags of Dark DME
2 cans, one Coopers one Muntons, one's a Nut Brown Ale one's a Stout

I want to make a stronger beer (I'd like 7% or better ABV if possible) and I like nuttier darker beers (one of my favorites is Great Divide's Yeti).

I actually bought the DME to replace the sugar in a Mr Beer kit I recently ordered but it seems I should have purchased sugar for the mix (I mistakenly thought the "can" was pretty much all I needed).

Is this the wrong sugars for brewing either of these brews? It sounds like (from what I've read) that this also is on the "low" side of enough sugar for a stonger beer (2 pounds for 5 gallons).

So given this, what did I not buy I should have bought to brew up some dark and tasty strong beer? I figured to just use the bottling buckets for fermentation and start a brew every weekend or every 2 weeks to start up that famous "pipeline".

My basement is a nice dark 64F give or take a couple degrees. I plan to ferment and store the bottles down there for conditioning.

Am I missing something?

I've been reading this forum all week but the only real way to learn is jump in and get dirty

 

[s3n8]

Follow the directions, and make the kit, then move onto bigger badder beers. Keep in mind that big beers take longer to ferment, and mellow, and carbonate. I think 3 - 6 months for anything over 7%.

I am not sure what the cans are, extract or complete kits? For starters, I would follow the process and get that nailed before tinkering too much. Once you do, look into some of the extract with steeping grain kits like brewers best or any of the ones from the online shops. I think they make a better final product than the mrbeer or kit-in-a-can beers.

 

[FxdGrMind]

There is so much info on here isn't there! I've been reading for over a year and still learn more from daily posts.

As for what to brew, there are some posts with brew picts and then the recipe section has lots to choose from.

I can't provide a recipe as everyone has their own taste in beer, but I'm sure you might find something that strikes a cord with your taste buds in the Recipe section.

Sounds like you got the big stuff, but I didn't see a siphon to transfer from boil pot to Fermenter or fermenter to bottle/Keg or a Wort Chiller. Did you get all your stuff as a "Brewing Kit"?? if not check out the list of items on line in any Full Brew Kit. you may find that you need to go back to the LHBS for a few little things.

One hint I'd give for making the best beer from Extract, PM or AG is to have a boil pot capable of full boil all the wort for a 5 gal brew which is between 6-7.5 gal depending on style and type.

Turkey fryers are on sale now after X-mass and are great for full boil.

Boil-On! Cheers

 

[Grimster]

I have a stainless steel 10g pot I use for "other" stuff.

So I shouldn't boil and mix the stuff and just pour it into the fermenting bucket and then top it up with the cool water to the proper temp then add the hydrated yeast? I should siphon it instead?

The 2 buckets are both "bottling" buckets with a spigot at the bottom maybe an inch from the buttom so to go from bucket to bottle or secondary fermenter should be easy enough via that spigot.

 

[whatisitgoodfor]

Mixing use for your boil kettle could cause a couple of problems. After making beer, you're going to end up with some stuff stuck to the bottom (usually called beer scale) that's pretty hard to get off and might not make the kettle popular for other cooking. Having soap residue in there could also potentially create some off flavors in your beer if the kettle has been cleaned with normal cleaners before.

After you've boiled your wort you want to be careful not to aerate it until it's been cooled. After it's been cooled to below 90, aeration is a good thing though.

Using a bottling bucket for fermentation is fine, but when you transfer to the actual bottling bucket you'll probably pick up more trub that you would with a siphon, it'll be fine though. Be sure you use a hose on that spigot to the very bottom of the actual bottling bucket though. Aeration at bottling time can cause problems too.

 

[Grimster]

Ok just did the first batch, here's the down and dirty (hope I didn't forget to measure something I should have):

Munton's Nut Brown Ale mix
1 lb corn sugar (dextrose I guess it is called)
1 lb dark DME

at 78F the reading was right at 1.046 on the hydrometer

I mixed up a packet of the sanitizing solution
Laid out all my utensils, the bucket, lid air lock, hydrometer, thermometer etc etc
Sanitized it all and then rinsed off with hot water
I poured in the sugars and the mix into the bucket
Poured a gallon of boiling filtered water into the bucket
Mixed (with my sanitized spoon) till it was well mixed
Added cold filtered water till I was at 5 gallons
Reading was right at 84F for water temp
Took a tube full for measuring with the hydrometer
Put in the yeast, gently mixed it in
Capped it, put on the air lock and put some water into the airlock
I'll replace it with some clear liquor when I get back with some, see I forgot somethingn!

My basement is a constant 64.x degrees with very little fluctuation, it's under the steps, in the dark on a table.

Did I mess up anywhere major?

 

[whatisitgoodfor]

84 is a little bit warm to pitch, but you'll be fine with that recipe.

And as you said, add some vodak to the airlock.

You also might wanna think about getting a stick on fermometer for your brew bucket. Those will do a pretty decent job of showing you what the temperature of your bucket is instead of the temp of the air around it. 64* will probably have you fermenting at about 68-70 which is good for most ale yeasts.

 

[Grimster]

So one thing that kinda confused me is what is the different sugars going to do for my taste? The instructions said it was ok to even use "table sugar" and I know from reading this forum all week this isn't a good idea.

So what changes would I expect from say, all table sugar, OR all dextrose, OR half and half dextrose/dark DME (which is what I used), or ALL dark DME? The instructions recommended that for "best results" 300G of extra lite DME and 500G of corn sugar, but I used dark DME (1 lb) and corn sugar (1lb) so I guess my sugar content is a touch higher than the instructions said?

If this is already in a faq or something I haven't seen feel free to link it rather than rehashing something that's been said a lot if I'm asking a "common" question.

 

[whatisitgoodfor]

You used 2 Lbs of sugar instead of 1.7 Lbs, not a huge difference.

Beet or cane sugar (the stuff you usually have for table/cooking use) can give you a cidery taste if you use too much of it (I think the rule of thumb is 20% of fermentable sugars)

Dextrose is pretty clean fermenting, but again it probably shouldn't go over about 20% of fermentables.

Both of those sugar types won't contribute to your flavor at all. They will only add alcohol to the final brew.

Malt sugars are about 70% fermentable, so they will leave the residual sweetness behind that is needed to balance out the hops.

So comparing what you added (dark DME and Dextrose) to if you had added table sugar, you'll have a richer flavor from the fermented beer and probably some dark roastiness from the dark DME (probably not much though, depending on what was in the dark DME.)

 

[s3n8]

Many Belgians use up to 30% simple sugars. I think the cider-rumors originated from upward of 50% sucrose in some of the old cheap kits. The reason Belgians can get away with such a high % of sugar is that they are pretty big beers to begin with. Think 7,8,9% or higher. I think there is very little discernible difference between fermented sucrose and dextrose, I primed a test batch with cane sugar and could not tell a difference. In small %ages, they are all about equal.

 

[jjones17]

So one thing that kinda confused me is what is the different sugars going to do for my taste? The instructions said it was ok to even use "table sugar" and I know from reading this forum all week this isn't a good idea.

So what changes would I expect from say, all table sugar, OR all dextrose, OR half and half dextrose/dark DME (which is what I used), or ALL dark DME? The instructions recommended that for "best results" 300G of extra lite DME and 500G of corn sugar, but I used dark DME (1 lb) and corn sugar (1lb) so I guess my sugar content is a touch higher than the instructions said?

If this is already in a faq or something I haven't seen feel free to link it rather than rehashing something that's been said a lot if I'm asking a "common" question.

Wow this is awesome... you sound like me a few months ago when I first started. Assuming you will be using the canned kits for a while (its what I started on), I reccomend skipping the sugar altogether on your next batch. Be sure that you know what I mean when I say sugar... DME is not sugar, it is dehydrated wort. Wort is unfermented beer, and using DME along with the kits can make some tasty beer. All sugar (dextrose, table, brown, molasses, etc) does really is increase the alcohol content and 'thin out' your beer so-to-speak. So, you can have a hugely flavourful beer using your cans and some DME.

Later on, when you start steeping grains, you will want to stop using dark DME and replace it with light DME. This way, you will have more control over your flavours. That is for later on though. I recommend reading John Palmers online book before starting to steep grains. In the meantime, have fun with the kits and the DME, I have made 1 or 2 beers doing that where people have given my huge compliments. 1 buddy of mine now only wants to drink homebrew!

Cheers

 

[Grimster]

Sweet sounds like you were where I am a while back with much the same "mission".

My mission really is to quit drinking 2 or 3 $2 or $3 beers most every day, that's like 2x2x30 = $120 up to 3x3x30 = $270 per month just for some beer! I refuse to drink weak and flavorless beer.

Sounds like for the Irish Stout I have waiting for next weekend I should go all DME then rather than 50/50 (I have 3 more pounds of basic corn sugar and 1 more pound of dark DME I grabbed all the LHBS had for $3.19 per pound of the DME).

 

[Grimster]

Another thing I'm not quite sure on, to get my SG when I think the ferment is done, do I take the lid off and put the sanitized hydrometer in there or do I just let out some in a testing tube and test that way? Do I pour the test sample back in or throw it away? seems like such a waste to throw away like half a beer just to test (I am miserly)

And on that note, should I EVER really take that lid off or would it be best to NOT screw with it if I can contain myself and let it stay closed through the whole process?

 

[frazier]

Use the tap, don't open the lid. The airlock is there for a reason!

When done with the testing, test the taste. You do want to know how it tastes, right? But no, don't put it back.

 

[Grimster]

Ok so try not to open the lid if at all possible for any reason if I can help myself?

And discard the samples, as much as possible internally I guess

So when I transfer to the bottling container I could then hook a hose to the spigot, run said hose thru the airlock hole of an already lidded (but not tight else you get airlock and no draining) bottling bucket, drain, then bottle with very little oxidation occuring sounds like? Would there be some reason this is a "bad" idea,?

 

[LKHA]

dont put any thing back in. Dont waste it drink it and enjoy the journey

 

[whatisitgoodfor]

Ok so try not to open the lid if at all possible for any reason if I can help myself?

And discard the samples, as much as possible internally I guess

So when I transfer to the bottling container I could then hook a hose to the spigot, run said hose thru the airlock hole of an already lidded (but not tight else you get airlock and no draining) bottling bucket, drain, then bottle with very little oxidation occuring sounds like? Would there be some reason this is a "bad" idea,?

The idea when you're doing the transfer to your bottling bucket is to reduce splashing.

Take your siphon hose and run it from the spigot on your fermenter bucket down to your bottling bucket. Make sure that the siphon hose is long enough that you can have the end of the hose sitting on the bottom of the bottling bucket.

You want the beer coming into the bottling bucket to be coming in at an almost flat trajectory so that it doesn't splash on the walls of the bucket or the surface of the liquid. As soon as the end of the hose is under the surface of the beer you're golden.

The swirling motion will also help mix in your boiled priming sugar.

 

[jjones17]

Sweet sounds like you were where I am a while back with much the same "mission".

My mission really is to quit drinking 2 or 3 $2 or $3 beers most every day, that's like 2x2x30 = $120 up to 3x3x30 = $270 per month just for some beer! I refuse to drink weak and flavorless beer.

Sounds like for the Irish Stout I have waiting for next weekend I should go all DME then rather than 50/50 (I have 3 more pounds of basic corn sugar and 1 more pound of dark DME I grabbed all the LHBS had for $3.19 per pound of the DME).

Yep Not a huge loss though, as you will need that corn sugar for your priming sugar... if you plan on bottling of course.

 

[jjones17]

Use the tap, don't open the lid. The airlock is there for a reason!

When done with the testing, test the taste. You do want to know how it tastes, right? But no, don't put it back.

Agreed... although, since I make only 11-12 Litre batches, I actually sanitize my hydrometer and use a sanitised ladel to test. Since I am only getting about 20 bottles (500 ML mind you) out of each batch, I do put mine back. I always reserve a few tablespoons in a glass for tasting though.

If you are doing 5 gallon, no need to put it back. It usually doesnt taste to great, depending.

 

[PatientZero]

I think you're second guessing yourself far too much. The reason people talk about sanitation and airlocks and not splashing when transferring and all those other minor irritations and annoyances is JUST to protect your investment. Buying beer at the liquor store may not be cheap, but some batches that some guys make can get pretty pricey. Nobody wants to toss a 40 or 50 dollar batch just because of one little mistake they made in doing proper things in the process.
I haven't been brewing forever like a lot of these guys have, but in my experience I have learned that sometimes it's O.K. to just wing it. I'd start with little things at this point, mind you, but if there is something in the recipe that you think you want to change, why not do it? Table sugar, corn sugar, light malt, dark malt, specialty grains, no grains, American hops, German hops...just try stuff out. It might not be perfect, but I can guarantee that once you have 8 or 10 batches that you truly EXPERIMENT with, you will learn WAAAAAAY more than anyone can help you with by talking to you on a forum. Some of it will become second nature, and some of it will be through acquired taste, and the BEST times will be by total accident.
I'm not a brewmaster or anything, but I can almost guarantee that if you followed (most) of the steps with your kit, you'll enjoy your beer. People always talk about it like it's a science...and it is...but it's also an art, and art allows for improvisation.

Dude... just wing it.

 

[Grimster]

Yeah winging it is under way, there is currently 5 gallons brewing in the basement and another 5 will join it tomorrow probably and then a 3rd next week, each will use a slightly different set of sugars and we'll just see where we are when it's bottled and taste testing can start, in a month or two.

Hopefully a few of my questions will keep me from doing something overly silly, or making beer that while, made right, isn't to my taste. The most important thing is making a good beer that I enjoy drinking, so even if I somehow end up making an awesome IPA I still won't really enjoy it (while I do enjoy one occasionally it's not a beer type I will drink regularly).

 

[PatientZero]

It makes sense, I understand what you mean. But just stick with tweaking recipes you do like. If you like dark heavy stuff, try tweaking dark and heavy recipes. As long as you don't set out to make something you don't like, chances are you won't. There are tons of books available with charts and graphs and all sorts of crazy stuff about what types of grains/hops/malts/additives add particular flavors to your beer. I'd suggest looking through some of those.
The Complete Joy of Homebrewing by Charlie Papazian was the first book I ever read on homebrewing and it is STILL incredibly helpful every time I make a brew. I'd definitely suggest looking through it, or any other comparable book you find on the subject.

 

[PT Ray]

Ok just did the first batch, here's the down and dirty (hope I didn't forget to measure something I should have):

Munton's Nut Brown Ale mix
1 lb corn sugar (dextrose I guess it is called)
1 lb dark DME

at 78F the reading was right at 1.046 on the hydrometer

That's about it with prehopped kits. At most is to add a kilo/2.2# dry malt extract with it which should put you about 1.047. Being that extracts tend to finish high I actually see that throwing in something under .75# of plain old table sugar will actually help and keep from getting stuck at the dreaded 1.020 finishing gravity.

With the kit being preflavored you don't want to knock it out of balance by adding too much DME. With the kit and a kilo of DME you can always make a 4 gallon batch which should give an O.G. around 1.059 with out diluting the flavor.