How long did you extract brew before going to All Grain?

BrewSwag 728
Homebrew Talk - Beer, Wine, Mead, & Cider Brewing Discussion Forum

Help Support Homebrew Talk - Beer, Wine, Mead, & Cider Brewing Discussion Forum:

This site may earn a commission from merchant affiliate links, including eBay, Amazon, and others.
I'm still in the Noob phase with a dozen extract brews done. And 9 of those were not even with steeping grains, so it's really a bottoms up process here.

I plan to do extract with steeping grains for a quite a while--maybe with some mini-mashing. I figure that if I ever achieve competition quality extract brews, then the added time and energy of AG will seem more appealing.

Gotta admit though, DeathBrewer's stove top pictorial has got me thinking!
 
Second batch was AG (seven years ago) and three of my last four batches were partial mash. Only did one extract last year.
 
Never brewed with extract, although I've heard it is for losers. :D

Never brewed from AG kits.

Took a lot of time to acquire what I needed, and a lot of intense study time to find out what I needed. But when I started, I was writing my own recipes in Beersmith, grinding my own bulk grain on a mill I rebuilt and motorized myself, made my own vessels, made my own fermentation chamber, built my own kegerator, and acquired 10 corny kegs.

But I have tasted some kick-azz extract brews...and this winter has made me want to be able to brew in the kitchen, but I am glad with the results I've had and would do it the same way if I was to do it over.
 
I've been brewing smaller extract batches inside since last fall and have made good beer. I'm making the jump to larger equipment, batches, outdoors, etc as I type. Ideally I would like to master extract/grains this summer and then maybe consider moving to all grain. I just don't know if I want to invest in more equipment. Unfortunately alot of the homebrewing equipment is not cheap.
 
I'm a noob so what the hell do i know? i did a Mr Beer, then a partial mash, and the third was an all grain. Turned out just fine. This beer business is frigging easy if you follow 60% of the directions.
 
Did two extract batches, thought I'd try BIAB to see what it's all about. Only one particular complaint with extract (final gravity hovered around 1.020 both times unless I added simple sugars to try it out--even when I tried late additions to the boil) and it still tasted pretty good, but just wanted to give AG a try, and DeathBrewer's way looked easy enough. So far, I find AG to be cheaper (once you have a pot and a propane tank) and to smell about 1000 times better (working with crushed grain instead of canned extract. . . just so much more pleasant). Still haven't sampled my first AG product (bottled last week), so we'll see how the taste compares. But I find it pretty fun.
 
I made only two extract batches before jumping to all grain. I wasn't too happy with the way those extract batches turned out so I knew I wanted to have complete control over my brew. I've been happy with every AG beer I've made so far.
One thing, I see a lot of people saying it takes sooo much money to get into AG. It really doesn't need to be that complicated. For my mash/lauter run I use an igloo cube ice chest with a cheap ball valve and a manifold made with pipe I drilled holes in for straining/collecting. That's worked for me for 6 years and counting. So I encourage any one who wants to get into AG to try it. But honestly there's nothing wrong with extract brewing if you enjoy it and the end product.
 
It's weird to hear people say they feel like they're just throwing ingredients together and BAM PRESTO beer comes out the other side of the conveyor when they do extract kits. I've helped my buddy do a few batches and then i did a few on my own and i don't see any reason to feel like i'm taking the easy way out with extract. I do full five gallon boils outside on my turkey fryer and i feel like a mad scientist. Hobbies are a slippery slope, especially if you get too hung up on being a "purist."
Maybe in a few years i'll get bored and go all grain, but there's no way the wife is gonna want me dropping tons of cash on something like that. It was hard enough to get her on board with a piddly little $300 investment for my current setup.
 
I'm planning on trying AG for my 3rd batch. My first 2 batches aren't even ready yet... but I like to test myself.
 
RiffMagnum said:
It's weird to hear people say they feel like they're just throwing ingredients together and BAM PRESTO beer comes out the other side of the conveyor when they do extract kits. I've helped my buddy do a few batches and then i did a few on my own and i don't see any reason to feel like i'm taking the easy way out with extract. I do full five gallon boils outside on my turkey fryer and i feel like a mad scientist. Hobbies are a slippery slope, especially if you get too hung up on being a "purist."
Maybe in a few years i'll get bored and go all grain, but there's no way the wife is gonna want me dropping tons of cash on something like that. It was hard enough to get her on board with a piddly little $300 investment for my current setup.
Click to expand...

If you can already do full boils, then you can do BIAB AG without buying any more equipment beyond a $5 grain bag. Or however much those things cost. Can't remember. Not much. You obviously don't have to, and--while I like having more control and the grain smell--I don't even know if my BIAB brews taste as good as my extract ones yet. And I certainly had plenty of fun trying things out with the extract ones. Just saying that there are inexpensive options on the table if you are interested.
 
I jumped into BIAB all-grain on my third batch. Wasn't too hard, but it got a little messy. (My own fault...) Next time around should be much easier. I'll have the right brew bag, for one... If you go BIAB, do NOT get those dumb 5-gallon-bucket paint strainer bags. They do NOT fit on a large pot that can do full boils. I had to split my grains into two separate bags to do my mash... AFTER I already had it started mashing in one bag... Can you say little bits of grain everywhere..?

Plan out what you are going to do and be methodical. Do that and it should be pretty easy to start with AG using the BIAB method.
 
I'm really curious if any of the all-grain brewers could address Fadeux's question:

"If your goal is to be an all grain brewer, how much extract can you do to learn about the process before you are just wasting your time?"

I think this is a good question. Insights? What can extract brewing teach a young jedi who aspires to all grain? My husband got me a basic home brewing kit from Northern Brewer and I already know that *someday* (when school is finished and the toddlers aren't terrorizing the premises) that I would like the control of all grain. Don't get me wrong, we have plenty of good organic store-bought bottled spaghetti sauce in the pantry, but I'm the type of gal who personally prefers to grow my own tomatoes and basil and harvest them to create my own *special* sauce that takes half a day to simmer--know what I mean? Good spaghetti is good spaghetti. Good beer is good beer, no matter how you make it. But I think it would be nice to create something completely from scratch on occasion. I'm a total newb, too, and just trying to soak up knowledge so that we can eventually expand production. But Fadeux's question is one that I've been pondering, myself, as I look ahead thinking about where the hobby (obsession) is going...
 
thewildirishgirl said:
I'm really curious if any of the all-grain brewers could address Fadeux's question:

"If your goal is to be an all grain brewer, how much extract can you do to learn about the process before you are just wasting your time?"
Click to expand...

[I'll answer it, but note he asked this Q more than 3 years ago...]

I'd say 3 or 4 batches of extract will give you a very good feeling for the fermentation process. At that point you would be ready to jump into AG. You could just begin with AG, but that's a lot to worry about unless you've got an experienced AG brewer by your side.

At that point all you need is a cooler and a braid and you're mashing.
 
thewildirishgirl said:
I'm really curious if any of the all-grain brewers could address Fadeux's question:

"If your goal is to be an all grain brewer, how much extract can you do to learn about the process before you are just wasting your time?"

I think this is a good question. Insights? What can extract brewing teach a young jedi who aspires to all grain?
Click to expand...

I'm certainly still a newb, but I've done two of each, and I think the best thing about extract was just getting a feel for what the process was supposed to look like without having to worry about a lot of moving parts. Sanitize stuff, put extract and hops in, boil, cool, add yeast, wait, bottle, wait. It's easier to play around with one step (and AG is playing around with the "add extract" step, since you're basically making your own extract) if you've done the other steps once or twice and know what it's supposed to look like.
 
2 extract with steeped grains kits. 3rd try I reduced the LME and added some grain in my 10 gal cooler mash tun. 4th try all grain. Next, brew in a bag maybe...or maybe all grain with decoction mashing. Who knows. I plan on Thursday, go to my LHBS on Friday and change my mind. Brew on Saturday and smile the rest of the week. Life is fun eh? I do plan to split all my 5 gal batches and use different yeast or dry hop one but not the other or add something different. Now is the time to find what I like. I spent 10 days in Germany drinking bier only to discover maybe I should have gone to Belgium instead. Try everything! Life is short! When you find what you like.... Try Everything, Life is still short!
 
4 extract with steeping grains inside on the stove. Got my turkey fryer and did my last extract as a dull boil outside. Since then 1 BIAB that went pretty well. The 5 gal paint strainer bag works perfect along with my turkey basket
 
I have never brewed with extract.

I bought an all-grain brooklyn brew shop kit when it went on clearance at williams-sonoma for $25 shipped last october. Never looked back. Even though their "summer wheat" is not a pleasant brew. And there's really only about $25 worth of stuff in there, at retail prices.

$5 gallon jug, $1 yeast packet, $2 pack of hops, $3.50 worth of grain, $1 airlock, $2 stopper, $2.50 racking cane, $2 worth of hose, and a $6 glass thermometer that takes several seconds to give you a reading.

Whatever.

It's not that you can't make good beer with extract - it's that i won't feel like i made it.
 
Never done extract, AG right out of the shoot. One kit and then recipes from the HBT database. Never a bad batch. A few recipe tweeks, but nothing crazy (no fruit, sugar or other additives) and all were great batches! I thank my kids for getting me into this addictive hobby!
 
I think I did 7 or 8 extract batches and one partial mash before putting together a mash tun and starting up some all grain batches. I was pretty lucky in that I've got a brew buddy nearby with a lot more gear, so I was able to borrow certain things along the way when I did t have them yet. Still do - in fact... Just used one of his bigger kettles as a mash tun yesterday when doing up an 11 gallon batch that I wasn't sure I could mash in my cooler...

Anyway, it all depends on when (or IF) you want to make that change in your process and equipment. Like many have said, there's no magic in all grain - though crushed grains certainly do smell nicer than DME or LME!

I only made the change because I was planning a pumpkin ale and wanted to mash with the pumpkin - doing a PM with 60oz or so of roast pumpkin would've been difficult to say the least, so I went the all grain route. As soon as I suggested borrowing the mash tun, SWMBO suggested making my own, and the rest is history...
 
I did a bunch of extracts over the first year, then wanted to start doing my own recipes.

You are a little limited with grain selections if you're just steeping and using extract, so I went out of my comfort zone and did a mini mash, went well enough, that I built a cheap zapap mashtun to give all grain a try( one bucket with a ton of holes in the bottom placed inside a bottling bucket.)

I finally just finished my 10 gal cooler Mashtun, which I'll be breaking in next weekend.

Do some reading, figure out what equipment you'll need and go for it.

I tend to do all grain during the spring through fall and go back to partial mashes indoors on the stove during the winter.

Both can make very good beer!
 
TarVolon said:
If you can already do full boils, then you can do BIAB AG without buying any more equipment beyond a $5 grain bag. Or however much those things cost. Can't remember. Not much. You obviously don't have to, and--while I like having more control and the grain smell--I don't even know if my BIAB brews taste as good as my extract ones yet. And I certainly had plenty of fun trying things out with the extract ones. Just saying that there are inexpensive options on the table if you are interested.
Click to expand...


Hmmmm, i've heard the term "brew in a bag," but always assumed that was a step down, like beer in a bottle or mr. brew or something. :eek:
I'll look into it. Thanks.
 
I BIAB because i dont want to buy all the equipment out of the bag and plus i live in an apartment so i cant store something big. Plus its an easier process and dont have to worry about moving hot water around.

I went to all grain in three batches. Extract-partial-AG in that order lol
 
I started with Mr. Beer for 2 batches, then did a partial mash, then 6 extract batches before going all grain. I'd say I had the process down pretty well by the 3rd 5 gallon batch. My extract beers turned out fine (except for a consistent flavor that I believe was related to an interaction with the extract and my tap water) and I really just wanted to have more control over the process. Also I find that AG is just more fun, and that's the point of a hobby, isn't it?
 
What equipment is necessary for me to make the transition to All Grain? I'll list what I have currently.

15g Penrose Kettle from Brewhemoth
Bayou Classic Propane Burner
28" Plastic Mash/Stir Paddle
5g Plastic Pail Fermenter w/Airlock
5g Bottling Bucket

I assume I would need a mill and a 5g Rubbermaid cooler for sure. Are any of those 5g gatorade coolers fine? I've seen some for like $20 at Menards but idk if homebrewing requires some special build.
 
2 full extract brews and 2 more using steeping grains, then it was on to all grain. I think for a lot of brewers, time is an issue since all grain takes twice as long, but once you take the plunge, you'll never go back!
 
natefrog255 said:
What equipment is necessary for me to make the transition to All Grain? I'll list what I have currently.

15g Penrose Kettle from Brewhemoth
Bayou Classic Propane Burner
28" Plastic Mash/Stir Paddle
5g Plastic Pail Fermenter w/Airlock
5g Bottling Bucket

I assume I would need a mill and a 5g Rubbermaid cooler for sure. Are any of those 5g gatorade coolers fine? I've seen some for like $20 at Menards but idk if homebrewing requires some special build.
Click to expand...

You'll need a mashtun and something to be able heat/hold your sparge water, either a second pot or a second cooler.

Look around, there's great tutorials on how to convert a cooler into a mashtun, i just did it this weekend. Got a 10 gallon round cooler from Home Depot and all the parts ... total cost was about 70 dollars and about 45 minutes to put it together.

you don't necessarily need a mill, you can get the grains crushed at LHBS.
 
natefrog255 said:
What equipment is necessary for me to make the transition to All Grain? I'll list what I have currently.

15g Penrose Kettle from Brewhemoth
Bayou Classic Propane Burner
28" Plastic Mash/Stir Paddle
5g Plastic Pail Fermenter w/Airlock
5g Bottling Bucket

I assume I would need a mill and a 5g Rubbermaid cooler for sure. Are any of those 5g gatorade coolers fine? I've seen some for like $20 at Menards but idk if homebrewing requires some special build.
Click to expand...
I just finished setting up my AG system after a half dozen extract batches and now I've done two AG batches. With a 15g kettle you can do 10g batches with another fermenter and a 10g cooler. I'd get a 10g cooler even if you're doing 5g batches for added flexibility (big beers). Also, with the 15g kettle you can get away with using that for your hot liquor tank and draining/batch sparging to a grant (fermenter bucket) before transferring everything to the kettle (which is what I do for the time being). You need a stainless steel braid or some sort of manifold for the bottom of the cooler, some tubing, and a ball-valve (all of which is described on Fly-Guy's thread or in Palmer's book).

I've got a plastic mash paddle and it sucks. It gets too flexible in the hot mash and makes stirring a chore. A mill is a targeted acquisition. If you don't control your crush or get the same crush twice, you can't really gauge your extract efficiency and properly scale recipes (you'll still get beer, but your own mill is pretty crucial for recipe repeatability).

And that's pretty much it. A cooler, some hardware, and a couple of buckets.
 
2 years of extract and PM

2 batches AG

Now back to PM and extract due to ease and time constraints and the fact that I make awesome beer with PM and extract.
 
Looked back at my notes. I did 4 extract batches and then 4 partial mash batches before making the switch to all grain. If I had to do it again I wouldn't change a thing. Starting with extract allows you to focus in on some real basic things (i.e. sanitation, fermentation temp control, proper yeast pitching, etc) without having to worry about mash coversion, water paramaters, crush settings, etc.

With the partial mash brews I did, I was able to still make decent brews even with having issues around improper crush settings, uncalibrated thermeter, wrong strike water temps, etc. Again, I think 3 or 4 brews allows you this before switching.
 
Fly_Rodder said:
I just finished setting up my AG system after a half dozen extract batches and now I've done two AG batches. With a 15g kettle you can do 10g batches with another fermenter and a 10g cooler. I'd get a 10g cooler even if you're doing 5g batches for added flexibility (big beers). Also, with the 15g kettle you can get away with using that for your hot liquor tank and draining/batch sparging to a grant (fermenter bucket) before transferring everything to the kettle (which is what I do for the time being). You need a stainless steel braid or some sort of manifold for the bottom of the cooler, some tubing, and a ball-valve (all of which is described on Fly-Guy's thread or in Palmer's book).

I've got a plastic mash paddle and it sucks. It gets too flexible in the hot mash and makes stirring a chore. A mill is a targeted acquisition. If you don't control your crush or get the same crush twice, you can't really gauge your extract efficiency and properly scale recipes (you'll still get beer, but your own mill is pretty crucial for recipe repeatability).

And that's pretty much it. A cooler, some hardware, and a couple of buckets.
Click to expand...

Thanks for the information. Ideally I want to do All-Grain, I would love to have more control and right now I don't think time is a huge issue until we have kids maybe. But it would appear I would have to stick in another $500 at least. I'm guessing a good mill is $150 on the cheap end, probably will have at least $150+ cooler once completed, and then the other hardware. Its a commitment for sure.
 
I did five extract batches before switching to AG. My reason for making the switch may sound a little strange to some people...I wanted more to do. I look forward to brew day and wanted it to be more involved, wanted it to last longer. Of course thats a selfish reason, and doesnt always fit into the family/work life. But as long as I can schedule it in once in a while life is good!
 
First batch was extract with steeped grains from a kit from a LHBS. Second was the same, except it was my own recipe instead of a kit. Third was an AG BIAB. Fourth was AG with a cooler mash tun with a CPVC manifold. I like doing all grain and I don't miss that sticky lme/dme. I also started kegging with my third batch. Next step is 10 gal batches using a converted Golden Gate keg as a fermenter.
 
natefrog255 said:
Thanks for the information. Ideally I want to do All-Grain, I would love to have more control and right now I don't think time is a huge issue until we have kids maybe. But it would appear I would have to stick in another $500 at least. I'm guessing a good mill is $150 on the cheap end, probably will have at least $150+ cooler once completed, and then the other hardware. Its a commitment for sure.
Click to expand...

You're WAY overestimating here...

First off, you don't need a mill - you may want one eventually, but any decent LHBS will grind your grain for you when you buy it at no charge, so there's no up front cost here. The cooler... You're talking a $40 cooler, and maybe another $60 for a valve, bulkhead, and bazooka screen.

At that point, you're really only looking for an 8-10 gallon pot (preferably two, though you can always put your first runnings into a bucket and just use your kettle as an HLT) and a burner capable of boiling 6 or 7 gallons of wort. If you go with an 8 gallon pot, invest a couple bucks in some Fermcap-S to help prevent boil-overs. You may also want to drop a couple bucks on a wort chiller if you don't have one - but you CAN still chill a 5 gallon batch in an ice bath if you can't yet swing the chiller on your budget.

Long story short, you can easily start all grain for under $200 - hell, you can probably manage it under $150 - particularly if you've already got some of the gear from doing extract brewing.
 
RiffMagnum said:
Hmmmm, i've heard the term "brew in a bag," but always assumed that was a step down, like beer in a bottle or mr. brew or something. :eek:
I'll look into it. Thanks.
Click to expand...

Read DeathBrewer's thread (stickied in this forum) on BIAB partial-mashing (he has another one on BIAB AG). It's a really good resource to let you know what it's all about so you can see whether you'd want to try it or not.
 
Fly_Rodder said:
I've got a plastic mash paddle and it sucks. It gets too flexible in the hot mash and makes stirring a chore.
Click to expand...

I just went to the nearest restaurant supply and bought the biggest stainless steel spoon they had - cost $9. It's 7 or 8 inches longer than the 10 gallon rubbermaid cooler is deep.
 

Similar threads

F
Converting an extract recipe to all grain
Replies
2
Views
269
IslandLizard
IslandLizard
coffeer0aster
Suggestions for first all-grain batch?
Replies
32
Views
1K
We2smart
We2smart
P
Steep to convert - Steeping grains
Replies
5
Views
373
hottpeper13
H
Lazer_Lad
Apartment Brewing with Mediocre Stove Top
Replies
29
Views
1K
z-bob
z-bob
hilljack13
OG/SG very low
Replies
19
Views
688
hilljack13
hilljack13
InkBird 300

Latest posts

Back
Top