Homemade Caramel Malt w/ Milled Grains?

[Kickass]

I started THIS process to make a caramel malt with pale 2-row. Cliff notes:

1. soak grain for a few hours
2. convert starches to sugars in the oven at typical mash temps
3. dry grain at slightly warmer temp
4. roast to desired level.

I'm currently at step two and the following question hit me, "Am I'm supposed to be doing this with un-milled grain, instead of milled grain?"

Can anyone weigh in and give me a realistic expectation of what I'm going to end up with by making caramel malt with milled grain?

 

[Sammy86]

Paging @bracconiere!!! This guy malts his own all the time, he’ll be able to help you out!

From my general understanding you’re supposed to malt them unmilled so I have no idea what you’re going to get.

 

[bracconiere]

I started THIS process to make a caramel malt with pale 2-row. Cliff notes:

1. soak grain for a few hours
2. convert starches to sugars in the oven at typical mash temps
3. dry grain at slightly warmer temp
4. roast to desired level.

I'm currently at step two and the following question hit me, "Am I'm supposed to be doing this with un-milled grain, instead of milled grain?"

Can anyone weigh in and give me a realistic expectation of what I'm going to end up with by making caramel malt with milled grain?

sounds about right....i think @seatazzz actually has more experience then me using store bought malt though?

when i make crystal, i put wet barley sprouts in the oven at 150f, let them get up to temp for a while, then dry them with a box fan, then toast low and slow, because using an oven it's the only way to get even carmelization....something like 250f-275 or something for 12 hours....it adds a lot of color , but kinda in a subtle way....

Paging @bracconiere!!! This guy malts his own all the time, he’ll be able to help you out!

From my general understanding you’re supposed to malt them unmilled so I have no idea what you’re going to get.

you're more qualified? you know what low slow roasting imparts better then me? lol i'd called it a subtle dark crystal?

 

[Sammy86]

you're more qualified? you know what low slow roasting imparts better then me? lol i'd called it a subtle dark crystal?

Definitely wouldn't say I'm more qualified...better palate maybe...tasting is so subjective though...what I get will be different then what you get from taste wise!

 

[Kickass]

@Sammy86 & @bracconiere do you think I'm wasting my time with what i have going?

 

[Sammy86]

@Sammy86 & @bracconiere do you think I'm wasting my time with what i have going?

Honestly, I have no idea. As I said previously I believe malting should be done with unmilled grain but I could be completely off base here.

 

[bracconiere]

@Sammy86 & @bracconiere do you think I'm wasting my time with what i have going?

nah, all you're trying to do is do a mini mash..then use dry heat to carmelize the sugars produced....but i would stress low slow heat...nowa y to do it hot and quick, unless you have a coffee roaster.....my limited understanding kinda like making a carmel candy out of table sugar? but in this case seriously HARD crack stage....

Honestly, I have no idea. As I said previously I believe malting should be done with unmilled grain but I could be completely off base here.

malting can ONLY be done with whole barley..lol, it's gotta sprout! but once it's sprouted, it will have the enzymes to convert starch to sugar...so all you'd need to do is do a really tight mash in the oven, then dry it, ccarmelize it... @seatazzz does it in an air fryer.....

 

[Kickass]

Update: I never made it to step 4. By the time it was done drying, it was pretty dark so I pulled it from the oven. I’m going to brew with it but I may need to rename my “blonde ale”, as this looks closer to C70-80 than the C20 I was going for

 

[bracconiere]

what temp did you use? i'm thinking you'll get a darker, melower, more robust toast flavor...i think? you might like it!


edit: and when i make crystal, i 'mash' it, then dry it at room temp with a box fan, THEN roast it.....

 

[bracconiere]

i'm not sure, what is the opinion of calling it toffee malt?

 

[Kickass]

what temp did you use?

The grains were at 65* going into the oven. I set the oven to 170*and pulled the grain out when the middle of them hit 160*, about 3 hours. Then I set the oven at 230* to “dry” them. Tossing every 30 minutes to keep an even dry, they were finally dry about 2 hours later. At this point, they looked a lot darker than I was going for so I skipped the “roastin” step completely. They taste fantastic, but I’m not sure how they’ll contribute to my wort.

 

[bracconiere]

according to this, you hit the thread stage...?? i'm still learning about things like this myself, don't let anyone else tell you different, i'm still learning....and on that be sure to report back!!!!!

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Candy_making

edit: p.s. (whisper, whisper, last i looked since inbev was in the homebrew supply market for a bit, seems malt now is $2 bucks a pound last i looked...i think they're try to proove the homebrewers that say "oh i'd never say it's cheaper to make my own" right)

 

[Kickass]

Here’s what the hydro sample looks like.

6 gallon batch.
9 lb Vienna malt
.6 lb homemade caramel malt (final weight after starting the process with 1 lb
2 oz roasted barley (300 L)

I built the recipe in brewers friend and estimated my homemade stuff at 60 L and it looks pretty close to BF’s predicted SRM.

I’ll post back when it’s fermented (German lager yeast) and kegged.

 

[PCABrewing]

edit: p.s. (whisper, whisper, last i looked since inbev was in the homebrew supply market for a bit, seems malt now is $2 bucks a pound last i looked...

I was concerned that they might be trying to eliminate the competition, whatever they perceive it to be, and that whatever they bought might go away.