help with BJCP classification

[Boleslaus]

I kegged my latest batch last week and gave it a first try over the weekend with some friends. It was well received and I liked it, so I think I'm going to submit it to my first competition. The problem I've run into is that I don't know what category to put it in. Here is the recipe:

4 lb Pilsen DME
3 lb Munich
14 oz Caramunich
2 oz Carafa

Spalt @ 60 min to 30 ibu

So this far in, it should be a Norther German Altbier - 7A

However, I deceided to ferment with WLP011 instead of the German ale yeast. I wanted more of a malty, complex beer from the yeast, rather than a clean lager like bitter beer.

Because of this change in the yeast, it doesn't taste exactly like an Altbier, but I'm not sure if its roasty or chocolate enough to be a brown ale. It is definitely malty, but its kind of a clean bready roast. It is definitely dark enough though. A summer brown ale, with just enough hops to balance, not any real over the top bitterness. I'm not sure it would really make it as an english brown because of the hops.

What category should I enter this under?

 

[BigEd]

It's still a Northern German Altbier. Using WLP011 doesn't remove it from that category IMO.

 

[Boleslaus]

It's still a Northern German Altbier. Using WLP011 doesn't remove it from that category IMO.

To me, one of the most important characteristics of an Altbier is a clean lager-like profile thanks to clean yeast (German ale/kolsch) and lagering post-fermentation, neither of which I did. I think I probably would agree with you that it is MOST similar to an Alt though, so maybe I should stick with that.

I love the beer, I just didn't brew it to align perfectly with a style for competitions sake.

 

[BigEd]

Why do you seem to think that WLP011 is a "dirty" or estery yeast and not compatable with the Altbier style?

From the description on White Labs website:
"Malty, Northern European-origin ale yeast. Low ester production, giving a clean profile. Little to no sulfur production. Low attenuation helps to contribute to the malty character. Good for Alt, Kolsch, malty English ales, and fruit beers"

 

[Boleslaus]

Why do you seem to think that WLP011 is a "dirty" or estery yeast and not compatable with the Altbier style?

You're right. It's not so much the yeast, but the way I used it I guess. I fermented at 68, which is on the warm side for an alt, and I didn't lager it. I guess my overall question is...would I even have a shot at scoring highly with this beer in the alt category if it is missing those characteristics? Like I said its a great beer, but scoring highly means being a great example of that specific style.

 

[BigEd]

You're right. It's not so much the yeast, but the way I used it I guess. I fermented at 68, which is on the warm side for an alt, and I didn't lager it. I guess my overall question is...would I even have a shot at scoring highly with this beer in the alt category if it is missing those characteristics? Like I said its a great beer, but scoring highly means being a great example of that specific style.

If the beer is estery then it will be marked down in competition. Altbiers while ales do have certain lager-like characteristics. However, if you don't feel comfortable entering the beer in that category there really isn't another one that's a good fit. Quality feedback on a judge's sheet could help you see where you and the beer stand. Lots of very good beers just do not fit well into strict categories.

 

[mattd2]

To me, one of the most important characteristics of an Altbier is a clean lager-like profile thanks to clean yeast (German ale/kolsch) and lagering post-fermentation, neither of which I did. I think I probably would agree with you that it is MOST similar to an Alt though, so maybe I should stick with that.

I love the beer, I just didn't brew it to align perfectly with a style for competitions sake.

I think your biggest problem is your last comment, as far as I have read (given I have yet to enter any beers but maybe will be in our National comp coming up) it is hard to brew a beer not bothering to strictly adhere to a specific style guideline and then enter it in a compition and expect a 40+ score no matter how awesome the beer is. If you know your beer, which it seems you do, I would enter it in the closest cat. and when you get your results back focus on the comments more that the score, if they are great comments with just the things you already know they might flag you down for then be proud of yourself. And hopefully it is so damn good that the change in yeast doesn't hurt it to much overall.

 

[Boleslaus]

I think your biggest problem is your last comment, as far as I have read (given I have yet to enter any beers but maybe will be in our National comp coming up) it is hard to brew a beer not bothering to strictly adhere to a specific style guideline and then enter it in a compition and expect a 40+ score no matter how awesome the beer is. If you know your beer, which it seems you do, I would enter it in the closest cat. and when you get your results back focus on the comments more that the score, if they are great comments with just the things you already know they might flag you down for then be proud of yourself. And hopefully it is so damn good that the change in yeast doesn't hurt it to much overall.

Thanks. That's what I was starting to lean towards. I'd most likely be entering for feedback from unbiased and educated beer drinkers (rather than just myself or my friends), and not be expecting to place.

 

[mattd2]

Thanks. That's what I was starting to lean towards. I'd most likely be entering for feedback from unbiased and educated beer drinkers (rather than just myself or my friends), and not be expecting to place.

And if you did place (or got a high score) imagine what you could get if you did it again with the german yeast and lagering