Help- TA and PH Adjustment ASAP

[jmsj]

I am ready to finish my Blueberry wine. After fermentation my SG was .994.
I've back-sweeten to 1.026.

This is my problem. The taste good but not great.

I checked my PH and its about 2.88 and TA is only .4 (too low)
Ideally I want to increase my PH around 3.0-3.1 and TA to .55-.65

I am looking for suggestions to increase PH and lower TA

 

[stpug]

You're in a situation where your TA is not high enough but your pH is too low. Obviously, adding acid will increase your TA but will continue to lower your pH (not good).

Probably not the solution but can be tried with a small sample would be to dilute (raise pH, lower TA) and re-acidify with appropriate acid (lower pH, raise TA).

Hopefully this will garner the attention of someone here on the forum with more knowledge on these kinds of balancing acts who can provide better solutions that I have.

BUMP!

 

[pumpkinman2012]

Usually I don't run into low TA and PH, I don't mean to question you, but are you confident that these numbers are correct?
You could try the following:
Inoculate with malolactic bacteria, this should raise the PH a bit. When MLF is done, check your acid numbers again and add tartaric acid to raise TA to about 6.0, as long as the pH doesn't go too low.
Or try to blend it with a blackberry wine that is high PH and TA.
I wish that I had better answers for you.

 

[jmsj]

I checked PH and TA several times and yes they are correct.
PH needs to be adjusted up 2.88 to 3.1
TA needs to be adjusted increased .4 to .6

It is completely opposite of any of anything I ever encountered before.

Normally if PH was high say 3.4 and TA was .4, you would add acid blend to adjust both.

If PH was low say 3.7 and TA was 1.1, use would use acid reducer to adjust both.

I have unusual condition low PH and high TA, and I cant see to fix one without making the other worst.

 

[pumpkinman2012]

Jmsj,
I agree, it is a very unusual condition, the reason I asked about the numbers is that I've been making wine for a while and haven't run into this. I'm very familiar with the numbers that we shoot for when making wine, did you attempt to adjust and balance the wine prior to fermenting?
To be honest, I would rely on your taste buds more than numbers at this point, as you pointed out, it'll be hard to adjust one without effecting the other.
That said, Blackberries are naturally a high acidic fruit, putting it through MLF might be your best bet, it will reduce the acidity, making the wine much smoother, at this point you can then adjust the PH if necessary, instead of using a few different chemicals.
If you decide to go the MLF route, I would use Bacchus, you can get this in small quantities, and it is a very good strain of MLB.

 

[bernardsmith]

I know this sounds counter-intuitive but it is not obvious that increasing the TA will further reduce the pH*. But even if it does , the pH may not really be where the problem lies. Your yeast apparently had no problem with the pH and a lower (rather than a higher) pH suggests that the wine will have more preservative properties (it will require, for example, less free SO2 than a wine with a pH of 3.5)... The problem will be in the taste - the tartness of the wine and if the TA is as low as you suggest then it may have no "oomph" and indeed, may taste cloyingly sweet. I would take a sample and add some acid blend to increase the TA to the range you are looking for and see if the taste improves.
*There are all kinds of reasons why pH and TA are not linked - Schramm, for example in the Compleat Meadmaker talks about how increasing the TA can increase the pH because of how certain acids and sugars react to changes in the TA.

 

[Mr_fleabite]

If your PH is 2.88 I do not think you will have much success with MLF, even low PH tolerant ML strains will struggle, 3.1 PH is usually the floor for ML. My advice would be the same as bernardsmith, you'll need to do some bench-top trials. RS and Alc% will also play a factor in your perception of the adjustments, you may wish to adjust those as well to dial in the TA & PH (for example dilute with H2O &/or alcohol, then readjust acid and possibly sugar).

 

[pumpkinman2012]

I would bet that VP-41 wouldn't have any issues.

 

[Mr_fleabite]

Scott labs site says PH 3.2+

http://www.scottlab.com/product-143.aspx

Biolact Acclimatee (frozen ML, expensive stuff) from AEB states a limit of 3.1 PH

2.88 PH is very low, I think in this case dilution is the solution.