Gypsum

[Michael311]

New brewer here thinking about my third AG batch.

I'm planning on using a couple of teaspoons of Gypsum for an AG IPA based on Beersmith's tool to get my water profile ideal for an IPA. I was planning on adding it to the kettle. I'm not ready to try to mess with the mash ph yet.

Anybody have results with Gypsum, good or bad? Is adding to the kettle and mixing with the wort before the boil the right way to do it?

 

[RM-MN]

Any adjustments to your water should go in the mash, not in the kettle for the boil. You may not need gypsum but it probably won't hurt either.

 

[freisste]

Do you know what your base water profile is? Or are you using distilled?

Messing with an unknown water source is kind of like navigating without a compass. How do you know which direction to move?

 

[duboman]

Do you know what your base water profile is? Or are you using distilled?

Messing with an unknown water source is kind of like navigating without a compass. How do you know which direction to move?

Agreed and a couple teaspoons is quite a bit of gypsum, especially if you don't know your base water profile.


Sent from the Commune

 

[Weezy]

Resist the urge to make water adjustments to tap water if you don't know the profile of that tap water. Get it tested, or go buy RO water and make adjustments to that if you want to tweak water profiles.

 

[cluckk]

Get your water profile or start with RO water before making adjustment. Then use something like the Bru'n Water to calculate your additions. Just dumping in Gypsum without knowing its effects on your actual water is not wise.

As for whether you add in the Mash or the kettle is really up to you. I've done both and still occasionally do kettle additions. Brewing Better Beer recommends either option. I believe the author even says he does kettle additions.

 

[Weezy]

As for whether you add in the Mash or the kettle is really up to you. I've done both and still occasionally do kettle additions. Brewing Better Beer recommends either option. I believe the author even says he does kettle additions.

Salts act as a buffer, resisting changes to pH. Straight RO water is very willing to let the pH move to the low 5s after mash in.

 

[Michael311]

Do you know what your base water profile is? Or are you using distilled?

Messing with an unknown water source is kind of like navigating without a compass. How do you know which direction to move?

I should have mentioned that I had my water tested from Ward and I blend it 50/50 with distilled. I entered all that into Beersmith's water profile feature and measured it against the profile suggested for an IPA. The results indicated I needed to add Gypsum.

Still not clear at what point in the process I should add it.

 

[Michael311]

Get your water profile or start with RO water before making adjustment. Then use something like the Bru'n Water to calculate your additions. Just dumping in Gypsum without knowing its effects on your actual water is not wise.

As for whether you add in the Mash or the kettle is really up to you. I've done both and still occasionally do kettle additions. Brewing Better Beer recommends either option. I believe the author even says he does kettle additions.

Yes, I've had my water tested and before that I was using 50/50 filtered tap and distilled water. My plan was to add it to the kettle.

 

[duboman]

I should have mentioned that I had my water tested from Ward and I blend it 50/50 with distilled. I entered all that into Beersmith's water profile feature and measured it against the profile suggested for an IPA. The results indicated I needed to add Gypsum.

Still not clear at what point in the process I should add it.

Personally I prefer Bru'n water, I have found Beersmith to be inadequate. The most important aspect of adjustments is to obtain the proper mash pH for proper conversion and minimizing tannin extraction so personally I make adjustments to both the mash and the sparge water according to Bru'n waters output. You can add more gypsum to the wort in the kettle if you are brewing a pale or IPA as higher sulfate levels produce a more pronounced hop presence. For my really hoppy beers I shoot for around 200ppm and you can go as high as 300ppm before the beer becomes too minerally, IMO.

 

[mrdauber64]

Read the Brewing Water Chemistry thread. It gives a baseline for what to add to your water if you are dealing with soft water. I've been using it for my last couple of batches and I've seen a difference in the crispness of my beers. The most gypsum recommend for a british beer is 2 tbsp for a 5 gallon batch.

https://www.homebrewtalk.com/f128/brewing-water-chemistry-primer-198460/

 

[Weezy]

Here's the spreadsheet:
https://sites.google.com/site/brunwater/

I haven't used Brewsmith's water features so I can't help there.

 

[Yooper]

Yes, I've had my water tested and before that I was using 50/50 filtered tap and distilled water. My plan was to add it to the kettle.

Generally, you add the gyspum to your water before mashing in. It can go in the water you're using, in the mash and the sparge.

I'd definitely look at a spreadsheet (brewer's friend has a super easy one) to get the probable mash pH nailed down and ignore the function in Beersmith.

I love Beersmith- but the water profile stuff is nonsense in there. You may ruin a perfectly good beer by following that.

 

[Michael311]

Generally, you add the gyspum to your water before mashing in. It can go in the water you're using, in the mash and the sparge.

I'd definitely look at a spreadsheet (brewer's friend has a super easy one) to get the probable mash pH nailed down and ignore the function in Beersmith.

I love Beersmith- but the water profile stuff is nonsense in there. You may ruin a perfectly good beer by following that.

Thanks. I've looked at Bru'n Water and it gave me a headache. Perhaps I need to look at it as a necessary evil.

 

[Yooper]

Thanks. I've looked at Bru'n Water and it gave me a headache. Perhaps I need to look at it as a necessary evil.

It took me a while to get comfortable with bru'n water. But Brewer's Friend has a calculator that is simpler to use, and it almost always exactly predicts my mash pH successfully.

If you put your water into it, and the recipe, the predicted mash pH will be shown. You want to be around 5.4-5.5 for a mash pH.

While sulfate does enhance dryness, and hence the perception of bitterness from the hops, the mash pH is far more critical than a few grams of gypsum.

 

[Michael311]

It took me a while to get comfortable with bru'n water. But Brewer's Friend has a calculator that is simpler to use, and it almost always exactly predicts my mash pH successfully.

If you put your water into it, and the recipe, the predicted mash pH will be shown. You want to be around 5.4-5.5 for a mash pH.

While sulfate does enhance dryness, and hence the perception of bitterness from the hops, the mash pH is far more critical than a few grams of gypsum.

I've read a bit and talked to an experienced brewer and noticed lactic acid was a common addition to control mash pH. Any thoughts on that?

I understand everything depends on your current water profile and your target water profile but I was wondering if you've had experience with lactic acid.

 

[duboman]

Small amounts of lactic acid do a good job on pH with water that is higher than desired in alkalinity.

My water is somewhat high and a few ml of acid drop the pH right into range.


Sent from the Commune

 

[Yooper]

I've used lactic acid, as well as phosphoric acid, for both controlling mash pH and to acidify my sparge water.

The only issue with lactic acid is that you want to stay under the flavor threshold. I've also used acidulated malt to reduce the mash pH instead of lactic acid (sort of the same thing), and as long as it's under 3% of the total grainbill, that is below the flavor threshold as well.

Phosphoric acid is a good choice, as it's good for reducing pH as well and it doesn't impart a flavor.

 

[masonsjax]

Brunwater is really not as daunting as it seems at first glance. Check out Matt Chrispen's awesome walkthrough, it helped me get the hang of it in no time. http://accidentalis.com/archives/275

 

[BansheeRider]

I know my water is very high in PH, so I use a tsp of gypsum in every batch unless I'm mashing dark grains. Gypsum will lower your water PH if added to your strike water. Dark beers automatically lower the PH so gypsum may not be needed. I've also heard of people using gypsum in the boil to give their IPAs more hop character. I love the taste of my IPAs as is so I've never tried this method.