Guinness Draft Clone Recipe Questions

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rthiessen

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I am an all-grain brewer and will be helping my brother brew his first beer tomorrow. Instead of just doing all extract, I thought it would be good to do a partial mash brew. He likes Guinness so I found this clone recipe on BYO.com. A few things stood out in their step by step instructions below. First, they don't say to include the roasted barley in with the pale malt and flaked barley in the steeping bag. I assume they just forgot to include that? There is really no other option I would think for where the roasted barley would go. Second, they mention adding DME to the brewpot for the 60 min boil. However this recipe doesn't include DME, just the liquid Maris Otter(to be added late in the boil). Do I assume I should not worry about adding DME? Finally, I assume it is ok to spring or tap water for partial mash beers? I know it's best to use RO/Distilled water for all-extract beers.

(5 gallons/19 L, partial mash)
OG = 1.038 FG = 1.006
IBU = 45 SRM = 40 ABV = 4.2%

Ingredients
3.3 lbs. (1.5 kg) Maris Otter liquid malt extract (late addition)
1.25 lbs. (0.57 kg) English pale ale malt (3 °L)
1.25 lbs. (0.57 kg) flaked barley
1 lb. (0.45 kg) roasted barley (500 °L)
12 AAU East Kent Goldings hops (60 min) (2.4 oz./68 g of 5% alpha acids)
Wyeast 1084 (Irish Ale) or White Labs WLP004 (Irish Ale) yeast (2 qt./2 L yeast starter)
0.75 cups corn sugar (for priming)

Step by Step
Place crushed pale ale malt and flaked barley in a steeping bag. In a large kitchen pot, heat 4.5 qts. (4.3 L) to 161 °F (72 °C) and submerge grain bag. Let grains steep for 45 minutes at around 150 °F (66 °C). While grains are steeping, begin heating 2.1 gallons (7.9 L) of water in your brewpot. When steep is over, remove 1.25 qts. (1.2 L) of water from brewpot and add to the “grain tea” in steeping pot. Place colander over brewpot and place steeping bag in it. Pour diluted grain tea through grain bag. Heat liquid in brewpot to a boil, then stir in dried malt extract and hops and begin the 60 minute boil. With 15 minutes left in boil, turn off heat and stir in liquid malt extract. Stir well to dissolve extract, then resume heating. (Keep the boil clock running while you stir.) At the end of the boil, cool wort and transfer to fermenter. Add water to make 5 gallons (19 L), aerate wort and pitch yeast. Ferment at 72 °F (22 °C). Rack to secondary when fermentation is complete. Bottle when beer falls clear.

Thanks,
Rob Thiessen
 
This is the recipe here?
https://byo.com/recipe/guinness-draught-clone/

It seems to have errors for sure. At some point you have to add the roasted barley, I would assume with the other grains.

I don't do partial mash, only full grain but I went ahead and plunked the recipe into brewtarget to try to help out. Without the DME the original gravity came out at 1.032 (which is way low).

After adding 1lb of DME to the recipe it seemed to bump it up to approximately 1.038-1.039 OG which gets you in the ballpark
 
Ok, I will add the roasted barley to the steeping bag and add 2 lbs of DME for the boil, pluss the Maris Otter at 15 minutes. Thanks! Any recommendations for what type of water to use for partial mash/extract brews? I read that spring or tap water should be fine.
 
Not sure what is in your tap water. Is it hard or soft? Does it taste good?
If it is on the softer side and tastes good then you should be able to use it. Spring water is fine too
 
Afaik guiness steeps the roast barley separately in cold water and doesn't include it in the mash.

Good point Miraculix
He isn't really mashing and sparging here so the roasted grains shouldn't get too harsh. I was the thinking the OP could add it late to the grain bag, maybe steeping 10 or 20 min and it would be less astringent and smoother.
 
I would use filtered tap water or spring water. If using tap water, I would also take steps to make sure that the chlorine is removed, like letting it sit for 24 hours or adding a campden tablet. I like Guinness but never have tried to reproduce it. I'm surprised at the large amount of roasted barley. I have never used that much in a recipe. I would probably be apt to put the roasted barley in a second bag and just add it with about 20 mins to go on the steep, as beerlover77 mentioned above. /cheers
 

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