Graff (Malty, slightly hopped cider)
- Thread starter Brandon O
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midfielder5
Well-Known Member
you don't have to search all pages if you hit "search this thread" & type in query
I dont know much about using Yeast Nutrient. when would you add it in the original recipe to help avoid rhino farts?
i was thinking adding to the 4 gallons of apple juice so when i add my wort and pitch the yeast it will all be at proper temp?
the only instructions on the bag say "1 tsp per 5 gallon"
i was thinking adding to the 4 gallons of apple juice so when i add my wort and pitch the yeast it will all be at proper temp?
the only instructions on the bag say "1 tsp per 5 gallon"
OK, started a new 3 gallon batch with modified recipe last Sunday. Any thoughts on how this might turn out? Here is what I did:
1 packet Nottigham Ale Yeast
1/2 tsp yeast nutrient
3 oz Crystal 120L
3 oz Crystal 60L
3 oz Honey Malt
1 oz Torrified Wheat
12 oz Light DME
12 oz Amber DME
5 oz Maltodextrine
8 oz Lactose Sugar
< 1/4 oz Hops -- cascade (6%)
1.5 gallons Apple juice or cider
2x 48oz cans pineapple juice
2x cans Frozen apple juice concentrate
Steep the 120L/60L/Honey Malt and torrified wheat in 1/2 gallon of purified water @ 155 degrees for 30 mins.
Stir in DME/maltodextrine/lactose and bring to a boil.
Add hops in boiling bag and boil wort for 30 mins.
Cool the wort down to 65 degrees so your cider will clear fairly easy. Pour the wort, thawed apple concentrate, pineapple juice and bulk apple juice into your carboy and pitch yeast.
Ferment 3-4 weeks at 60-68 degrees.
When fermentation is done, wait one more week to allow brew to clear. Then mix 3 oz of corn sugar in 1 cup of warm water and add to bottling bucket. Once it cools, rack wort on top and bottle in 12 oz beer bottles, cap, and store in warm place.
In 3 weeks, cool a bottle overnight and open it to test carbonation. If not carbed, wait 2 days and try again until level is right.
Pasteurize bottles to stop further carbonation by heating bottles in pot of water at 190 degrees for 10 minutes.
Cool and store.
1 packet Nottigham Ale Yeast
1/2 tsp yeast nutrient
3 oz Crystal 120L
3 oz Crystal 60L
3 oz Honey Malt
1 oz Torrified Wheat
12 oz Light DME
12 oz Amber DME
5 oz Maltodextrine
8 oz Lactose Sugar
< 1/4 oz Hops -- cascade (6%)
1.5 gallons Apple juice or cider
2x 48oz cans pineapple juice
2x cans Frozen apple juice concentrate
Steep the 120L/60L/Honey Malt and torrified wheat in 1/2 gallon of purified water @ 155 degrees for 30 mins.
Stir in DME/maltodextrine/lactose and bring to a boil.
Add hops in boiling bag and boil wort for 30 mins.
Cool the wort down to 65 degrees so your cider will clear fairly easy. Pour the wort, thawed apple concentrate, pineapple juice and bulk apple juice into your carboy and pitch yeast.
Ferment 3-4 weeks at 60-68 degrees.
When fermentation is done, wait one more week to allow brew to clear. Then mix 3 oz of corn sugar in 1 cup of warm water and add to bottling bucket. Once it cools, rack wort on top and bottle in 12 oz beer bottles, cap, and store in warm place.
In 3 weeks, cool a bottle overnight and open it to test carbonation. If not carbed, wait 2 days and try again until level is right.
Pasteurize bottles to stop further carbonation by heating bottles in pot of water at 190 degrees for 10 minutes.
Cool and store.
The sweet definitely subsides after some bottle time
i didnt see where you added the Yeast nutrient?
what i ended up doing was pitching it before the yeast. gave it a nice shake
then pitched the yeast
hope that works
havent had any bad smells yet so... i guess?
Fenderdaw said:
Enjoying a bomber's worth tonight, it's been 2 weeks & I think it's turned out great. A little murky but no complaints otherwise. A sneak taste a week ago got a "kinda like cider-vinegar" response from a friend, but it's really come around in a week. The Citra is good but in hindsight, given the citrus peel addition I might go for a less citrusy hop. Seems like a no brainer now that I write this but screw it, perfectly enjoyable second batch.
midfielder5
Well-Known Member
next time, put the citrus at the end, w/ 10 min left in boil. I can't say for sure, but it probably allows the citrus to not totally break down & thus will be in the final product.
Yeah, I added nutrient same time as juice, wort, etc ... right up front ... to the carboy. And it sure adds to the fermentation!!! Run a blow off tube for sure.
This brew is still bubbling nicely and man does it smell good!!! I did try a hard cider with apple and pineapple, which I started in December. And it is still not done fermenting. Amazing. Wondering if pineapple = jungle juice?
Could not find any torrified wheat. I noticed in the LHBS the label for toasted barley mentioned that it is torrified and can be good for head retention. Would this be suitable substitute for the torrified wheat?
Do you think that you could use Sorghum Syrup in this recipe instead of LME? I'm trying to keep it gluten-free.
The LHBS only has 7lb containers of Sorghum. Has anyone made this recipe (5gal) with 6-7lbs of LME/DME combined? Would it be too much?
The LHBS only has 7lb containers of Sorghum. Has anyone made this recipe (5gal) with 6-7lbs of LME/DME combined? Would it be too much?
Hi everyone, first post on the forums but I've been lurking for a while. I have a batch of Edwort's apfelwein fermenting, but I'm really curious to try graff as well (and I'm new, so I'm still waiting for most of my batches and am thus very antsy!). It sounds like the original recipe is a winner, but being that I am unable to follow someone else's directions without tweaking something (had to dry hop my newbie kit just because), naturally I want to tweak Brandon's recipe to satisfy my curiosity.
I love the idea of a malted cider and I may just make the original first for comparison's sake, but I'm curious how it would match up with a wheat beer component and a wit or saison style yeast. Admittedly I'm just getting my feet wet with brewing, but based on what I've read, these things sound like they should work well together. What do you guys think? I'm using a modified recipe posted a few pages ago that incorporates some honey malt and adjuncts for additional body and just kind of winging it:
1# wheat DME
1# light DME
1/2# crystal 120
1/2# honey malt
2oz torrified wheat
1/2# maltodextrin
4 gallons AJ
some sort of low AA hops (liberty, crystal, whatever).
and fermenting with something like the seasonal (Bier De Garde. If that's not available, possibly a saison or a witbier. The original recipe recommends lactose, but I'm not familiar with the taste it adds so I think I would leave it out. In my mind this should produce a fairly light bodied, sweet, crisp wheaty beer component which sounds like it should blend very nicely with the cider.
Thoughts? Would the Crystal 120 be too dark for these ingredients? Should I maybe tone it down to something like Crystal 40 to preserve the more subtle qualities of the wheat and yeast?
I love the idea of a malted cider and I may just make the original first for comparison's sake, but I'm curious how it would match up with a wheat beer component and a wit or saison style yeast. Admittedly I'm just getting my feet wet with brewing, but based on what I've read, these things sound like they should work well together. What do you guys think? I'm using a modified recipe posted a few pages ago that incorporates some honey malt and adjuncts for additional body and just kind of winging it:
1# wheat DME
1# light DME
1/2# crystal 120
1/2# honey malt
2oz torrified wheat
1/2# maltodextrin
4 gallons AJ
some sort of low AA hops (liberty, crystal, whatever).
and fermenting with something like the seasonal (Bier De Garde. If that's not available, possibly a saison or a witbier. The original recipe recommends lactose, but I'm not familiar with the taste it adds so I think I would leave it out. In my mind this should produce a fairly light bodied, sweet, crisp wheaty beer component which sounds like it should blend very nicely with the cider.
Thoughts? Would the Crystal 120 be too dark for these ingredients? Should I maybe tone it down to something like Crystal 40 to preserve the more subtle qualities of the wheat and yeast?
OK, so my batch has been bottled for 2 weeks and I cracked one open today. What can I say? YUMMMYYY!!! The tartness has mellowed down and I'm sure that a couple more weeks can completely get rid of it. It's got a nice aroma, probably it was because of the Simcoe tea I added before bottling. Thanks a lot for the recipe! 
rycov
Well-Known Member
just ordered the necessities. i'm thinking about adding a cinnimon stick to the boil. thoughts?
Just finished a batch similar to this except with a few tweaks. I used what instead, left out the lactose and forgot to get the maltodextrin, so my final list looks like this:
1.5 lbs wheat DME
1 lb Amber DME
1/2 lb Crystal 120
1/2 lb honey malt
2 oz torrified wheat
.5 oz Willamette hops
OG: 1.068
Pitched a smack pack of Wyeast 1099 Whitbread. I have no experience with this yeast but it's a fairly low attenuation so it should leave some sweetness and it's supposedly somewhat fruity and malty when it finishes so I thought it sounded good. I'm pretty excited to try this as the sample I tried after taking the reading was delicious.
This turned out great. It's not at all hoochy. It's got a great mix of apple and malty mouthfeel.
is there a reason you went with 2 pkgs of Nottingham?
on a side note...
mine was fermenting away nicely in my chest freezer for about 2 weeks with my IPA that had just finished fermentation. i was pulling my carboy of IPA out of the chest freezer to move it to my racking location... grabbed the neck of the IPA and lifted... the bottom of the IPA carboy swung to the right... banged up against my cider carboy and i heard a horrible sound....
GLUG GLUG GLUG GLUG...
punched a hole in my cider carboy. 5 gallons of cider in the bottom of my chest freezer... sweet!
so.. i am actually gunna be brewing this again... this time using brew haulers
ill cross my fingers... heh
CA-LT1
Well-Known Member
Hey shook, that sucks. Do you use glass or plastic carboys? I'm guessing glass, I don't think I could break a plastic one, unless I really tried
yeah glass.. luckily the carboy that broke only cost me $7 from the flea market
Had an extra one that I wanted to use up. Ferm was fast and the trub was very compact.
Sorry about your accident.
ElevenBrewCo
Well-Known Member
im sure this has been covered in this but dont feel like looking through 120 pages....
can store bought applejuice be used say from walmart?
My local apple orchard doesnt open until July.
Thanks
can store bought applejuice be used say from walmart?
My local apple orchard doesnt open until July.
Thanks
CA-LT1
Well-Known Member
Walmart juice has been working for me. I'm going to try and find juice without added vitamin C though, I think it causes a tart taste
impur
Well-Known Member
I get mine at Costco.
After reading countless pages of this post, I made up my mind to give this a go (Actually I had decided after Brandon's description, just kept reading to get all the advice I could.)
Followed Skybrew's AG recipe on page 46 using fuggles and Nottingham. OG of 1.055. It's been 24 hours since pitch and I am gnawing my fingernails just waiting for 2 weeks to past.
I think I will just start another batch off this yeast because I want to get as much bottled before summer temps hit NYC.
Cheers to us Graffers!
Followed Skybrew's AG recipe on page 46 using fuggles and Nottingham. OG of 1.055. It's been 24 hours since pitch and I am gnawing my fingernails just waiting for 2 weeks to past.
I think I will just start another batch off this yeast because I want to get as much bottled before summer temps hit NYC.
Cheers to us Graffers!
me too
1st round i bought the Treetop apple juice ($6.49 for 2 x 1 Gal)...
this time around i sprang for the Kirkland "Fresh Pressed" ($8.XX for 2 x 1 Gal)
rycov
Well-Known Member
just made this but added two cinnamon sticks and a vanilla bean last five minutes of the boil. smelled amazing and tasted really really good prefermentation. two weeks and i'll see how it tastes post ferment! i'll let you guys know
So it would appear that I've struck by the accursed I-word, i.e. the bane of the newbie (and experienced brewer) and have cultured my very first infected batch.
I took a reading of my graff about 5 days after fermentation to find that it still had a little ways to go (it was at 1.03) but that it tasted great, if a little too sweet, as expected. Unfortunately, as I went to rack it to a secondary to free up a primary for a pale ale I made yesterday, I was shocked to find that it was surprisingly sour up front given that it was shaping up to be very tasty and entirely devoid of sourness not 3 days prior. I'm guessing my too-frequent dipping for samples must have somehow contaminated it
I'm going to keep aging it and see what happens, but I'm not holding out much hope. Has anyone ever had a sour tasting batch that came back to drinkability? I figure I may as well sit on it in case it turns into some funky sort of quasi-apple lambic type concoction..
I took a reading of my graff about 5 days after fermentation to find that it still had a little ways to go (it was at 1.03) but that it tasted great, if a little too sweet, as expected. Unfortunately, as I went to rack it to a secondary to free up a primary for a pale ale I made yesterday, I was shocked to find that it was surprisingly sour up front given that it was shaping up to be very tasty and entirely devoid of sourness not 3 days prior. I'm guessing my too-frequent dipping for samples must have somehow contaminated it
I'm going to keep aging it and see what happens, but I'm not holding out much hope. Has anyone ever had a sour tasting batch that came back to drinkability? I figure I may as well sit on it in case it turns into some funky sort of quasi-apple lambic type concoction..
Gnarboots123
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I cannot find torrified wheat and was wondering if it is crucial to the process. Please Respond!
Gnarboots123
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Do i need to prime while bottling
The torrified wheat is used for head retention and doesn't affect the flavor of the cider. It can be omitted.
You need to prime before bottling if you want your cider to be carbonated. Use the standard amount of priming sugar/DME (usually 1oz per gallon.) Otherwise, bottle and drink it still.
Enjoy!
You need to prime before bottling if you want your cider to be carbonated. Use the standard amount of priming sugar/DME (usually 1oz per gallon.) Otherwise, bottle and drink it still.
Enjoy!
CA-LT1
Well-Known Member
I believe torrified wheat IS flaked wheat
rycov
Well-Known Member
from what i could find (quick google search) torrefied wheat is "popped" while flaked wheat is rolled. read that there was a slight flavor difference. but with this small amount it probably doesn't matter. we're just using it for head retention anyway.
I've got three bombers left, so I decided to do a side-by-side with Hornsby's Draft Amber. No question, I can never go back. My only regret is that I used store brand apple juice instead of something tastier. You can taste the juice in the final product, so don't be cheap.
Still, in comparison the Hornsby's is like a syrupy wine cooler. My Graff is delicious.
Still, in comparison the Hornsby's is like a syrupy wine cooler. My Graff is delicious.
This thread is like torture right now. I've got a batch inspired by this recipe that is ready to bottle, and it's pretty good already.
My current test batch is a maple oatmeal "cider" (testing with juice since real cider isn't available w/o preservatives right now). The recipe needs a bit of work though. My grain bill was too high on the oatmeal (laugh at the noob using 60% oatmeal in a mini mash ), which made getting a good conversion a major chore. Even after that it had a murky look to it (is that normal with oatmeal? it was my first time using it). If oatmeal just sort of does that, it's still not a deal breaker to me unless cider really clears.
Other things aren't quite where I want them either. I didn't get as much of a maple note as I was hoping for (I'll prime a few bottles with syrup in hopes of increasing that). I'd also go for a bit more hoppiness. I used a 1/4oz of Cascade for 30 min and it didn't cut it for me on a 2 gallon batch. Then again, I might just be jumping the gun on this and these flavors will come out in conditioning.
My current test batch is a maple oatmeal "cider" (testing with juice since real cider isn't available w/o preservatives right now). The recipe needs a bit of work though. My grain bill was too high on the oatmeal (laugh at the noob using 60% oatmeal in a mini mash
), which made getting a good conversion a major chore. Even after that it had a murky look to it (is that normal with oatmeal? it was my first time using it). If oatmeal just sort of does that, it's still not a deal breaker to me unless cider really clears.Other things aren't quite where I want them either. I didn't get as much of a maple note as I was hoping for (I'll prime a few bottles with syrup in hopes of increasing that). I'd also go for a bit more hoppiness. I used a 1/4oz of Cascade for 30 min and it didn't cut it for me on a 2 gallon batch. Then again, I might just be jumping the gun on this and these flavors will come out in conditioning.
