Forget about clean gear and infect everything?

[jmhbutler]

I've been brewing for about a decade and several years I got into mixed fermentation brewing which reinvigorated my passion.

While brewing, I have been very diligent to maintain separate "clean" and "wild" gear, taking every precaution to eliminate cross-contamination.

I run with about 6 fermenters (2 of which are exclusively Sacch.) and 3 taps (also 2 of which are exclusively Sacch.)

Recently, I've been tormented by the temptation to forget separating my wild beer and just run everything on the same plastics and same gear.

Any clean beer I produce is always on tap within a month and consumed several weeks thereafter. I've experimented putting clean beer through my Brett./Sour taps and kegs and have notice no signs of sour or funkiness. I've also purposely inoculated clean beer with Brett. and have had to wait months to achieve a notable funkiness.

Considering my 100% Sacch beers are consumed so quickly, can anybody bring to light any issues I may be overlooking by deciding to eliminate the separation?

 

[max384]

Disclaimer: I don't brew sours, and don't care for them personally.

However, if your beers are drank this quickly, I wouldn't think twice about not separating your taps, as they'll be cold and drank before any souring could take place.

If you decide to mix your gear, try to make a non-sour on your sour equipment first. If it gets "infected," you know that you shouldn't mix them, and no big deal to go back. If you make a sour on your non-sour gear first, you can't go back if there are "infections."

 

[jmhbutler]

Thanks Max384.

As a matter of fact I have no fear of accidental souring. Lactobacillus Delbrueckii cannot produce lactic acid in an environment with an IBU above 5. Lactobacillus Brevis and Pediococcus are a little more hop-tolerant but still are severely limited beyond 10 IBU.

It is only accidental funkiness that I'm concerned about.

 

[mesooohoppy]

Im sure someone will tell me im a terrible person for doing this, but i don't measure my star san/pbw before cleaning/sanitizing. I just put a little bit in the fermentor and start cleaning/sanitizing.

Ive never had a problem with infections. Although, i am sure i am using a slightly higher concentrated mixture of pbw and star san. I just make sure its cleaned/sanitized thoroughly and rinse as appropriate. Accidental infections are not an issue for me.

Also worth nothing i do not go out of my way to mix my wild and non wild gear. But i have used my racking cane and bottling attachments and all is well. I actually bought a second bottling attachment for sours and forgot to label it, so i don't know which is which. D'oh!

 

[max384]

Thanks Max384.

As a matter of fact I have no fear of accidental souring. Lactobacillus Delbrueckii cannot produce lactic acid in an environment with an IBU above 5. Lactobacillus Brevis and Pediococcus are a little more hop-tolerant but still are severely limited beyond 10 IBU.

It is only accidental funkiness that I'm concerned about.

Interesting. I didn't realize the souring bugs were so IBU sensitive.

 

[troglodytes]

What about stir bars? I wasn't thinking and used my stir bar for a brett starter. I know starters are where you are most concerned with sanitization, so does that mean no more sacch with that stir bar?

 

[mesooohoppy]

What about stir bars? I wasn't thinking and used my stir bar for a brett starter. I know starters are where you are most concerned with sanitization, so does that mean no more sacch with that stir bar?

see my post a couple of posts up. clean and sanitize thoroughly and you will be fine.

I have a 1L and 2L flask that have both been used with Brett. I have since then made sacc starters in both without any issues or contamination.

its all in your cleaning/sanitization regimen.

 

[jfolks]

Anybody ever had any problems with infecting clean beers via a blichmann bottling gun that has ran both clean and funky beers through it?

 

[sweetcell]

Lactobacillus Brevis and Pediococcus are a little more hop-tolerant but still are severely limited beyond 10 IBU.

according to the MTF wiki, "Pediococcus species and strains are generally resistant to hop compounds, and have been reported to grow in beer with at least 30 IBU (...)
While able to grow in the presence of hops, the presence of hops still inhibits P. damnosus. For example, one study found that in the presence of 15 IBU, lactic acid production was reduced by ~82%."

http://www.milkthefunk.com/wiki/Pediococcus#Hop_Resistance

What about stir bars? I wasn't thinking and used my stir bar for a brett starter. I know starters are where you are most concerned with sanitization, so does that mean no more sacch with that stir bar?

stir bars are made to be autoclaved, so you can boil them. a few seconds in boiling water will kill anything on the stir bar.

Anybody ever had any problems with infecting clean beers via a blichmann bottling gun that has ran both clean and funky beers through it?

i would think that the same rules apply: if you keep the bottles cold and drink them quickly, you should be fine. but if you store them warm i would expect souring and/or funkiness at some point.