First AG batch- NO STARCH TO SUGAR CONVERSION?

[Tuckahoe]

Just brewed my first AG batch and it didn't work!

I took a gravity reading after my wort chilled and it was 1.012. Why so low?

Recipe:
10 lbs Crisp 2 row pale malt
1 lb muntons 2 row pale malt
1 lb weyermann CARRAMBER
.5 lb muntons dark crystal malt

I mashed in 4 gallons of water @168 degrees which cooled to 152 degrees when I closed it off and let it steep for one hour.

Looking at other posts I think I might have sparged too quickly. Is this a possible reason for my extremely low efficiency? Is it the grains I chose?

I started fermenting anyways. Is their anything I can do to salvage this batch at all? Can I add DME now?

someone help. Long brew day with no brew on the way! What did I do wrong?

 

[PoppinCaps]

I don't think there's any way you sparged too quickly and got that small of an OG. Can you elaborate on some of the details, volumes used, etc? Are you sure the hydrometer is working correctly and you compensated for temperature?

 

[two_hearted]

Did you crush/mill your grains?

 

[Yooper]

Did you crush/mill your grains?

How were the grains crushed, and when you used 168 degrees for the mash, you mean that was the temperature of the water when you stirred it into the grain, and it was at 152 after that? Or did it "sit" at 168 for a while first?

 

[kh54s10]

I assume the grain was milled.
You should have gotten far more than 1.012 from the mash alone.
I would guess that you got a faulty gravity reading.

 

[Tuckahoe]

I did crush the grains at the homebrew shop. I heated my strike water on the stove to 168 degrees and then added it to the cooler/mash tun. I mixed in grains and closed off the lid and let it sit when temp was down to 152 degrees. After sparging I boiled for one hour and cooled. I took gravity reading when yeast was ready to be pitched.

Is it possible I got an inaccurate gravity reading? Should I add some malt extract or should I leave it as is and hope for the best?

thanks for your responses

 

[SenorPepe]

Did you use any top-off water? I can't tell.

 

[Yooper]

I did crush the grains at the homebrew shop. I heated my strike water on the stove to 168 degrees and then added it to the cooler/mash tun. I mixed in grains and closed off the lid and let it sit when temp was down to 152 degrees. After sparging I boiled for one hour and cooled. I took gravity reading when yeast was ready to be pitched.

Is it possible I got an inaccurate gravity reading? Should I add some malt extract or should I leave it as is and hope for the best?

thanks for your responses

But when you mixed the grains and water initially, what was the temp? You say you "let it sit when the temp was down to 152 degrees", but if the mash was above 160 for 15 minutes before that you could have very easily denatured many of the enzymes needed for conversion.

 

[billdog]

So.....is it a good idea to have some amalayse on hand??

I have never heard of a hydrometer being inaccurate. Has fermentation started yet? If ur temp was above 160 for a long period of time you could have lost starch conversion for sure.

I like to have amalayse on hand and pitch some into mash once im at proper temp.

 

[Tuckahoe]

What does amalayse?

and yes, it is very possible that my temp was over 160 for at 15 minutes or longer. Did not know this could hinder it.

 

[g-star]

If the temp was over 160 for a significant amount of time, you might have denatured the enzymes necessary for starch conversion. Still, an OG of 1.012 is hard to believe. Double check your measurements

 

[Exbeerienced]

Did you TASTE the wort for sweetness? Was it sticky at all?

 

[mcl]

I did a quick run up in BeerSmith. I got 156 as the initial temp using 70 degree grains.

 

[J8D]

To echo SenorPepe, how much water did you top off with or rather, how large is the current volume?

I think you misread your hydrometer. What was the temperature when you took the reading???

 

[Yooper]

What does amalayse?

and yes, it is very possible that my temp was over 160 for at 15 minutes or longer. Did not know this could hinder it.

Yes, that's how you stop conversion- by getting the grainbed up to 168 degrees or higher. Usually, you're pretty safe at 160-162, but if your thermometer was off by even a couple of degrees you could have denatured the enzymes responsible for conversion.

 

[randomsample]

What temperature did you take your gravity reading at? Did the wort look drastically lighter or hazier than your extract brewing?

 

[PoppinCaps]

I might point out to the OP that your method of doughing in was correct, adding room temp grains to ~168F strike water, should give you a good mash temp. Like Yooper said, check the thermometer to make sure the strike water was not 175F or something. Though that still seems unlikely....

 

[SenorPepe]

I still think it's a top-off issue. If you mashed in 4 gallons of water, you're probably looking at about 2.5 gallons post boil? If that was your intended volume, 12.5 pounds of grain would be barleywine territory. So I'm guessing it's a 5 gallon batch, by diluting the post-boil volume and your wort got stratified, after which you took a non-representative sample from the top. Could be wrong, but that's my guess.

 

[Bobby_M]

There's a lot of guessing and speculation going on because of the limited info provided. It doesn't sound like he's topping off because he mentioned sparging, then boiling, then cooling. Sounds like a full reduction boil to me.

I agree with the guess that you took a sample of the wort that was sitting on top which would have been the lower gravity runnings (assuming again that he fly sparged). The only way I can think of that a true horribly low gravity like that would show up (if accurate) would be uncrushed grain, a mixup of grain (like unmalted grain in the 2-row bin?), messing up temps greater than 15F, ???? I just think you forgot to stir before taking the sample..



How DID you sparge and how much water did you use? Do you have a false bottom, braid or manifold?

 

[SenorPepe]

There's a lot of guessing and speculation going on because of the limited info provided. It doesn't sound like he's topping off because he mentioned sparging, then boiling, then cooling. Sounds like a full reduction boil to me.

I agree with the guess that you took a sample of the wort that was sitting on top which would have been the lower gravity runnings (assuming again that he fly sparged). The only way I can think of that a true horribly low gravity like that would show up (if accurate) would be uncrushed grain, a mixup of grain (like unmalted grain in the 2-row bin?), messing up temps greater than 15F, ???? I just think you forgot to stir before taking the sample..



How DID you sparge and how much water did you use? Do you have a false bottom, braid or manifold?

Oops yeah good point. I'm an idiot I thought this was a BIAB thread.

 

[Tuckahoe]

I tasted it and there was no sweetness or stickyness to it.

Thank you guys for your responses. This site is an incredible resource. It is not a top off issue. I did not add any water after the boil and I took my reading after the wort had cooled. After reading your ideas and a little research myself I believe I might have screwed up the milling process at the home brew shop. As dumb as it sounds I think i might have run them the wrong way and not fully cracked the grain open, exposing the starchy white inside. Live and learn but more importantly... Should I add some DME to the fermenter? I would love to salvage this batch if at all possible. I was thinking of boiling 6 lbs of extra light DME and either placing that directly in the fermenter or putting it into a secondary and siphoning my beer into the other vessel containing the disolved DME.
Thoughts...

again, thank you guys. I am fully hooked on this hobby (my friends love it too) and you are all helping with my trial and mostly error process.

 

[brewtus_]

I tasted it and there was no sweetness or stickyness to it.

Thank you guys for your responses. This site is an incredible resource. It is not a top off issue. I did not add any water after the boil and I took my reading after the wort had cooled. After reading your ideas and a little research myself I believe I might have screwed up the milling process at the home brew shop. As dumb as it sounds I think i might have run them the wrong way and not fully cracked the grain open, exposing the starchy white inside. Live and learn but more importantly... Should I add some DME to the fermenter? I would love to salvage this batch if at all possible. I was thinking of boiling 6 lbs of extra light DME and either placing that directly in the fermenter or putting it into a secondary and siphoning my beer into the other vessel containing the disolved DME.
Thoughts...

again, thank you guys. I am fully hooked on this hobby (my friends love it too) and you are all helping with my trial and mostly error process.

If you ran the rollers the wrong way, the grain would not have fallen out of the bottom of the grain mill. Did the grain come out the bottom or did you fish it out after a period of time?

 

[Yooper]

Well, whatever the cause, if the wort tastes ok (not astringent or harsh) you could add the boiled and cooled DME.

 

[Hang Glider]

Whatever the result - you can get a small bottle of iodine (behind the counter at your pharmacy - sign for it, because it's used for 'other' things) -

after you think your mash is done - drain a tiny bit, and put one drop of iodine into the sample. If it turns black - DO NOT CONTINUE until you remedy the problem. If it dissipates, you're good to go!

 

[pernox]

If you ran the rollers the wrong way, the grain would not have fallen out of the bottom of the grain mill. Did the grain come out the bottom or did you fish it out after a period of time?

It will on a Barley Crusher, though slowly. I know this because I did it the other day.

Thankfully, I realized wtf was going on when the grain wasn't dropping in the hopper as fast as usual. For a new user of a mill, it's entirely possible that he ran through a few pounds without realizing he was going backwards.

 

[two_hearted]

I tasted it and there was no sweetness or stickyness to it.

Thank you guys for your responses. This site is an incredible resource. It is not a top off issue. I did not add any water after the boil and I took my reading after the wort had cooled. After reading your ideas and a little research myself I believe I might have screwed up the milling process at the home brew shop. As dumb as it sounds I think i might have run them the wrong way and not fully cracked the grain open, exposing the starchy white inside. Live and learn but more importantly... Should I add some DME to the fermenter? I would love to salvage this batch if at all possible. I was thinking of boiling 6 lbs of extra light DME and either placing that directly in the fermenter or putting it into a secondary and siphoning my beer into the other vessel containing the disolved DME.
Thoughts...

again, thank you guys. I am fully hooked on this hobby (my friends love it too) and you are all helping with my trial and mostly error process.

The first time I crushed my grain at the LHBS the last person opened the gap up way too wide and I unknowingly barely crushed any grain. It was my first time doing so, so I didn't know the difference. Thankfully the employee told me I was an idiot. There mill is way too easy to change the gap... Next time you're in ask the shopkeep to show you how to use there mill the best way. I'm sure they'd be glad to help you.

 

[Bobby_M]

You won't make this mistake again. Keep in mind that a good crush is way more messy flour than slightly cracked grains.

 

[KuntzBrewing]

Look up chalk iodine test! It's the only way to know when your mash is done, 1 hr is a good estimate but everything is different in real life, look it up and its a test u can do for 3 bucks and will last years

 

[Tuckahoe]

I will be crushing properly and iodine testing in the future. Since the wort tasted good despite it being dry i decided to experiment a little with it. I split it into 2 smaller batches. One I boiled and disolved 6lbs of light DME and siphoned off some of my wort. With the other half I boiled, dissolved, cooled, and added 2 cups dark brown sugar, 2 cups light brown sugar, and 1 oz oak chips. No idea what any of the gravities were but we will see what happens. within 2 hours both had visible fermentation and bubbles in airlock.

only problem is when it is finished i don't know how much priming sugar to add. Each carboy has approximately 3.5 to 4 gallons. One with DME and one with brown sugar.

 

[two_hearted]

The DME and Brown sugar will fermented out in primary and won't affect your priming. Just prime with the normal amount you use but cut it down with the same ratio. If you use 3/4 (.75) cups sugar to 5 gal beer, you'll use .6 cups : 4gal or .525C : 3.5gal