Dry Hop Red Ale

[Boy]

First attempt at a dry hop red ale recipe. I'm using the St. Rogue as inspiration but do not want a clone. Looking for a deep red color, light sweetness, and stronger hop character. I think I want a little more bitterness for this but I'm not sure. Any critiquing would be greatly appreciated.


% LB OZ MALT OR FERMENTABLE PPG °L
83% 12 0 American Two-row Pale 37 1
8% 1 2 Weyermann CaraRed 33 20
5% 0 12 Weyermann Caramunich II 34 46
3% 0 8 Caramel/Crystal Malt - 60L 34 60
1% 0 2 Weyermann Roasted Barley 27 413
Total Mash: 14.8 lbs

Batch size: 6.0 gallons
Original Gravity: (1.060 estimated)
Final Gravity: (1.015 estimated)
Color: 14° SRM / 27° EBC(Copper to Red/Lt. Brown)
Mash Efficiency: (70% used for O.G. estimate)

hops
USE TIME OZ VARIETY FORM AA
boil 50 mins 0.5 Columbus (Tomahawk) pellet 14.0
boil 40 mins 0.25 Columbus (Tomahawk) pellet 14.0
boil 30 mins 0.25 Centennial pellet 10.0
boil 15 mins 0.25 Centennial pellet 10.0
boil 5 mins 0.75 Ahtanum pellet 6.0

dry hop 7 days 1.25 Amarillo pellet 7.0

Boil: 5.0 avg gallons for 60 minutes

Bitterness
35.4 IBU / 7 HBU
ƒ: Tinseth
BU:GU
0.59
yeast
Wyeast American Ale (1056)
ale yeast in liquid form with low to medium flocculation
Alcohol: (6.0% est. ABV / 5% est. ABW)

boil 10 min 1 tsp Irish Moss

 

[dcp27]

16% crystal is way too high if you only want a slight sweetness. I'd at least half it.

If you already have these hops and amounts, I'd use something closer to this for hop additions:
0.75oz Tomahawk @First Wort Hop
0.5oz Centennial @15mins
0.75oz Ahtanum @5mins
1.25oz Amarillo @dry hop
Should give you about the same IBUs but more hop character. Any reason initially doing a 50 and 40min add for Tomahawk?

 

[bolts]

The roasted barley might be a bit strong. I'd be concerned about a roast bitterness coming through.

I made a clone of 'Gordon' (Oskar Blues) a month ago. I really like the original beer and the clone. I haven't tasted them side-by-side yet, but it's quite tasty. Gordon is a big beer at 8.7% but very drinkable. Sticky sweet red ale + bitterness + amarillo.

http://hopville.com/recipe/305967/imperial-ipa-recipes/gordon-clone

I missed my efficiency (still trying to dial in bigger batches) and ended up with an OG of 1.078 and FG of 1.018 (7.9% ABV).

malt & fermentables
%        LB        OZ        MALT OR FERMENTABLE        PPG        °L
80%      14        0         American Two-row Pale       37          1
8%        1        7         Caramel/Crystal Malt - 40L  34         40
6%        1        1         Munich Malt                 37          9
6%        1        1         Carastan                    34         30
0%        0        .125      Chocolate Malt (US)         28        350
         17        9.12

hops
USE        TIME        OZ       VARIETY         FORM    AA
boil        80 mins    0.75     Northern Brewer leaf     8.5
boil        10 mins    4.0      Columbus        leaf    12.0
dry hop      7 days    2.0      Amarillo        leaf     7.0

edit: recipe is from can you brew it

 

[Boy]

Thanks for the info and ideas. I was working off of info I got saying a Red ale should have around 15% crystal malts but cutting it down sounds like a much better idea. Looking at it again I really like the idea of only doing the first wort hop for bitterness. No real reason for the 50 and 40min additions, I was just trying to keep the bitterness in check while bringing forward the hops later. I added the roasted barley to add a stronger red color.
Thanks for the help.

 

[enid]

Carared does not act like a normal caramel/crystal malt. I have used up to 2lbs in a 5 gal. batch and it does not add that sweet taste and it seems to ferment out unlike other crystal malts. I believe Denny Conn's Waldo Lake Amber uses around 2lbs also. This does go good in a red ale.

Here is a link for a red I just posted. Nice deep red color. As stated this works very well with different hop varieties.

 

[Boy]

So after toying with this one a little more I think I have settled with this. After reading about the benefits of hop bursting and first wort hopping for smoothing out the bitterness while balancing out the hops and malt I believe this is exactly what I was searching for in the above post. Any experience with FWH and bursting in a single brew would still be greatly appreciated. I'm also now considering this an India Red(pale) Ale since it doesn't really fit into the amber ale category.

Batch size: 5.0 gallons
Original Gravity: 1.061
Final Gravity: 1.016
15° SRM / 30° EBC
Bitterness 62.9 IBU
BU:GU 1.03
6.0% ABV / 5% ABW
Mash Efficiency 75%

Grain

83% 9 8 American Two-row Pale 37 3
11% 1 4 Weyermann CaraRed 33 20
3% 0 5 American Crystal 80L 33 80
3% 0 5 Weyermann Caramunich III 34 57
1% 0 2 Weyermann Roasted Barley 27 413

hops

first wort 60+ mins 0.25 Perle pellet 8.0
boil 60 mins 0.25 Perle pellet 8.0
boil 15 mins 0.75 Centennial pellet 10.0
boil 10 mins 0.5 Columbus pellet 15.4
boil 10 mins 0.75 Centennial pellet 10.0
boil 5 mins 0.5 Centennial pellet 10.0
boil 5 mins 0.5 Columbus pellet 15.4
dry hop 7 days 1.0 Amarillo pellet 7.0
dry hop 7 days 0.5 Centennial pellet 10.0

Boil: 6.8 avg gallons for 60 minutes

Safale US-05 Dry Yeast

 

[enid]

The only concern I see is the FWH addition. Normally a flavor / aroma hop is used not a bittering hop. FWH is similiar to a 20 minute addition in flavor, aroma, and IBU's. If it were me I would be adding about an oz of Amarillo or maybe Centennial instead of Perle. You usually want your FWH to be about about 30% of your total hop additions. Also I didnt calculate your hop additions but a .25 oz of FWH is only going to add maybe 3-4 IBU's as it should be calculated as a 20 minute addition. If you do a search on First Wort Hopping there are many good articles on it, and it will give you a better understanding of how it works.

 

[dcp27]

The only concern I see is the FWH addition. Normally a flavor / aroma hop is used not a bittering hop. FWH is similiar to a 20 minute addition in flavor, aroma, and IBU's. If it were me I would be adding about an oz of Amarillo or maybe Centennial instead of Perle. You usually want your FWH to be about about 30% of your total hop additions. Also I didnt calculate your hop additions but a .25 oz of FWH is only going to add maybe 3-4 IBU's as it should be calculated as a 20 minute addition. If you do a search on First Wort Hopping there are many good articles on it, and it will give you a better understanding of how it works.

FWH is only perceived as a 20min addition, but it produces approximately 10% more IBUs than a standard 60min add. The way I look at it is balance-wise it is like a 60+min add, but harshness-wise it is like a 20min add. I'd combine the 2 perle adds into one FWH if you decide to stick with perle there.

 

[enid]

FWH is only perceived as a 20min addition, but it produces approximately 10% more IBUs than a standard 60min add. The way I look at it is balance-wise it is like a 60+min add, but harshness-wise it is like a 20min add.

Correct. Tested IBU's are about 10% more then a 60 min addition. I should have stated I calculate them as a 20min. addition, as this is what the perceived bitterness is.

I'd combine the 2 perle adds into one FWH if you decide to stick with perle there.

I think this would work also.

 

[Boy]

Thanks for the input. I like the idea of only doing the FWH better actually. While I have read articles about the percentage of hop bills for FWH, I am going more off of other percentages involved in hop bursting where most brewers aim for 10 or less IBU's from 60 min adds and get all of their IBU's from 20 min or later additions.