DME vs LME.

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DreBourbon

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I'm a new brewer and I'm still using extract kits ( I know, saving up for a tun) and was wondering what if any differences between dry and liquid malt extract?. Tks
 
Goods question. I moved it out of the Chit Chat area because it's more appropriate in the Extract Brewing forum, and anyway you are likely to get a bunch of nonsense in the Chit Chat area.

Now, on to your Question!

DME, or Dry Malt Extract, or even SprayMalt, generally has a longer shelf life, can be processed to a color more closely resembling All Grain color, and is lighter to carry and store.

LME, or Liquid Malt Extract, is a malt syrup that generally isn't as shelf stable, tends to be darker than the equivalent All Grain color, and weighs more.

Since DME is lighter, you get more "points" of gravity per pound, so you use less by weight. 1:1.25 in general IIRC.

I think most people tend to prefer the taste of LME over DME, but of course only you can know what you like. But I think that's why kits tend to come with both forms even though DME would last longer and weight less for shipping.
 
1) you can make great beer from extract
2) dme also comes in different amounts, helping to supplement to get the gravity needed. A key with LME is freshness, make sure you get it from a place with high turnover
 
Some LHBS will sell bulk LME (fill up a bucket with as much or as little as you want), so you can feel a little more confident that you're getting fresh stuff.

One additional concern with LME is that it tends to sink to the bottom of the brewpot when you add it. You need to either take the pot off the heat source for each addition, or be very careful to avoid scorching, which will affect the flavor and color of your finished beer (and is a pain in the butt to clean off the pot). DME floats mostly towards the top of the boil until mixed in, so that's less of a concern.

I became much happier with my extract results when I switched to DME. Every once in a while, I've found it necessary to use LME, since specialty malts like Maris Otter and Munich usually only show up as liquid variants. Although, since I started doing partial mashes, I handle the specialty grains that way and just use basic light or pilsen DME as the backbone.
 
I use mostly LME and generally buy only what I plan to use within three months so it will be fresh. Take the kettle off the heat before adding it and then stir it in really well before putting it back on the heat. Adding a third to half in the original boil and the rest at flameout seems to help a lot. Using these techniques, I get good flavor and color.
 
The reason I ask is because my local brew store (Defaulco 's) LME turns all my batches into a "red colour". Tried using dextrose and it's fine but I wanna experiment with more options. I bought a Morgan's Canadian IPA and some of Defaulco s Amber Malt extract. Now...I know I don't have to boil the kit but I was thinking of boiling the wort and adding some Northern Brewer and SAAZ hop pellets. Any suggestions on how to proceed?. I basically want to make the extract kit better.
 
Not a seasoned expert when it comes to brewing but I have made a host of meads and wines... and I don't know why you could not boil your hops in water and then add the LME or the DME to the hopped water at the end of the boil (even if you were boiling the water for 60 minutes ). I do understand - although I have no way of testing that this is not an old wives tale - that you can utilize more of the alpha acids if the pH of the water is at the pH that the water would be if you added wort but I have made hopped mead several times and although I cannot measure the bitterness I have never had any problem with that when I make a hop tea - and certainly flavor and aroma does not seem to be challenged if you simply boil the hops in the water.
Bottom line - make a tea with the hops and then add your malt extract and heat/boil to sanitize.
 
DreBourbon said:
The reason I ask is because my local brew store (Defaulco 's) LME turns all my batches into a "red colour". Tried using dextrose and it's fine but I wanna experiment with more options. I bought a Morgan's Canadian IPA and some of Defaulco s Amber Malt extract. Now...I know I don't have to boil the kit but I was thinking of boiling the wort and adding some Northern Brewer and SAAZ hop pellets. Any suggestions on how to proceed?. I basically want to make the extract kit better.
Click to expand...

When you use the LME, at what point in the boil do you add it: all at the beginning? Split between beginning and late additions?
 
To be honest I'm still new and I'm using can kits that don't require boiling. It's super simple and I want to stir away from that. You add water, your canned extract and a fermentable sugar and pitch your yeast (which I rehidrate) and that's it. Iknow...lame.
 
I love using DME for brewing partial extract and grain batches since DME is much less messy and stays fresher longer. With LME you need to store it in a refrigerator versus DME can be stored in a dark, cool closet. DME is also much easier to add versus trying to get every last bit of the LME into the kettle.
 
Hey, I'm not judging. If you get results that you like from it, game on. But, I am surprised you get a consistent darkening effect from it, unless they are using amber LME to account for the lack of steeped grains. That would do it. Unfortunately, it also makes it difficult to have much control over what styles you can brew. Try getting some light unhopped extract and steeping specialty grains for color and flavor. You should see a bit of an increase in quality that way.
 
There is a fairly extensive thread about an extract "twang" flavor that comes from using LME that is old or otherwise compromised. One of the posters added a chart of the associated risks and solutions to make the best of your extract brews.

https://www.homebrewtalk.com/showthread.php?t=553907

My gut said that LME was better, but I think I will stick to DME while extract brewing due to the forgiving nature of it. Just so you know, I'm a new brewer too.

I read a book called The Complete Joy of Homebrewing and the author suggests that even when it says you can brew without boiling, he believes it tastes better as well as there being other advantages, but I think you should do whatever the heck you want since it's your house.:tank:
 
No offense. Been brewing for 2 months and I'm open to all suggestions. My local brew shop is limited and to export is expensive.
 
Sailingeric said:
I find at my LHBS that DME is a lot more cost wise over LME to achieve the same ABV in beer. :tank:
Click to expand...

DreBourbon said:
Also the DME is twice the price of the LME here.
Click to expand...

That's odd... 3 lb bags of DME are $13 & 3.3 lb cans of LME are $13 here. You can't get LME in any smaller amount than the 3.3 pound can, while DME is $5 for 1-pound bag. I wonder why you are paying double-price for DME...
 
Well. LME is 7.99$ and DME was12.99$ here in Ontario Canada for 1kg. Also a 24 of beer is 44$. Now you know why I make extract kits lol
 
DreBourbon said:
The reason I ask is because my local brew store (Defaulco 's) LME turns all my batches into a "red colour". Tried using dextrose and it's fine but I wanna experiment with more options. I bought a Morgan's Canadian IPA and some of Defaulco s Amber Malt extract. Now...I know I don't have to boil the kit but I was thinking of boiling the wort and adding some Northern Brewer and SAAZ hop pellets. Any suggestions on how to proceed?. I basically want to make the extract kit better.
Click to expand...

Don't boil the kit, or you may screw up the hop profile. Boil the rest and add any hops to that. Add the kit after removing from heat.
 
slym2none said:
That's odd... 3 lb bags of DME are $13 & 3.3 lb cans of LME are $13 here. You can't get LME in any smaller amount than the 3.3 pound can, while DME is $5 for 1-pound bag. I wonder why you are paying double-price for DME...
Click to expand...
I bring a bucket and get as much LME at $1.95 a pound.
 
I would do a 10 litre boil with the lme and hops then chuck that in the fermenter add the kit, topup to say 21 litres then pitch the yeast once it's cooled... Did a heap of these when starting out and to be honest if you let it ferment for a few weeks before bottling and keep the temp stable over that time it should come out sweet... Temp control is the key with these types of brews...
 
DreBourbon said:
Tks
Click to expand...

Hey DreBourbon

I'm just going to throw this in here as you mentioned saving for your mash-tun a couple of times so it would appear you are considering going to all grain at some point.

You may have already considered and discarded the idea but another option to allow mashing grains and save you money on buying DME or LME would be using the Brew in a bag method.

$4 will get you all the added equipment you need for 2.5 to 3 gallon stove-top batches.

Like I said, just throwing the idea in here to be kicked around/discarded etc.


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Best of luck with your brewing
 
Another Ontario homebrewer here. The places I buy from tend to sell LME and DME for $14-15 which nets you a 3.3 lb can of LME or 3 lbs of DME. Where are you buying from?
 
DreBourbon said:
The reason I ask is because my local brew store (Defaulco 's) LME turns all my batches into a "red colour". Tried using dextrose and it's fine but I wanna experiment with more options. I bought a Morgan's Canadian IPA and some of Defaulco s Amber Malt extract. Now...I know I don't have to boil the kit but I was thinking of boiling the wort and adding some Northern Brewer and SAAZ hop pellets. Any suggestions on how to proceed?. I basically want to make the extract kit better.
Click to expand...

You are obviously in the Ottawa area... DME at Defalcos is way too expensive relative to http://www.beergrains.com/ , and they do free delivery to Ottawa.
 
I know but if you include shipping and the waiting around I'd rather just go to the store.
 
DreBourbon said:
I know but if you include shipping and the waiting around I'd rather just go to the store.
Click to expand...

Defalcos:

Amber DME, 500g - $7.29 = $1.458/100g
1kg $12.79 = $1.249/100g
shipping = $0.00

Beer Grains:

Amber DME, 1lb (454g) - $4.29 = $0.945/100g
3lb (1.36kg) $11.99 = $0.881/100g
shipping = $0.00

So ~ $3 cheaper by the pound and no shipping to Ottawa - you obviously did not read what I wrote very closely.

If you want to pay 145% to 154% more, fill your boots. I am OK with planning ahead for the bi-weekly FREE delivery and getting more beer for my money.

Weren't you complaining about the high cost of DME? (Your post #8, #21, as well as several other comments, for reference)
 
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