Cumberland's Red Dragon; English IPA

[Sulli]

I just put together a recipe for an English IPA, that I want to brew this weekend.
I thought I'd run it past the HBT community, get your thoughts, opinions and/or advice.

Name: Cumberland's Red Dragon
Style: English IPA
Batch Size: 5.50 gal
Estimated Original Gravity: 1.064
Estimated Final Gravity: 1.016
Estimated Color: 13.4 SRM
Bitterness: 60.2 IBU
Estimated Alcohol by Volume: 6.4 %
Single Infusion Mash @ 152
Ferment mid 60's

Ingredients Amount Item Type % or IBU
10.00 lb Pale Malt, Maris Otter UK (3.0 SRM) Grain 84.2 %
1.25 lb Crystal 40L (40 SRM) Grain 10.5%
0.50 lb Toasted Malt (27.0 SRM) Grain 4.2 %
0.12 lb Chocolate Malt (450.0 SRM) Grain 1.0 %
.75 oz Target [11.00%] (60 min) Hops 24.8 IBU
4.00 oz Goldings, East Kent [5.00%] (10 min) Hops 21.8 IBU
3.00 oz Challenger [7.50%] (5 min) Hops 13.5 IBU
1 Pkg Burton Ale (White Labs #WLP023) [1000 ml]

 

[ajf]

I'd use a smaller amount of darker crystal (about 8 - 12 oz of crystal 60 - 80, or 8 oz light crystal and 4 oz crystal 120 or so). I'd also drop the chocolate. That would result in a lighter colored beer with a slightly lower FG, but of course, that is probably not not what you want.
As for the hops, I'd add 1 oz Challenger at 60 minutes, together with the Target, and 1 oz Challenger at 20 and 15 minutes, then add 1 oz EKG at 10, 5, and 0 minutes, leaving an oz of EKG for dry hopping. That would bump up the IBUs way beyond the style guidelines, and it wouldn't really be typical for a modern English IPA, but it's what I like. I would also bump up the MO by another couple pounds, to offset the bitterness. Again, probably not what you want.
Actually, I've never used Challenger, so I don't know how that would work out. I use EKG exclusively for the late hop additions.
WLP023 is a fantastic yeast for an English IPA, and I can heartily recommend it.
For a contemporary English IPA, I think that 4 oz EKG at 10 minutes and 3 oz Challenger at 5 minutes is rather over the top, but I'm also sure that I would like it, although it is not typical.

-a.

 

[Sulli]

Thanks for the input ajf, the only reason the chocolate is in there is to give it a slightly red tinge. LHBS was out of crystal 40 so I'm substituting crystal 60, and they didn't have any toasted malt so I'm using amber.
I dropped the chocolate a tiny bit to adjust for color.
After smelling the hops I decided the EKG is the better hop for aroma, more floral and slightly sweet, the Challenger is more spicy and earthy with just a hint of floral. They're both killer though.
I realize the huge late hop additions are unorthodox, I've been experimenting with pulling the majority of my IBU's out of the finishing hops, and although it's a little more money, I have really liked the results. Very smooth bitterness, and just busting with flavor and aroma, it pretty much eliminates the need for dry hopping.
Glad to hear the WLP023 is a good choice, as I've never used it before.

Here is the final recipe. Will be brewing it Sunday.

Name: Cumberland's Red Dragon
Style: English IPA
Batch Size: 5.50 gal
Brewhouse Efficiency 80%
Estimated Original Gravity: 1.064
Estimated Final Gravity: 1.016
Estimated Color: 14 SRM
Bitterness: 59.2 IBU
BU:GU 0.931
Estimated Alcohol by Volume: 6.3 %
Single Infusion Mash @ 152
Primary for 1 week @ 68*
Primary for 1 week @ 74*
Keg

Ingredients Amount Item Type % or IBU
9.97 lb Pale Malt, Maris Otter UK (3.0 SRM) Grain [85.6 %]
1.15 lb Crystal 60L (60 SRM) Grain [9.9%]
0.44 lb Amber Malt (27.0 SRM) Grain [3.8 %]
0.09 lb Chocolate Malt (450.0 SRM) Grain [0.8 %]
0.63 oz Target [10.70%] (60 min) Hops [23.3 IBU]
2.52 oz Challenger [7.20%] (10 min) Hops [22.7 IBU]
3.46 oz Goldings, East Kent [5.50%] (5 min) Hops [13.1 IBU]
1 Pkg Burton Ale (White Labs #WLP023) w/ 1000 ml stirred starter

 

[ghpeel]

Careful with that WLP023, it will cause a blow off if you don't watch it, even in the recommended temp range. I'm using it on 2 beers now (one just kegged, one in primary now) and they both had massive blow offs.

 

[Sulli]

Good to know. I'm using a starter, so I expect there will probably be some blow-off, I shall prepare accordingly. Thanks.

 

[ajf]

Careful with that WLP023, it will cause a blow off if you don't watch it, even in the recommended temp range. I'm using it on 2 beers now (one just kegged, one in primary now) and they both had massive blow offs.

Yup, Only time I've ever had a blow off with a 5g batch in a 6.5g carboy was with that yeast. Luckily, I had bought a blow off tube about a month before to handle a 5.25g batch in a 6g carboy.

-a.

 

[cwhouston]

Sulli - how did that beer come out? Looks interesting with the large late additions of English hops.

 

[Sulli]

The hop profile was nice, but I wasn't happy with the rest of the flavor profile. If I were to brew it again,, I'd probably do as ajf suggested and drop the chocolate malt, then substitute crystal 40 for the amber malt.

 

[ghpeel]

I often hear the "80/10/10" rule for British Ales, meaning 80% base malt, 10% sugar (table, brown, raw, etc) and 10% crystal (mix of light and dark). A lot of people swear by that ratio. I personally don't want any roast/toast character in my pale British beers, so that mix sounds right.