Cream Ale Questions

[rodwha]

I’ve brewed a few of these and have used 6-row as my base grain and usually 2 lbs of flaked corn in 5.5 gal batches, until recently where the volume was a bit lower and 1 lb was used giving it a lower ratio. But what I noticed was a more pronounced corn flavor, which I thought peculiar.

My understanding was 6-row had plenty of diastatic power but with a low percentage of adjunct why would I care?

I also thought I had read long ago that it was comparable in flavor to Pilsner malt, but with what I’ve read recently it talked about the “grainy” flavor 6-row gives. Kinda doubting it’s like Pilsner at all.

I’m liking the idea of something like part flaked corn part minute rice. Assuming equal parts what percentage would be considered somewhat minimal and still get the characteristics?

I usually carb mine up to 2.7 or 2.8 vols. What is typical for others here?

I was reading a bit about pre-prohibition cream ales and a bit stronger with a bit more hop character is right where I’d rather be as I usually bypass even blondes unless there’s something to make it stand out. But I make them for others knowing I’ll have a bunch on hand that I’ll have to drink too.

 

[GilSwillBasementBrews]

I could be wrong but I believe 6row has enough diastatic power to convert itself but with adjuncts you want to use 2 row as it has a higher diastatic power. I could be wrong and if so will be corrected by those that know more than I.

 

[Robert65]

6 row used to have much higher diastatic power than the older 2 row varieties, so it was favored by adjunct brewers. Modern North American 2 row malt is indistinguishable from 6 row in terms of enzymes, but has less husk and so yields more extract and less tannins. For this reason 6 row is quickly going the way of the dinosaurs.

 

[rodwha]

6 row used to have much higher diastatic power than the older 2 row varieties, so it was favored by adjunct brewers. Modern North American 2 row malt is indistinguishable from 6 row in terms of enzymes, but has less husk and so yields more extract and less tannins. For this reason 6 row is quickly going the way of the dinosaurs.

Wow! I have never seen that. Everything I’ve read said 6-row was the only way to go if using lots of adjuncts.

I’m wondering if it’s tannins that give it this flavor I get, which I take to be grainy. It’s why I’ve been contemplating using plain 2-row or pale ale malt (which is mostly what I use in my beers). But pale ale malt, from what I’ve read has a bit more of a bready flavor vs 2-row and so I’ve thought 2-row might be what I should try if not Pilsner malt.

I’ve been meaning to do a few side by side comparisons of base malts to see just what I notice.

 

[balrog]

@rodwha , I like a good cream ale and I have tried a few. I used Josh Weikert's Make Your Best, but it's just kegged and I have no review yet. It is interesting as being the only cream ale recipe I have come across with *NO* rice or corn (?!). Otherwise I can definitely recommend @Yooper 's Dad's Cream Ale recipe. I'll have to Google to find it and link it in, but I like it because it's finished with Cascade.

 

[rodwha]

@rodwha , I like a good cream ale and I have tried a few. I used Josh Weikert's Make Your Best, but it's just kegged and I have no review yet. It is interesting as being the only cream ale recipe I have come across with *NO* rice or corn (?!). Otherwise I can definitely recommend @Yooper 's Dad's Cream Ale recipe. I'll have to Google to find it and link it in, but I like it because it's finished with Cascade.

Well, now you have my curiosity piqued. What adjunct did they use (or not?)?

Cream of Three Crops (Beirmuncher?) is along the lines I was thinking of working off of, but I’d be interested in both the beer you mention, as well as Yooper’s.

I must say I really like Cascade, but with very low hop flavor and no real aroma for the style I’m wondering how it would be noticed. I usually use Liberty or Willamette.

 

[balrog]

I linked Josh's. It uses Pils malt and 1/2 lb of sugar. That's it for the grist. I am trying to find the Yooper Dad one.

 

[rodwha]

If I had a Bud and a Coors which would you take?

 

[balrog]

found the link. Here. If @Yooper is around she will hop in (no pun intended) and correct anything I mis-did.

It's a really good lighter, easy drinking, fun with the tennis crowd, beer.

 

[brewbama]

I’ve brewed my riff on NB’s Cream Ale recipe. Though unorthodox it turns out well.

83% Pale malt
5% Honey malt
1% Victory
10% corn sugar

25 IBU Cluster @60

MJ Cali Common

 

[Robert65]

@rodwha , I like a good cream ale and I have tried a few. I used Josh Weikert's Make Your Best, but it's just kegged and I have no review yet. It is interesting as being the only cream ale recipe I have come across with *NO* rice or corn (?!). Otherwise I can definitely recommend @Yooper 's Dad's Cream Ale recipe. I'll have to Google to find it and link it in, but I like it because it's finished with Cascade.

Pre prohibition (and post to some degree) it was fairly standard practice to use corn adjunct in lagers, but dextrose in ales. I suppose it makes sense, in that ale yeast could contribute its own perception of sweetness and fuller body, so the creamy character of the corn could be a bit much in a lighter beer, whereas it nicely rounded out a lager. Otherwise standard lagers and cream ales would be virtually identical WRT malt and hopping.

 

[NTexBrewer]

My cream ale recipe is

52% 6-row
32% Pale Ale Malt (3.5L)
16% Flaked Corn

Cluster at 60 minutes for 17 IBU’s
1 oz Cluster at flameout (5 gallon batch)

California Lager Yeast (Wyeast 2112) ferment at 63 degrees

I’m no expert on grains but I would say from my experience 6-row is closer to Pilsner compared to 2-row. That is just my opinion.

 

[Jag75]

If I had a Bud and a Coors which would you take?

I would take them both and get rid of them and I dont mean consume lol

 

[rodwha]

I would take them both and get rid of them and I dont mean consume lol

Neither do I buy or enjoy, but I’d drink it being polite. I was just curious as to which flavor profile he preferred.

 

[Jag75]

Neither do I buy or enjoy, but I’d drink it being polite. I was just curious as to which flavor profile he preferred.

I'm just messing with ya lol. I'd reach for a Coors, although I had one of those black labels Buds . I think it was barrel aged and it wasnt bad tbo . Coors was my go to until somebody talked me into trying craft beer.

 

[balrog]

Neither do I buy or enjoy, but I’d drink it being polite. I was just curious as to which flavor profile he preferred.

that's a good way to look at it, but I fear I don't know enough about either to answer and don't want to guess. I *tend* more toward dryer than maltier styles, I *tend* to like more nobel hops (spicey/floral) than dank/catty. If that even helps.

 

[z-bob]

I made a cream ale once using about 77% MFB pilsner malt, 3% acid malt, and 20% jasmine rice. Lightly-hopped with Sorachi Ace (20-something IBU), and fermented with K-97 German ale yeast. I boiled the rice in a gallon or so of the strike water. It was kinda like Budweiser but not quite as clear, and had a lot more flavor. I should put it back in rotation, maybe using Mt Hood or Willamette or Sterling hops next time. Also I'm out of MFB pilsner but have a whole sack of Rahr pils, and this would be a good use for it.

 

[Dland]

I regularly make cream ales, sort of, usually around 50% pils, 25% two row, sometimes 5-10% Munich, Vienna or similar(whatever is open). Over 10-15% corn gets a little corny for my taste, rye malt makes a very nice adjunct, 10-15%, by itself or with corn. Rice, 5-10% if I want it lighter, and/or skip the Munich.

When I ferment with US-05(ferm temp mid 60sF), I consider it a cream ale.

When cellar is cooler(ferm temp under 60F), I use 34/70 or S-189 and call similar recipe a pre prohibition lager, and lager it for at least 4 weeks after finish.

I have used 6 row in place of two row, but the two row works as well, conversion wise, and may taste a bit smoother. Sometimes use a high end two row like MO or similar for body if not using any aromatic type malt.

For hops in above have lately been using amerillo, cascade, sometimes pearl with willamante finish, usually, depending on what bags are open.