Cold/non enzymatic mashing questions for table beer?

[Dsh1109]

I’ve been reading up on cold mashing or non enzymatic mashing and I’m really interested in doing it, it seems to me that the beers produced by this are low abv, but also are more liked than some that are made from purely just cutting the grain bill to get to the 1-3% abv range. So I have a few questions on this.
Does anybody have any experience on the taste of cold mashing vs just cutting the grain bill to get to abv down to 1-3%?

In my reading I'm pretty confused about what the exact process is between the cold mash and the boil. Do you do a rest at normal temps? If so how long or do you go straight to boil? When do you add extra water to get to preboil volume?

A lot of people experience scorching it seems, besides not dumping any of the sediment, what are other ways to prevent this?

It seems the beer being dry is a common experience and so I'm wondering if adding lactose to every brew to get the Final Gravity back to where it was intended to be would be the way to go with every beer? This company makes NA's without removing any alcohol unnaturally to make their beers and they have good reviews https://www.bigdropbrew.com/ I'm imagining they cold mash with a light grain bill and every one of their beers have lactose in the ingredients list. On that topic, what is the correct PPG for lactose? I've seen several numbers. Also anybody know the caloric content of lactose?

For balancing the IBU/OG ratio, Lactose added would give the ability to use more hops correctly? Or is there something different between left over unfermented malt sugars and unfermented lactose?

I'm looking at doing a Hefe, a Kona big wave clone, a bourbon vanilla milk stout, and maybe an IPA with a cold mash, although with the IPA im thinking of just using this recipe for a normal mashed https://www.themadfermentationist.com/2012/01/vienna-malt-session-ipa-recipe.html

 

[Samudell]

I am going to try a cold mash this weekend. Keep me posted on ur results

 

[Kenmoron]

Interested as well!

 

[beersk]

It is discussed in a little more detail here: https://www.homebrewtalk.com/forum/threads/low-enzymatic-cold-mash-low-alcohol-beer.673443/

I brewed one a week ago, planning to keg it tomorrow. I tried a sample of it and I'm not sure what to think yet. But this method has me intrigued. Jury's still out on it.

But essentially you mash overnight at refrigeration temperatures. I mashed around 44F for 13 hours. Tried to do as good a job as I could to vorlauf but still had to make sure to stir in the kettle regularly to avoid scorching of the starches on the bottom of the kettle. I rested at conversion temps for 30 minutes. In the 150's is fine. Then brought up to a boil and brewed like normal. You'll want to use less hops for sure as you'll get better hop efficiency. But with this you can do more late hopping to get what you need.
Not sure what to tell you about the lactose though. That might raise the gravity up too much and kind of defeat the point of this method. But it could be worth a try.

 

[BrewnWKopperKat]

I'm going to copy over the reading list that I posted in another topic:

I thought I'd share links for what I have found (over the years). I've brewed this way a couple of times. No recipes worthy of sharing (yet, as I'll brew this way again as time permits).

Here's a PPT that's essentially the same as the HomeBrewCon 2016 presentation:

• https://www.pnwhc.com/sites/default/files/slides/PNWHC17_NonEnzymaticMashing_AaronHyde.pptx

This might be the blog from one of the posters in one of the /r/homebrewing topics.

• http://hornbrewing.com/blog/category/cold-extraction/

/r/homebrewing had a couple of long (for them anyway ) topics on it:

• https://www.reddit.com/r/Homebrewing/comments/a7yn5j/i_used_cold_extraction_to_brew_a_15_abv_saison/
• https://www.reddit.com/r/Homebrewin...ll_beer_big_taste_are_there_any_pointers_for/

Couple of additional links at Briess's site:

• http://blog.brewingwithbriess.com/santas-big-red-sack-of-hops-5-gal-recipe/
• http://blog.brewingwithbriess.com/holiday-brewing-briess-style/

Before /r/homebrewing, there were a couple of bloggers who posted results (apparently a year after attending HomeBrewCon 2016)

• http://www.timvandergrift.com/?p=1005
• http://www.timvandergrift.com/?p=1049

• http://jonscrazybrews.blogspot.com/2017/03/non-enzymatic-mashing-aka-cold-mashing.html
• http://jonscrazybrews.blogspot.com/2017/03/non-enzymatic-mashing-take-1.html
• http://jonscrazybrews.blogspot.com/2017/03/non-enzymatic-mashing-take-2.html

And a couple of additional links that may (or may not) be interesting:

• https://aussiehomebrewer.com/threads/mash-in-with-cold-water.66330/
• https://www.homebrewersassociation.org/forum/index.php?topic=3175.0
• http://forum.northernbrewer.com/t/cold-mashing-is-this-possible/7415

If you have a BYO digital subscription: https://byo.com/article/brewing-table-beer/

 

[BrewnWKopperKat]

Does anybody have any experience on the taste of cold mashing vs just cutting the grain bill to get to abv down to 1-3%?

I have not brewed side-by-side with these different techniques.

In my reading I'm pretty confused about what the exact process is between the cold mash and the boil. Do you do a rest at normal temps? If so how long or do you go straight to boil? When do you add extra water to get to preboil volume?

What are you reading?

When I use cold extraction, I do a rest for 30 minutes at around 150. Result is a 3-4% beer. If necessary, I adjust water volumes at flame-on - with the intent of targeting a specific OG. I'm currently not concerned with final volume.

The /r/homebrewing articles I mentioned (see reply above) often go directly to a boil. Result seems to be a 1.5%-ish beer.

A lot of people experience scorching it seems, besides not dumping any of the sediment, what are other ways to prevent this?

Where are you reading this?

Are you using BAIB to extract the spent grains?

Have you looked at the original presentations (HBC 2016 or PNWHC 2017)?

I haven't encountered the scorching - but even with my first batch, I stopped pouring the wort when I saw a lot of sentiment and I stirred often during the rest and during the boil.

It seems the beer being dry is a common experience and so I'm wondering if adding lactose to every brew to get the Final Gravity back to where it was intended to be would be the way to go with every beer?

The process is likely to yield some "unconventional" flavors.

I will suggest holding off on adding lactose until you understand what to expect from the existing process.

For balancing the IBU/OG ratio, Lactose added would give the ability to use more hops correctly? Or is there something different between left over unfermented malt sugars and unfermented lactose?

Again, I will suggest on holding off on adding lactose until you understand what to expect from the existing process.