Cold Crashing With Spike Conical

[ctagbailey]

I'm cold crashing my first batch in a Spike Conical. The guidance from Spike suggests pressurized with C02 (and then remove the Co2 line) to 5 PSI first to prevent creating a vacuum that pulls back in through the blowoff. Wouldn't the CO2 go right out through the blowoff tube. What I missing?

 

[Golddiggie]

You mean you're using the blowoff tube??
Replace that fitting with a TC cap and then proceed. IMO, this should be pretty evident. If you don't have a 'spare' 1-1/2" TC cap, then get [at least] one before you proceed.
I've been fermenting under pressure with my conical fermenters from the start (was doing it before I got the conicals). I know the CF10's come with the blowoff fitting, but I've not used the ones that came with the order. At least not for that (might have them on a couple of hoses in the brewing system).

Are you planning to carbonate in conical as well? I've been doing that since getting these with the Spike carbonation stone item. Works great to get solid carbonation levels in 2-3 days (after reaching the correct temperature).

 

[eric19312]

When the conical gets cold the gas inside the conical shrinks. If you have a blow off tube setup it will suck back from your blow off bucket to equalize pressure. If you have sealed the fermentor you may create enough negative pressure (less than atmospheric) to collapse the fermentor. They are not designed to handle negative pressure.

So you want to swap your blow off for the manifold. If you have the new lid you may have both on there already. Like @Golddiggie says take off the blow off and replace it with a cap. I have the old one so I have to replace my blowoff with my gas manifold, I do this while fermentation is still relatively active but past the blow off stage. If you do this while fermentation is still going you can add a spunding valve to the gas post and let the beer finish at 10 PSI or so. Then you will have the head pressure you need for safe cold crash.

 

[Golddiggie]

I pressure ferment for the entire time. With the current generation lid (got my CF10 units last year) having three 1-1/2" TC ports I don't need to swap anything. I've been setting the spunding valve (from SSBrew Tech) to 5-6psi for the duration. Gives me what I want from the yeast and means it's a closed system.

 

[ctagbailey]

You mean you're using the blowoff tube??
Replace that fitting with a TC cap and then proceed. IMO, this should be pretty evident. If you don't have a 'spare' 1-1/2" TC cap, then get [at least] one before you proceed.
I've been fermenting under pressure with my conical fermenters from the start (was doing it before I got the conicals). I know the CF10's come with the blowoff fitting, but I've not used the ones that came with the order. At least not for that (might have them on a couple of hoses in the brewing system).

Are you planning to carbonate in conical as well? I've been doing that since getting these with the Spike carbonation stone item. Works great to get solid carbonation levels in 2-3 days (after reaching the correct temperature).

That was why I was questioning it. Leaving the tube on didn't make sense, but the instructions seemed to indicate you leave it on. I had already capped it, but was trying to make sure I wasn't missing something since this was my first time through..

Yes, I do plan to carbonate in the tank later this week.

 

[Golddiggie]

That was why I was questioning it. Leaving the tube on didn't make sense, but the instructions seemed to indicate you leave it on. I had already capped it, but was trying to make sure I wasn't missing something since this was my first time through..

Yes, I do plan to carbonate in the tank later this week.

Even though Spike says the carbonation will be done in 24 hours (or less) I've not found that to be the case. Plan to leave it on the gas for 2-4 days to get fully carbonated. I also put the racking arm either horizontal, or almost vertical, when carbonating. IME, if you end carbonating with it horizontal, it won't let anything settle back into it once that process is done. That will be a benefit when you go to rack from the conical later.

 

[eric19312]

Even though Spike says the carbonation will be done in 24 hours (or less) I've not found that to be the case. Plan to leave it on the gas for 2-4 days to get fully carbonated. I also put the racking arm either horizontal, or almost vertical, when carbonating. IME, if you end carbonating with it horizontal, it won't let anything settle back into it once that process is done. That will be a benefit when you go to rack from the conical later.

hmm I get sufficient carbonation in about 12 hours with a CF15 with the racking arm pointed up. What temperature are you carbing at? If you can get very cold it goes pretty fast. I overcarbed in 12 hours once with the beer at 29F...

 

[Golddiggie]

hmm I get sufficient carbonation in about 12 hours with a CF15 with the racking arm pointed up. What temperature are you carbing at? If you can get very cold it goes pretty fast. I overcarbed in 12 hours once with the beer at 29F...

I carbonate at either 36 or 38F. I serve at a higher temperature than that (playing with the serving temperature to see how it effects flavors, so far trying 42-44F). I wouldn't want to go below 32F due to freezing risk (of the beer). That's the last thing I want. If you use the correct pressure going through the stone (with the 4psi wetting pressure) you won't get it over carbonated no matter how long it goes. I use the manifold pressure gauge to see how much pressure is really in the fermenter.

 

[eric19312]

I carbonate at either 36 or 38F. I serve at a higher temperature than that (playing with the serving temperature to see how it effects flavors, so far trying 42-44F). I wouldn't want to go below 32F due to freezing risk (of the beer). That's the last thing I want. If you use the correct pressure going through the stone (with the 4psi wetting pressure) you won't get it over carbonated no matter how long it goes. I use the manifold pressure gauge to see how much pressure is really in the fermenter.

I also serve my beer much warmer than I carb it. So I carb it to a volumes calculation and then when it warms up to serving temperature the beer is good to go. 12 PSI at 39F is 2.52 volumes, about where I like most of my beers, 7 PSI at 30F is 248 volumes. So if I carbonate at 30F I want the pressure to be 11 PSI at the stone. Carbing for a short period of time (6-12 hours for example) I might bump that up a bit and go with 12-14 PSI at the stone depending on how long I've got. If I get within 5-10% of target carbonation level in the tank (preferably under target), I'm happy to get the last bit on serving pressure in the keezer.

Risk of freezing is probably system dependent. Freezing point of 6% ethanol solution is 25.25F. I think the limit on the coil designs icing up has to do with the speed the tank is gaining heat from the environment. You have to pull a lot of heat out through that glycol coil to compensate for the heat coming in from the environment. Probably would not have that issue with jacketed fermentor since the environmental heat will first have to be absorbed by the glycol in the jacket before it gets to the beer.

 

[WesBrew]

I pressure ferment for the entire time. With the current generation lid (got my CF10 units last year) having three 1-1/2" TC ports I don't need to swap anything. I've been setting the spunding valve (from SSBrew Tech) to 5-6psi for the duration. Gives me what I want from the yeast and means it's a closed system.

That’s what I’ve been doing with my kegmentor the past couple of years. I hadn’t given any consideration to collapsing the conical on a cold crash. Good to know this will suffice