Cold crash & yeast activity

[psemp4126]

I want to cold crash my latest batch of brew with gelatin to aid in clarity. Will the yeast remain active or become active again when I bottle with priming sugar?

How cold should or can I go?

Can batch go right into cold storage after bottling or will cold kill fermentation in the bottles?

This is not a lager and I fermented primary and secondary both at 68-70 degrees for about 10 days each.

 

[Catt22]

The yeast will go dormant at the colder temperatures, but they will get to work when warmed back up and food is available (priming sugar). Keep the bottles at room temperature for two or three weeks after bottling, then try a bottle. If all is well, then you can chill them down for serving or storage. If not fully carbed, give them more time at room temp and test again a week later.

 

[ASantiago]

I want to cold crash my latest batch of brew with gelatin to aid in clarity. Will the yeast remain active or become active again when I bottle with priming sugar?

How cold should or can I go?

Can batch go right into cold storage after bottling or will cold kill fermentation in the bottles?

This is not a lager and I fermented primary and secondary both at 68-70 degrees for about 10 days each.

The colder the liquid, the less active the yeast. By the time you hit the 40s, you have considerably less activity, I'd say almost none.

The yeast will restart when you add priming sugar and bottle. However, how active will depend on how long you lagered the beer. If for months, you may have to pitch a little yeast when bottling.

How cold are you able to make it? It will depend on the beer, but if you are going to cold condition for a while, sub 40F is probably where you want to be. I take mine to the mid 30s.

If you are carbonating naturally, you need to keep the bottles at warm temperature for 2-3 weeks at a minimum. By warm I mean 75-80F. The cooler the temp, the longer the beer will take to carbonate.

 

[psemp4126]

I can get the temp to low 30s if necessary. My main concern was that I lose the yeast permanently if that can happen.

So, I can chill, add gelatin, let sit in cold for as long as 3 weeks, then warm for a bit to normal fermenting temps and add priming sugar and bottle. Then 2-3 weeks in bottle before refrigerating for drinking.

Sound good?

 

[ASantiago]

I can get the temp to low 30s if necessary. My main concern was that I lose the yeast permanently if that can happen.

So, I can chill, add gelatin, let sit in cold for as long as 3 weeks, then warm for a bit to normal fermenting temps and add priming sugar and bottle. Then 2-3 weeks in bottle before refrigerating for drinking.

Sound good?

I don't see a problem with it. A couple of comments, though...

Low 30s is good. I take mine to the mid 30s mainly because with my setup the inside of the fermentation chamber ("FC"; a freezer with a temp controller) has some pretty good temp swings and I get a range of temps that's usually down to -3F from the temp the controller is set at. This is using a thermowell, which takes the temp readings from the center of the fermenter. I've heard/read that as close to freezing as possible is best, without actually freezing. In my particular case, the issue is the swings, so I stay away from setting the controller too low.

I've never used gelatin, so I can't help you with that.

It's the length of lagering that will determine the activity of the yeast once you bottle. I'm doing a Kolsch right now that I'm lagering for 4 weeks. I don't expect that to be a problem when carbonating in the bottle, although it might take a little longer than the usual 3 weeks. You should be OK with 3 weeks cold conditioning. As for longer, again someone else may have to chime in if they have experience with that.

But here's a cool (pun intended) thing: Don't let the beer warm up before you prime and bottle. Cold liquids hold gas better than warm liquids (Boyle's law of gases? Maybe not...). You'll notice that carbonation charts call for less priming sugar the colder the liquid is. This is because cold beer, even though there is no fermentation going on any more (or hardly any), *is* carbonated to some degree. So it takes less priming sugar and, presumably, less time, to carbonate in the bottle if you prime and bottle the beer cold.

What I do is I leave the beer in the FC until right before I bottle. By the time I rack and prime, the beer is probably sitting at around 50F (my guess), so it's still cold enough and hopefully still holding CO2.

The effect? In addition to less priming sugar required to yield the same volume of CO2, it should take less time to carbonate and the lagering period's effect on yeast suspension becomes less of a factor.

Your mileage may vary, of course. But that's the theory I'm going by. You may want to check out some info/charts on carbonation. But the bottom line is: bottle cold.

Hope this helps.

P.S. Bottle cold, then let the beer come up to 75-80F for natural carbonation.

 

[psemp4126]

One more thing... When cold conditioning, should my carboy be sealed or should i still be using an air lock?

 

[Misplaced_Canuck]

If you're going from say mid-60's down to mid-30's, the air + liquid will shrink in volume, and the airlock will suck air. I would NOT seal the carboy as the vacuum could potentially shatter the carboy. I'd use an airlock which allows suck-back.

As for yeast... The main things that kill yeast:

1) Cold (near freezing and below) temps
2) High (somewhere around 120+) temps
3) Chemicals
4) Aging (LONG aging, that is, 1+ years at least).

Even with gelatine, some yeast will remain in the beer and will be available to bottle prime. The number will be low, but it will still be there. It may take a little bit longer to prime than with an unconditioned beer, but it will get there. Also, the priming temperature will be important; if you prime at mid-30's, I wouldn't be surprised to see one month or more to prime. So, for priming, I'd stick at mid 60's.

You could certainly repitch yeast, but you'd then be un-clarifying the beer. So... Just prime at leave at 60's until carbonated.

M_C

 

[ASantiago]

If you're going from say mid-60's down to mid-30's, the air + liquid will shrink in volume, and the airlock will suck air.

...

Also, the priming temperature will be important; if you prime at mid-30's, I wouldn't be surprised to see one month or more to prime. So, for priming, I'd stick at mid 60's.

Ditto on the use of an airlock. I leave the blow off hose on until the cool down, particularly since I do a warm rest before I take it down. Then I install an airlock, mainly to make it easier to move the carboy.

Please read up on the temperature at priming. I'm not advocating priming in the 30s (although I don't argue against it either), but do think priming at a low temp is a good idea because of the carbonation that's already there. The more you warm up the beer, the more that CO2 will come out of solution. Why waste it? My view is prime cold and let the beer warm up after capping.

 

[Misplaced_Canuck]

Please read up on the temperature at priming. I'm not advocating priming in the 30s (although I don't argue against it either), but do think priming at a low temp is a good idea because of the carbonation that's already there. The more you warm up the beer, the more that CO2 will come out of solution. Why waste it? My view is prime cold and let the beer warm up after capping.

Well if the beer was fermented at mid-60's and conditioned at mid-30's... It's a bit of a guess to know exactly what level of carbonation is left in the beer. My view was that it would be somewhat quicker to prime in the mid-60's (for an ale) than at mid-30's.

M_C

 

[ASantiago]

Well if the beer was fermented at mid-60's and conditioned at mid-30's... It's a bit of a guess to know exactly what level of carbonation is left in the beer. My view was that it would be somewhat quicker to prime in the mid-60's (for an ale) than at mid-30's.

Just to clarify, the comment about reading up on temp at priming was directed at the OP. Guess I should've specified that...

Either way of priming is fine, at least from my perspective. However, I'd wager that priming colder rather than warmer takes less time because of the CO2 already dissolved. Personally, I still wait the 3 weeks regardless; I follow the principle of "Patience Makes Better Beer".

You are correct that it is difficult to calculate the level of carbonation in the cold beer. But I think the same can be said of warm beer, mainly because it's probably not sitting around for long enough to let go of *all* the carbonation it contains. It's all a big guess anyway, unless you have the equipment to test things out.

There are ways to make educated guesses on this, though. One way is to use John Palmer's Nomograph On Determining Amount of Priming Sugar. With it, you can see what I'm talking about. I use brewing software to do the calculations for me, but the principles are the same.

Ultimately, we all have our own way of doing it. I'm just trying to offer the OP some help to figure out how he is going to do it.

 

[psemp4126]

Thanks very much guys... This thread has turned out to be a wealth of information for me. I appreciate everyone's input. I think with this batch, i will try bottling cold and warming gradually to 70-75. I'll post back with my results in the month or two its gonna be before I get to drink some.

 

[Misplaced_Canuck]

Thanks very much guys... This thread has turned out to be a wealth of information for me. I appreciate everyone's input. I think with this batch, i will try bottling cold and warming gradually to 70-75. I'll post back with my results in the month or two its gonna be before I get to drink some.

I'd avoid anything over 70. I've had problems with my beers at room temperature (which in SC, is 78F in the summer). My preferred priming temp would be 65F.

M_C