champagne perry question

[gpawlak2000]

Hi, I'm trying to make a champagne pear mead. I'm hoping to serve in 6 months? I've made many different still meads so I do have some experience. Hears my resipe fo 6gal:

18lb of orange blossom honey
1- 96oz can of vintner's harvest "pear"
Two packs of 71B-1122 yeast
Pectic enzyme
Yeast energizer
Yeast nutrients

Ferement honey for 1 month @ 65F or until sg stabilizes
Add pectic enzyme and "pear" in mesh bag--2ndary four months
Coarse filter into keg and carb for 3 weeks then bottle

Any suggestions??? Thanks!!!

 

[fatbloke]

Hi, I'm trying to make a champagne pear mead. I'm hoping to serve in 6 months? I've made many different still meads so I do have some experience. Hears my resipe fo 6gal:

18lb of orange blossom honey
1- 96oz can of vintner's harvest "pear"
Two packs of 71B-1122 yeast
Pectic enzyme
Yeast energizer
Yeast nutrients

Ferement honey for 1 month @ 65F or until sg stabilizes
Add pectic enzyme and "pear" in mesh bag--2ndary four months
Coarse filter into keg and carb for 3 weeks then bottle

Any suggestions??? Thanks!!!

Well, on the face of it, it looks ok to start, other than perry is basically a cider made from fermented pear juice, a champagne is nothing like it.

I've seen ad's for the Vintners harvest stuff, but it's not available here, so is there actually any point in putting it in a mesh bag, unless it's actually just chopped pears, because if it's like some sort of "apple sauce", then the bag is a waste of effort/time etc...

As for just aiming for a certain amount of time ? well that's not usually how it'll happen is it......

I guess that if you're going to keg it, it will be force carbonated, so it doesn't really matter about the gravity so much at start (18lb of honey is about what I'd use and expect to be fine with i.e. 3lb per gallon). The 71B should do fine with that. 6lb of pear "something or other" ? Well yes, I'd have thought that you'd be able to get a nice enough pear flavour coming through as you allude to putting it in after the ferment has finished.

Pears can be a little like plums i.e. a swine to get it cleared. And I certainly wouldn't want to not get it clear first, as any particulates can play hell with dispensing from a keg (yes I know that there's some stuff that comes out fine, even if it's a "cloudy" product - they seem to be the exception to the rule). So I'd have thought you'd want to get it cleared before you keg it, also stabilise it as you wouldn't want to restart a ferment once you add the pear, which is possible if it's not stabilised, yet that'd be ok if it's being force carbonated (not if it's being naturally carbonated/conditioned in bottle).

dunno if that helps any

regards

fatbloke

 

[gpawlak2000]

Thanks for the thoughts. After reading my post I realized I didn't say the volume--6gal. As for the pear "juice", I've heard there's sometimes pear parts mixed in? That's my reasoning for the bag-- but right now I've never opened a can so I can't say ill need it. Hopefully the pectic enzymes will help reduce any haze from the pears? I mentioned using a coarse filter, but I can also use a steiral filter as well and then add the pear juice-- thoughts on that? Then force Carb to champaine like bubles. Fatbloke, you said to use stabilizers? I've made wine and used stabalizers, but never for a mead. Is that your normal protocol, or do you say that due to the pear? Thanks.

 

[fatbloke]

Thanks for the thoughts. After reading my post I realized I didn't say the volume--6gal. As for the pear "juice", I've heard there's sometimes pear parts mixed in? That's my reasoning for the bag-- but right now I've never opened a can so I can't say ill need it. Hopefully the pectic enzymes will help reduce any haze from the pears? I mentioned using a coarse filter, but I can also use a steiral filter as well and then add the pear juice-- thoughts on that? Then force Carb to champaine like bubles. Fatbloke, you said to use stabilizers? I've made wine and used stabalizers, but never for a mead. Is that your normal protocol, or do you say that due to the pear? Thanks.

If you don't stabilise and use sulphite when the ferment is finished, it's entirely possible that it can restart fermentation if fermentable sugars are used to back sweeten.

I like to back sweeten with honey and/or certain grape juice concentrates.

Most of my meads, I start at about 1.100, maybe as high as 1.110 and I prefer using either D21 or K1V-1116. All the cold crashing stuff isn't practical for me so I just ferment dry and back sweeten.

The only down side is that if I wanted to try a sparkling mead, then I'd have to use non-fermentable sugars for the back sweetening and I wouldn't be able to stabilise as again, I don't have the kit for force carbonation and stabilisers/sulphite would prevent bottle conditioning.

The pear juice/pulp/whatever it turns out to be, is fermentable, so unless you use that much that the yeast poops out, it's possible that it will ferment out the sugars in the pear.

Hence it's gonna depend on "which" pear flavour you're after, a sweet type of flavour - which would need stabilising/sulphite or a fermented pear flavour - which wouldn't.

After all, the whole point is to get a nice taste without producing bottle bombs (or sparkling meads, but in champagne/sparkling wine bottles)

 

[gpawlak2000]

Ok, it’s been two months now and things are progressing well. The honey fermented out pretty dry after a month and a half. SG started around 1.096 and finished around 1.006. This gives around 12%ABV. Cold crashed for a week and transferred to 2ndary. Added vintners pear(FYI this is a clear juice--very sweet) and pectic enzyme. After adding the pear juice I believe the dilution should have brought me down to ~10.5% ABV. Temp was brought back up to 68F. Fermentation was very week(maybe 1 bubble a min from airlock). Thought that was odd, but left it at 68F for two weeks. Figure I may have fermented a little of the sugars--tasted right after adding pear, and now two weeks later and its defiantly "hotter". May have gotten back up to the 12 plus %ABV??? Started 2nd cold crash for the next three days and will course and sterile filter this weekend and start force carbonation for the next two months at 32.5PSI. Should be fun to bottle! Thank god for beer guns and cold New England winters ;-) I'll update once bottles are filled.

 

[Yooper]

Ok, it’s been two months now and things are progressing well. The honey fermented out pretty dry after a month and a half. SG started around 1.096 and finished around 1.006. This gives around 12%ABV. Cold crashed for a week and transferred to 2ndary. Added vintners pear(FYI this is a clear juice--very sweet) and pectic enzyme. After adding the pear juice I believe the dilution should have brought me down to ~10.5% ABV. Temp was brought back up to 68F. Fermentation was very week(maybe 1 bubble a min from airlock). Thought that was odd, but left it at 68F for two weeks. Figure I may have fermented a little of the sugars--tasted right after adding pear, and now two weeks later and its defiantly "hotter". May have gotten back up to the 12 plus %ABV??? Started 2nd cold crash for the next three days and will course and sterile filter this weekend and start force carbonation for the next two months at 32.5PSI. Should be fun to bottle! Thank god for beer guns and cold New England winters ;-) I'll update once bottles are filled.

Well, if you were at 1.006, it was a long way from finished- it should have gone to .990 or so. Adding pears wouldn't "dilute" it- it would increase the ABV by quite a bit as there are lots of fermentable sugars in that. You're probably more like 15% ABV or so, depending on the SG after you added the pears. Cold crashing seems a bit premature, as I'm not certain it's done fermenting. Watch out for bottle bombs! That'd be a big concern to me. Of course, if you're sterile filtering, you should catch all the yeast but I'd still be watching it.

 

[gpawlak2000]

Hi Yooper, I hear what you're saying about diluting, but if you add a non EtOH liquid to a fermented liquid it would drop the ABV until fermentation started again. The SG/OG of the pre pear addition works out to about 12%ABV which is the EtOH tolerance of 71B-1122 yeast. My guess as to why FG didn't drop below 1.006. If it was 15% that would be fine, but I never seen much of a second round of fermentation after the pear addition--weird I know? I'm a scientist and have access to a microscope with a flow cell--so I can count cells and even use digital imaging to see if the yeast are budding/reproducing. This is all automated and used for checking cell viability. There was maybe 0.1% of budding yeast, so they were still somewhat active, but maybe tired after hitting their EtOH tolerance? Maybe I could have added some fresh yeast, but I wanted the pear to be a form of back sweating. I've been warned about the bottle bombs from allot of people here. Never had one. My guess is most people don't sterile filter after back sweating? Once again, I can take samples to confirm that yeast has been removed. I know most people don't have this at their disposal--its nice to have!!! Any thoughts on carbonation? From what I gather 32.5psi should make the Perry champagne like? Thanks

 

[Yooper]

Hi Yooper, I hear what you're saying about diluting, but if you add a non EtOH liquid to a fermented liquid it would drop the ABV until fermentation started again. The SG/OG of the pre pear addition works out to about 12%ABV which is the EtOH tolerance of 71B-1122 yeast. My guess as to why FG didn't drop below 1.006. If it was 15% that would be fine, but I never seen much of a second round of fermentation after the pear addition--weird I know? I'm a scientist and have access to a microscope with a flow cell--so I can count cells and even use digital imaging to see if the yeast are budding/reproducing. This is all automated and used for checking cell viability. There was maybe 0.1% of budding yeast, so they were still somewhat active, but maybe tired after hitting their EtOH tolerance? Maybe I could have added some fresh yeast, but I wanted the pear to be a form of back sweating. I've been warned about the bottle bombs from allot of people here. Never had one. My guess is most people don't sterile filter after back sweating? Once again, I can take samples to confirm that yeast has been removed. I know most people don't have this at their disposal--its nice to have!!! Any thoughts on carbonation? From what I gather 32.5psi should make the Perry champagne like? Thanks

But if you didn't take an SG after the pear addition(and it would have fermented), it wasn't a dilution. You may not have hit the EtOH tolerance, after primary, as 71B easily goes to 14%.

It doesn't matter, but you're certainly at least at 14% with those readings and additions.

You're probably safe, with sterile filtration. But I don't think bottling before fermentation is complete is ever 100% "safe". That's why I mentioned it.

I'm not a sweet champagne fan, but I would think that 32.5 psi at 40 degrees would be bubbly, more so than a hefeweizen, but less than commercial champagne. I'd think that champagne would be more like 5.5 volumes of co2, or thereabouts.

 

[gpawlak2000]

Thanks for the recomendations on the CO2. I'll shoot for the 5.5 volumes. I did take a a reading after adding the pear. I'll be taking a true FG tonight. Guess I'll find out if it moved. Stay warm!

 

[gpawlak2000]

OK its been nearly a year and a half since I made this mead. It was great for the wedding after only 6 months. Unfortunately it lost carbonation. Not sure if it was the plastic corks or if it happened during bottling. It was perfectly carbed after sitting in the keg. In any case it tasted great and was a hit. Slight pear taste in a semi-dry mead with just a hint of carbonation.