Caustic/Sodium Hydroxide

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dstar26t

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I picked up some Sodium Hydroxide to get beerstone off kegs and can't seem to find a concentration to use. I e-mailed the distributor but they didn't know since they sell it for pretzel making.

This is the stuff

I tried googling it but haven't found an answer. Any ideas?

Nate
 
i don't know what concentration you'll need, but i do know that latex gloves won't cut it. grab some nitrile gloves from the home improvement store.
 
been using Sodium Hydroxide (lye) for years, it is dangerous!
I use about 1/2 cup to a gallon of water and just brush around
Be safe and get chemical gloves (Homedepot) and a full face shield (the fumes will trim nose hairs).
I rinse well with water, then hit it with the pressure washer,
makes it squeaky clean and no scrubbing
 
You want an acidic solution for beerstone, not alkaline.

I read that it's easier to remove the beerstone if you first remove the protein that's bound up in it. So a soak in caustic and then a soak in vinegar or CLR? Would Saniclean or Starsan at a higher concentration work as a good acid rinse for beerstone?
 
What I have heard is CLR is most effective at removing beer stone. Beer stone is a mineral deposit. You need an acid to break that up.

Caustic is very good at breaking up organic deposits but maybe not so great on mineral deposits like beer stone.

Good luck and let us know how it works.
 
Lye/muratic acid are great cheap and no-elbow-grease solutions for organic/beer stone removal in stainless kegs.

Use the appropriate safety gear and have baking soda and vinegar handy in case of spillage/accidents!

Happy brewing!:mug:
 
Reviving this thread, I use the stuff too and it's safest to target a particular concentration. I make 5% solutions and I can't see a reason to go more concentrated. Massing out beads of NaOH and adding to liters of water is most accurate. Measuring by volumes (cups, tablespoons, etc) is not a good idea. 1Liter weighs ~1000 grams so you can easily calculate 5% without guesswork. This stuff turns your skin into slime on contact, and deserves a minute with a piece of paper to be most accurate.

I second other contributions, face mask for spray protection and I use arm covering chemical (nitrile, no latex) gloves as well. Makes equipment shiny but have vinegar in a spray bottle nearby. Beerstone will need an acid, I use phosphoric for beer stone, and nitric acid for repassivation of the steel (twice a year) after the caustic run. You will need to scrub a bit to pull the stone off, it won't always dissolve but soften. A power washer or elbow grease will be needed.

Since you are using an acid after a base, I always neutralize the two solutions before dumping down the drain. This is a good move for your plumbing and wastewater system downstream, unless you don't mind replacing pipes in 10 years.

A little bit of fear of caustics and strong acids is healthy. It keeps you from doing something stupid and ensures all your moves are measured and protracted.
 

I think 1 lb in 5 gal is pretty much the 'standard' concentration for caustic. It's pretty close to 2.5 oz/gal and certainly easy to remember and measure out.

Where nitric acid is used for beerstone removal it is there to ozidize the protein so that the phosphoric can dissolve the oxalate.
 
1 lb in 5 gallons is a 2.3% mix.

I wouldn't say there is a standard. I've seen people use anywhere from a 0.1% mix to a 53% mix. Stronger is faster, weaker is safer when you spill it on your foot.
 
I wouldn't either really. That's why I put "standard" in quotes. It does seem a pound per 5 gal is the number many brewers use, though. Note that by brewer here I don't mean the guys in a regional with a huge caustic tank which they recirculate until it is exhausted. I mean the guy with a few corny kegs he wants to clean or a 1 - 2 bbl conical he wants to CIP.

If you look at the properties of lye solutions you may gain some insight as to why 1 pound in 5 gals is a reasonable choice. This is where the pH vs concentration curve starts to heel over a bit. At that point you have a pH of 12.7 and a normality of 0.05 which are adequate for many cleaning jobs. Get some of it on your hands and you will know that 0.05 N is plenty strong to saponify your fats and denature your proteins. Double the strength and you are paying twice for caustic what you pay otherwise and, unless you are reusing it will have to pay twice what you paid before to neutralize it that is assuming that you are a good enough citizen to not dump 0.1 N caustic into the sewer. Go to half a pound and pH drops to 12.4 (no surprise there) and normality to 0.025. Your'e still OK but probably wouldn't want to go as low as 0.1 lb/5 gal as the pH at that level would be 11.7.

Note that all the numbers I've thrown out are based on a pKb number I got from Wikipedia. If it's wrong then I'm wrong with respect to the numbers I've calculated but not in principle.
 
ajdelange brings up a good point and one that is worth adding to. it is certainly worthwhile for anyone working with strong acids and bases to invest in the purchase and maintenance of a decent pH sensor. your safety is dependent on the tools you have available to measure your chemicals.

thanks for the share, 5 gallons on a homebrew scale of caustic seems burdensome to me but everyone's set-ups are different. I imagine someone hauling a bucket of caustic across a kitchen (tired after a brew day) but I'm sure folk know to use pumps and mix in situ.

would people's waters not greatly affect the amount used? our water has moderate alkalinity as bicarb but has no buffer going up. measuring NaOH to 5% by mass of my total volume puts me spot on but someone with particularly hard water may need a greater amount.
 
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