ARGH- breaker dilemma!

[lalh20]

OK, so rather than describe how I got myself into this mess, I'll just describe what I have now...

Downstairs I have a 50a gfci outlet that was just put in. Upstairs has a 30a outlet for my dryer that I'd love to be able to use from time to time in the summer. I am creating a control box that will only need 30a (1 5500w element). I can put fuses in the box to protect it when using the 50a supply, so that's no problem.

Here's my issue... If I build the box with a 50a cord, I can only use it downstairs. If I build it with a 30a cord, I can only use it upstairs. I want a LONG (at least 10 ft) cord so in my mind it's not a cheap/affordable/convenient solution to have two cords to switch between that long.

What simple solution is there to make it so i can easily work with either outlet? I don't mind somehow making the downstairs receptacle only 30a if that can be done easily without a much more expensive breaker solution (I already have the 50a breaker installed). Any ideas?

In my mind, the easiest solution is just to protect the box with fuses then change the receptacle downstairs to 30a so it matches the 30a cord I have (yeah, it'll still have 50a service), but I know that'll make electricians cringe. Is there a better, "kosher" way to do it?

 

[HumulusHead]

I'd build with a 50 amp cord. Then create a short lead to convert from 50 to 30. So then you can use the normal cord for the 50 amp times and then add the converter to the end when you need the 30 amp. As long as both the 50 and 30 have the same number of hot legs I think you'll be ok.

Check in this before you would do it, but it came to my mind to be a possibility. I'm not an electrician ha

 

[lalh20]

thanks. sounds like that's what I'll do at this point since there are no other suggestions!

 

[schematix]

thanks. sounds like that's what I'll do at this point since there are no other suggestions!

You're putting a lot of faith in someone who acknowledges they don't know what they are talking about.

 

[HumulusHead]

You're putting a lot of faith in someone who acknowledges they don't know what they are talking about.

Then give him some direction per his original question?

Edit: realized this sounded dickish. Sorry about that

 

[BlkWater_brewer]

Why on earth have two cords, this makes zero sense???? The breaker/fuses in the controller limit the amperage being drawn, just as the breakers in the main panel control what each circuit gets. Not the size of the wire connecting things. I have reached the conclusion that there is so much strange logic floating around when it comes to electricity and especially when it comes to the difference between a 50 or 30 amp controller. Which are minimal to say the least.

 

[HumulusHead]

Why on earth have two cords, this makes zero sense???? The breaker/fuses in the controller limit the amperage being drawn, just as the breakers in the main panel control what each circuit gets. Not the size of the wire connecting things. I have reached the conclusion that there is so much strange logic floating around when it comes to electricity and especially when it comes to the difference between a 50 or 30 amp controller. Which are minimal to say the least.

I keeping checking back because I am curious what would be the best way to do this. I offered my suggestion because I thought it would work and would be safe. I however am only learning on this stuff myself (hence why I stated in my first post to check around ha)

What would you say would be the best solution?

 

[schematix]

I keeping checking back because I am curious what would be the best way to do this. I offered my suggestion because I thought it would work and would be safe. I however am only learning on this stuff myself (hence why I stated in my first post to check around ha)

What would you say would be the best solution?

Maybe the OP can chime in here, but I am trying to wrap my head completely around the issue. Is the underlying issue that the plug for the 30A is different than the plug for the 50A? That would make sense but I am looking for confirmation of that being the issue.

Follow-up: If that is the issue i'd design the panel for 50A, and then build a conversion cable as suggested by Humulus.

Humulus - I wasn't knocking your idea, I was just pointing out that the OP was jumping on an idea from a self identified non-expert for a fairly serious application without waiting but an hour or so for other responses.

The 30A outlet should already have 30A protection on it so you don't have to worry about the wire if you design for 50A. The 50A outlet should have 50A protection on it, so just make sure all of your wire can handle 50A or better (typically 6AWG or larger) and i think you're good.

 

[HumulusHead]

Maybe the OP can chime in here, but I am trying to wrap my head completely around the issue. Is the underlying issue that the plug for the 30A is different than the plug for the 50A? That would make sense but I am looking for confirmation of that being the issue.

That's what I was assuming at least

 

[Facinerous]

First off if the breaker is 30 amp (which you didn't state) and the dryer outlet is 30 amp then why wouldn't you just make the brew outlet 30 amp? You could make both of them 50 amp plugs, but why?

I think it would be cheaper to get a 30 amp cord and change one outlet. Just my opinion.

So... You breaker is 30 amp right? If its more then I have other questions to ask.

[edit]
Just thought about this. If you have two separate breakers, one 30 amp for the dryer and one 50 amp for your downstairs outlet then I would make all your outlets and plugs 50 amp if you only want one cord.

Still... Thinking more when it comes to 10ft lengths of cord you really are talking about small amounts of money in the grand scheme of things. Is it really that bad to make two?

Further... Why doesn't your dryer have a cord already attached to it? Unless you just need it longer, then I understand.

 

[Troubleshooter]

This is very simple, continue to build your rig with the 50amp setup like your going to. Then go get your self an adapter to convert from 50amp to 30 amp plug. These can be found at Walmart for $15 dollars. RV's use them all the time if there rig is wired for 50 amp and the park only has 30amp services.
I would absolutely not change your outlets out that are designed for that circuit originally. For example replacing your 50amp receptacle for a 30 Amp one. There then will be a chance that a cord feeding that device will be under sized and have a fire hazard.

 

[lalh20]

Sorry guys for not realizing my thread got a lot of attention after I was gone! Yes you guys seem to be on the right track. To answer one of the questions, yes the GFCI breaker downstairs is 50a and would be expensive to change to 30a.

Yes, the issue is that I have one plug at 50a and the other at 30a. Yes, I am leaning towards just making an adapter cord for the 30a outlet when I use it. i am going to put fuses in the box to protect it from the 50a itself since I've already gotten my SSR rated at 30a. - I'm kind of accepting this as the way to go now. I guess in asking my question I was hoping someone would have a magical way to for me to easily make my outlet downstairs still protected by the GFCI but somehow allow me to have a 30a breaker before the outlet (no panel in between my main panel and the outlet though so I can't see this happening.

Thanks for all your help and I think I know where I'm going. In hindsight, had I known what I was doing to myself i'd have probably sprung for the extra work/parts to get the downstairs outlet at 30a, but it's too late now!

 

[HumulusHead]

Sorry guys for not realizing my thread got a lot of attention after I was gone! Yes you guys seem to be on the right track. To answer one of the questions, yes the GFCI breaker downstairs is 50a and would be expensive to change to 30a.

Yes, the issue is that I have one plug at 50a and the other at 30a. Yes, I am leaning towards just making an adapter cord for the 30a outlet when I use it. i am going to put fuses in the box to protect it from the 50a itself since I've already gotten my SSR rated at 30a. - I'm kind of accepting this as the way to go now. I guess in asking my question I was hoping someone would have a magical way to for me to easily make my outlet downstairs still protected by the GFCI but somehow allow me to have a 30a breaker before the outlet (no panel in between my main panel and the outlet though so I can't see this happening.

Thanks for all your help and I think I know where I'm going. In hindsight, had I known what I was doing to myself i'd have probably sprung for the extra work/parts to get the downstairs outlet at 30a, but it's too late now!

You could also switch the main breaker panel to a non gfci 30 amp breaker. I just bought one for mine today actually at Home Depot. $9.

Then buy a spa panel which has the gfci built in. Those are $60 at Home Depot. But someone is selling them cheap on eBay right now. Just search midwest electric spa panel. I picked one up off there two days ago for like $35 shipped.