Are hipsters ruining craft beer?

CornyKegs 728
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I just have this overwhelming need to quote bugs bunny right now. Some of you will get this, some not. For those that do ... it will be our little secret.
 
You know who's really ruining craft beer... those home brewers. Making their own hooch, when they could be supporting real beer.
 
rodwha said:
I used to be accused of being stuck in the 80's. I still have some old denim jackets. I won't wear them in public though as someone might confuse me of being a hipster wearing that coupled with my beard…
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I have denim jackets, too. I get away with wearing them because I also wear a cowboy hat....:D

An ancient retiree who came back to supervise a special project watched me rolling out of my pickup one morning. I was wearing jeans, boots, hat, Rayban aviator sunglasses, and a denim jacket over a white tee-shirt.

He looked me up and down, and said, "well. You look very umm... local this morning...."

I told him, "hey, I have a right. I was raised here...." Of course, I was also gone for thirty two years before I came back to take this job.
 
I think hipsters are ruining hipsters. It used to be you could tell a hipster from afar. But now, hipster wannabes are actually better hipsters than the real thing. Real hipsters have to up their game or become even more hipster which just makes them look like phony hipsters. In the end, it's a hipster nation where everyone strives to be an "individual" that looks like every other dude in women's pants and an 80s tight roll going on.
 
We were just doin our own thing back in the day as "hippies". It wasn't about just looking different & thinking you're cool. Damn kids. Can't live with'em,can't shoot'em...
 
unionrdr said:
We were just doin our own thing back in the day as "hippies". It wasn't about just looking different & thinking you're cool. Damn kids. Can't live with'em,can't shoot'em...
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I tend to agree, but I remember quite a few style conscious "hippies" who would not be caught dead in jeans that looked too new.
 
I can't tell you how many times I have had some D-Bag at a bar with a huge beard tight jeans and a flannel tell me what beer i should get and then proceed to give me some drawn out lame ass Guy Fieri description of his boston lager.
 
losMythos said:
I can't tell you how many times I have had some D-Bag at a bar with a huge beard tight jeans and a flannel tell me what beer i should get and then proceed to give me some drawn out lame ass Guy Fieri description of his boston lager.
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I think you're mixing up hipsters with *****ebags. There is ample overlap, however.
 
I have no idea where this discussion thread is at concerning this topic, but when I saw the title I had the immediate need to click on it and respond simply by saying,

"Yes."
 
I'm not really sure what a hipster is. I also don't know why people have to be classified as something. Seems kinda highschoolish. When I was in high school there were names for everyone. Rednecks, stoners, preps, jocks, whatever. But when I got into the real world and began working, everyone ended up just being people.

Usually when people try an label themselves as something, they are still searching for there true identity within themselves. I don't know what my style is called, but I like it and care less what other people think.
 
BWE said:
I'm not really sure what a hipster is. I also don't know why people have to be classified as something. Seems kinda highschoolish. When I was in high school there were names for everyone. Rednecks, stoners, preps, jocks, whatever. But when I got into the real world and began working, everyone ended up just being people.

Usually when people try an label themselves as something, they are still searching for there true identity within themselves. I don't know what my style is called, but I like it and care less what other people think.
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x2.

I drink what I like, and everyone else can drink what they like. No labels needed.
 
Did you hear about the Hipster Dinosaur who burned his foot?

He stepped on lava before it was cool...:cross:
 
The whole hipster thing, among other microcosms of our modern culture, reminds me of a Warren Miller quote: "Just remember that you are unique, like everybody else!"
 
No but prices certainly are. I rarely try or drink any craft beer anymore. I'll pick up Sierra Nevada that's about it. The "extreme" do-dad, Johnny come lately beers are so overpriced I'm turned off by the whole scene. Ommegang 750's were $4 in my area when craft had a resurge, now they want upwards of $18 for a 750 - makes no sense, looks more like the real estate industry than craft beer. We all know what ingredients cost and if you can't control you biz expenses or or are just plain greedy, that's not craft...that's thinking on an industrial level.


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Yeah,I hate how even Super Walmart charges an average of $9.49 for a 6'r. On the other hand,they do carry Kona,Columbus,The Brew kettle & others. The Brew Kettle's White Rajah IPA is pretty good. Found Yuengling Bock & porter too.
 
shoreman said:
No but prices certainly are. I rarely try or drink any craft beer anymore. I'll pick up Sierra Nevada that's about it. The "extreme" do-dad, Johnny come lately beers are so overpriced I'm turned off by the whole scene. Ommegang 750's were $4 in my area when craft had a resurge, now they want upwards of $18 for a 750 - makes no sense, looks more like the real estate industry than craft beer. We all know what ingredients cost and if you can't control you biz expenses or or are just plain greedy, that's not craft...that's thinking on an industrial level.


Sent from my iPhone using Home Brew
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That sounds more like inflation or a general cost of living increase in your area than a general increase in the cost of craft beer. Most six packs around here are under ten dollars. 750s of Ommegang vary depending on what beer you're getting, but the standards are $10 or $12. That's on par with a moderately cheap bottle of wine.

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Downtown - I live in the state next to where ommegang is produced.

I don't buy the inflation argument or the ingredients argument. Let's just say Hennepin 750 for $10- that's more than double it's price in the matter of 8-10 years. That's not inflation it's expansion and getting larger economies of scale and all that.

The fact is that people aren't so much looking at it as a passion business anymore, it's full on mainstream biz.

I've worked in craft and know what it can take to setup a basic brewery for the passion of it but that's getting list IMO.

Tell me where you can go and get a working mans pint of bitter or mild or saison for a $2-3 pour theses days? I certainly don't see it.

Wine is more affordable these days and I've been buying more of it. You can score a nice Spanish granache for $5-6 a bottle - I can't score a great wallonian saison for $2 a small bottle.


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I hear this all the time "why do I have to pay more for a growler that was produced in my hometown than I would for a Sam Adams 12 pack?" From non beer gnerds - I see that as a huge problem to "craft beer"


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Yup - prices are definitely through the roof. A few years back I'd balk at paying $7 for a six pack. now I'm paying $11-$12 for a 4-pack. Bombers used to be $4 on average. Now it's more like $8-$10. Maybe the price of hops has gone up because of the demand? Maybe it transportation to get local stuff nationwide? That's the only reason I can think of for legitimate price increases like these.
 
shoreman said:
Downtown - I live in the state next to where ommegang is produced.

I don't buy the inflation argument or the ingredients argument. Let's just say Hennepin 750 for $10- that's more than double it's price in the matter of 8-10 years. That's not inflation it's expansion and getting larger economies of scale and all that.

The fact is that people aren't so much looking at it as a passion business anymore, it's full on mainstream biz.

I've worked in craft and know what it can take to setup a basic brewery for the passion of it but that's getting list IMO.

Tell me where you can go and get a working mans pint of bitter or mild or saison for a $2-3 pour theses days? I certainly don't see it.

Wine is more affordable these days and I've been buying more of it. You can score a nice Spanish granache for $5-6 a bottle - I can't score a great wallonian saison for $2 a small bottle.


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Everything is more expensive than it was 10 or 15 years ago, craft beer included. That said, part of the reason you're seeing a higher price on Hennepin is because the market can handle it and Duvel is trying to make more of a profit.

You're drinking the wrong beers of you think most craft brewers aren't passionate. It is still a business, but that doesn't mean the passion is gone. Unfortunately, in this business, a larger supply of beer doesn't mean lower prices. Demand is certainly keeping up with supply, perhaps surpassing it. You also have to consider that the demand for equipment and ingredients has increased faster than supply (at least for equipment). I think you're expecting a lot if you expect to get a pint of craft beer for the same price that most bars sell Miller Light.

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Yep, prices are going through the roof for good beer. This is why I'm so thankful for being a home brewer. Take for instance my last batch of barleywine. I would have difficulty finding a beer that would be close to this beer in terms of richness, flavor, hop aroma, abv. That isn't to say that I can't find anything. A couple of beers come to mind that are close. However, those beers would cost me no less than $250 for the same amount I just brewed for just under $40 worth of ingredients.

Now I don't know about you folks, but to me, that is pretty hip. I think I'm "doing it right". Now ask me about why my Italian food tastes so good and I'll show you my herb garden and heirloom tomatoes. I'm a hippy type you say? Let me show you my gun collection and let me tell you how to age that venison to make it fork tender.
 
Downtown- I'm not buying "craft beer" anymore, that's unfortunate as I've been a supporter of craft beer and the scene for over 20 years. I'll buy a Sierra seasonal 12 pack or a Victory Helious (appropriately priced at $3.95 for a bomber) every once in a while but that's it. I guess these guys can bank on continuing to increase prices but to me the value is not there. A lot of times you are taking a big risk on that $18 triple IPA being fresh when it's not labelled - that's not a risk I'm willing to take anymore - if it was $3 maybe.

All I'm saying is that the price gouging has ruined the craft scene for me and most of my friends agree and aren't buying either.


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I definitely agree. You're taking a risk on that $10 6'r when it doesn't have a BOD on it. Some places don't rotate their stock. Like Super Walmart. And at the prices craft beers are at nowadays,they don't move as fast. But Giant Eagle does a good job with their beer cooler. The young guy that manages it is friends with my son,the frozen manager & they're both craft beer guys.
 
Maybe price gouging isn't the best term for it, overvalued is probably better.

I don't think we will agree on this and that's fine, at the end of the day we both are homebrewers and know that we knock out 5 gallons of a west coast IPA for the same price of some of these 750s, that's the route I've been taking moving ahead.


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I agree that it is expensive, but some of you guys need too look at the books and follow the money. MOST of that money goes to the distributer and the retailer, at least in 3-tier States.

In states that allow self-distribution then the breweries can make a lot more revenue. It costs a lot to run a high-risk business like a brewery. The prices might be a bit inflated but if the bubble bursts then you will see a considerable attrition in the industry as many operations go out if business. Last year 948 new breweries opened their doors. That is incredible!

For those of you that correlate grain and hop prices with final cost need to consider the other aspects that add cost to a beer.

Just my thoughts here. I don't think craft beer is cheap, but it could cost more. Maybe I just live somewhere that has overall lower cost of great beer.
 
sandyeggoxj said:
I agree that it is expensive, but some of you guys need too look at the books and follow the money. MOST of that money goes to the distributer and the retailer, at least in 3-tier States.
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This is not always the case. Breweries do set their own wholesale price levels and can price themselves very high. My case in point is Hoppin' Frog, that recently released BORIS (their imperial stout) at $225 a sixtel wholesale. That's $225 for a little over five gallons. Out of that keg, you might get sixty ten ounce snifter glass pours (considering loss due to samples, overpour, foaming, etc.). That's not a lot of margin for a retailer when the average price for a pour might be in the $5 to $6 range.
 
aiptasia said:
This is not always the case. Breweries do set their own wholesale price levels and can price themselves very high. My case in point is Hoppin' Frog, that recently released BORIS (their imperial stout) at $225 a sixtel wholesale. That's $225 for a little over five gallons. Out of that keg, you might get sixty ten ounce snifter glass pours (considering loss due to samples, overpour, foaming, etc.). That's not a lot of margin for a retailer when the average price for a pour might be in the $5 to $6 range.
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Wow, they must have some really good marketing. Most distributors won't go for that. Good for them! For most craft $225 is high for halves, let alone sixtels.
 
Chadwick said:
Yep, prices are going through the roof for good beer. This is why I'm so thankful for being a home brewer. Take for instance my last batch of barleywine. I would have difficulty finding a beer that would be close to this beer in terms of richness, flavor, hop aroma, abv. That isn't to say that I can't find anything. A couple of beers come to mind that are close. However, those beers would cost me no less than $250 for the same amount I just brewed for just under $40 worth of ingredients.
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Largely that is the tack that I have started to take. For a half dozen bottles of craft brew I realize that I could have picked up a 50 pound bag of US 2-Row Malt. At a pretty reasonable ABV that could have been base malt for four or five batches. If I knuckle-down and wash yeast that takes a little more cash out of the development cycle. And let's not forget that the "failures" are usually perfectly drinkable and can easily be used for gifts, bartering, etc.

No, I may never make a dead-on recreation of some craft brewed beer. But it gets made up for when I can get close and then make changes t which suit my own palette.

And to get back to the OP that's where I think I see the grand divide. The "hipster" mindset is beset largely on discovery or the obscure or glorification of the wholly ordinary for the sake of irony. As homebrewers we live in the most obscure as what comes out of our kegs and bottles is the product of our efforts instead of their passive observance and consumerism. We have the ultimate in what it is they strive for.

However what separates us from them is that we know what makes something great because we made it and we made it how we would want it to be, not glorified something because we chased it down and just happened to be the first in line.
 
here's something perhaps not considered. can a culture ruin "craft beer"?

in korea, there are a lot of people with very small minds that are utterly uninteresting but want to seem sophisticated and wealthy to everyone else. wine and wine tasting was completely ruined here (and it seems in china and japan) in the past decade by a belief that wine is classy and a sign of sophistication. now fake bottles of french and other european wine flood the market and constantly thrown around as one-upping style presents. i'm not really into wine but i know enough to just laugh at the crap that they sell for 20 dollars a bottle plus.

extremely recently good beer culture has somehow been gotten wind of round here and i can imagine it being completely ruined. the store stocks a decent selection of belgian and american micro imports but at completely insane prices. would you like to buy a bottle of st. bernardus? me too. but do you want to at about 10 dollars per single 330ml bottle?

i will homebrew in silence, but it's almost ruined by imagining clueless oafs showing off by buying a round of "the most expensive beer on the menu" for everyone and then slamming it down as fast as they can.
 
I can under stand the extra cost of a barrel aged beer. One of the guys at a local brewery mentioned how they just leased more warehouse space (doubling their brewery storage area) to help with the demand they were getting from other local breweries for their barrel aging program.

I agree with the transportation complexity of getting a east coast beer expedited out west (goes both ways) in a way to keep the product fresh.
 

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