fartinmartin
Well-Known Member
Do you like beer ?
Yes, I think you should only use 1 pound of extract (roughly, not an exact science here) per gallon of liquid in the boil.
Also, don't overdose the campden so much. You're using about 5 times a normal amount, if you're adding more than 1/4 tablet for 5 gallons of water total.
I'd get the water out the night before, and stir the campden in well and let it sit so that it's ready the next day. Then you're not trying to add campden in micro-amounts to top off water and stirring it to off-gas before adding it to your wort.
I think fixing both of those issues will fix your problem.
Ok sounds like I'm good there on that front for all grain. I don't know a lot but I wouldn't think the ph of boil water would render a beer undrinkable as you hinted to earlier. Going to have to experiment with distilled I suppose. Hopefully Yooper will hit me back about the recipe additions as far as extracts go.
Do you like beer ?
What more do you need? I'm unclear what needs more clarification but willing to try!
Is the taste your getting , beer!
Is the taste your getting , beer!
I had asked earlier if it is ok to ignore the instructions addition times for the extract completely and follow your schedule and whether or not this includes the liquid addition or dry addition or both.
So many beers... so little time.
I had asked earlier if it is ok to ignore the instructions addition times for the extract completely and follow your schedule and whether or not this includes the liquid addition or dry addition or both.
So many beers... so little time.
As far as tap vs distilled, I usually opt for the RO water I get for 25 cent/gallon at the machine in front of the grocery store.
Dry, liquid, whatever. If you have a 3 gallon boil, one 3 pound bag of DME or one 3.3 can of liquid or something more or less is fine.
Definitely don't over sulfite the water. It may not completely dissipate before you are using it, since it's a huge overdose. Using such a huge amount in your top off water will impact yeast health negatively, and well as leave a sulfite flavor that is unpleasant.
Between the excess maillard reactions from overboiling the extract, and the huge overdose of sulfite, I think that just changing those two things will fix your problem.
As far as tap vs distilled, I usually opt for the RO water I get for 25 cent/gallon at the machine in front of the grocery store.
Given that following the instructions isn't getting you the results you want, I'd certainly try abandoning them (especially in favor of those given by someone with as much background as Yooper).
I doubt it matters whether its the dry, the liquid, or both, as long as total extract added comes in at roughly a pound per gallon for the boil.
I am a newer brewer but I wanted to throw this out there; you said you seep your specialty grains at 160*, I could be completely off here but I was under the impression that you want to add the grains as soon as you turn on the heat and take them out at 170* which should take around 30 mins. If you are seeping at 160* for 30 mins could that cause your off flavors like squeezing the bag can?
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No, steeping at 150-160 for 20-30 minutes is actually the preferred method for steeping (although putting the grains in cold water won't hurt).
Squeezing the bag won't extract tannins, either- that's an old wives tale.
I did an NB extract kit that used LME only. I used gallon jugs of spring water from the store. Aged for a month before bottling. Left in bottles for about 6 weeks and then dumped. Thin mouthfeel. Off flavor that I would describe as more dominant when burping and when taking a good smell. The next two brews were partial mash kits both using LME. Both of these had the same off chemical smell/aftertaste but to a lesser extent. My last partial mash I switched to using my own water/filtered. When I switched to all grain the problem went away. I personally believe it's infinitely harder to make a great batch of beer using extracts. However, I will go back and brew with extract again to see if I can do it. Things I would do now. 1. No LME 2. Full boils 3. No spring water and/or water I know nothing about. 4. Use late extract additions in the recipe.
I was going to give up on brewing until I did some all grain batches. Before that I figured all homebrew tasted like "homebrew." My brewing experience has been extract = worst, partial mash = decent, all grain = finally seeing the potential of what homebrew can be.
Brewing a fantastic batch of all grain should be expected. Brewing a fantastic batch of extract should be respected!
No, steeping at 150-160 for 20-30 minutes is actually the preferred method for steeping (although putting the grains in cold water won't hurt).
Squeezing the bag won't extract tannins, either- that's an old wives tale.
If your steeping water has high alkalinity AND a high pH, tannins can get extracted. And more noticeably the darker the roasts, and higher quantities of them. Hence it is more pronounced in darker beers.
Although darker roasts add more acidity to your water, high water alkalinity buffers that away, more so if you have 3+ gallons vs 1 gallon. Do you know your alkalinity and pH? Did you look up a water report for your water source?
Now if you have high alkalinity you would notice that in your all-grain too. Do you add acid to your all grain brewing water?
I posted my water report earlier in the thread but am not sure how to read it to answer your questions specifically.
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I've wondered what is mastering an extract brew? It's been said on here before that many who move to all grain also use better techniques, full boils, yeast starters/hydration, pay more attention to water, fermentation temperatures, etc. I fall in that category myself. My next extract attempt will use these ideas and the recipe will have interesting steeping grain and yeast character. I will also steer clear of LME just as an experiment for myself.
I posted my water report earlier in the thread but am not sure how to read it to answer your questions specifically.
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[...] To save time:
pH 8.2, Alkalinity 73, Sulfate 74, Chloride 38, Sodium 33, Calcium 48, and Magnesium 7
It's not "soft" water, but it's also pretty decent. An argument could be made for cutting it 50/50 with RO, but then you'd want to supplement it with CaCl (at a minimum, depending on style) for all-grain brewing.
[...]
In the end, though, I totally agree that Yooper nailed it. The water chem stuff can do nothing but help improve, but it's not your core issue.
mastering an extract brew is something you need to learn to do
a lot of guys enter contest and win big time with extract brews because they have mastered the techniques needed, and that does translate through to your all grain brewing.
Because most guys consider extract brewing a beginners way to brew they think they soon have to get beyond it, however many of the things you try to do in all grain brewing you are also doing in extract brewing.
you have to admit how you get your sugars is a small part of brewing, and the use of specialty grains is a large part of brewing. Well you use them in both all grain and extract brewing.
While it can be said that you have control over body and mouthfeel in all grain brewing, it can also be said you have that control in extract brewing, albeit sometimes in different ways.
Many a technique developed in extract brewing are used in all grain and some techniques are individual to the method, but mastering a extract brew will make you a better all grain brewer. as much as mastering all grain will make you a better extract brewer. I would really like to set 2 beers in front of you h=and have you tell me which is which.
you know, beer kits do seem to be just thatMy experience has been that it's been MUCH more difficult for me personally to produce a great batch of extract beer. What I noticed was that the more grains I used the better the beer turned out. Extract with steeping grains, thin mouthfeel, odd aromas when smelling just after the pour, etc. Partial mash brews tasted much better. I noticed a major bump in quality when I dumped beer kits and purchased my ingredients/extract locally using fresh LME/DME. Everything had that "homebrew" taste until I switched to all grain. When I did all grain I wasn't expecting miracles but there was a major difference in the quality of what I was making. Since doing partial mashes bumped the brew day time up to all grain time anyway, I just dropped the extract.
The only reason I would brew with extract now is to save time and have an easy brew day. Anything beyond extract with steeping grains changes the brew day. I have plans to do the milk stout DME recipe in the recipe section here. Like the OP I would like to produce a great (not good) batch of extract.
I'd like to take that 2 beer challenge!
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