70 qt cooler? too thin a grain bed?

[Dgonza9]

I've heard some discussion that a 70 quart cooler may leave a 5 gallon batch with too thin a grain bed. Any truth to this?

My 50 qt cooler is too small to do 10 gallon batches of most IPA's, and even pushing it with high gravity beers.

So is a 70 quart cooler going to make too thin a grain bed if I wound up doing 5 gallon batches?

Thanks for the input. Cooler is on sale for under $40. with free shipping.

 

[wilserbrewer]

JMO, but I feel that if you want to vary your batch sizes and grain bill size dramatically, best to have more than one cooler. If you do try and use the 70 qt for a small batch, I would preheat times 2 and keep some boiling water on hand in case you need to bump the temp up a little during rest.

 

[BLM]

I think it would be great for ten gallon batches or high gravity like you said
I have a 68 qt one and use it for 5 gal batches I did notice the first time I used it it lost some temp so I built a cheap insulated box to cover it with but hey I got the cooler for free

 

[Dgonza9]

I might just try covering it with a bunch of winter coats and whatnot. I do that now and it helps quite a bit.

Looks like 70 qt cooler is coming my way. Can't decide what to brew next, though.

 

[doulovebeef]

if using a large cooler, i would recommend cutting a piece of Styrofoam that fits on the inside over the mash to lower head space and increase heat retention

 

[Manfish]

I have a 69 quart cooler and doing 5 gallon batches I get horrible efficiency (usually around 60%) and I personally believe that its the depth of the grain bed. With the beers that I make that means I am spending maybe $4 more a batch than I need to, but I personally think its the size of the cooler. I have yet to do a 10 gallon batch in it, maybe I will try that this week, but either way I am in the process of setting up a RIMS or HERMS (havent decided yet). I have most everything I need to get started building, just waiting to get my kegs back from a buddy who is cutting the tops for me. Once I get those, the cooler goes Bye-bye

Btw, with the cooler... I may have lost 1* in temp over an hour... if that. Temp loss was certainly not an issue.

 

[Dgonza9]

Very interesting, Manfish. Anyone know why efficiency could be so low if temperature of the mash was spot on? Is there an explanation for why a thin grain bed could cause decreased efficiency if it's not a temp issue?

 

[niquejim]

If you are batch sparging then grain bed depth makes absolutely no difference unless you are losing heat

 

[Dgonza9]

I do continous batch sparge a la brutus 20. Not sure whether that matters.

 

[cheezydemon3]

My experiments with a direct fired tun, suggest that when I mash in 5.5 gallons of water (absolutely floating) my efficiency is off the charts good.

Can it be too thin? does too much water affect enzyme reactions or some such sh{t? Are my calculations WRONG??

 

[Dgonza9]

I've read that very thin mashes >2qts/lb result in more fermentable wort.

Here's the thread.

 

[niquejim]

If you are batch sparging then grain bed depth makes absolutely no difference unless you are losing heat

I do continous batch sparge a la brutus 20. Not sure whether that matters.

I do a regular batch sparge with a 60 qt cooler and I get 80-82% every batch. For the small batches we make I believe simpler is easier and all the fancy eqipment is just for show, YMMV.

 

[BLM]

I do a regular batch sparge with a 60 qt cooler and I get 80-82% every batch. For the small batches we make I believe simpler is easier and all the fancy eqipment is just for show, YMMV.

I wish I could get great eff.the best I have done is 70% most of the time I get 60-65% I batch sparge even got grain from 2 diff LHBS crushed the grain twice still 65% got corona mill still have to tweek it the first time I used it 65% eff oh well at least I can buy grain in bulk and hopefully tweek my mill to get at least 70% I would be happy with that

ETA sorry for the thread hijack

 

[TonySwank]

I use a 70 qt coleman extreme cooler and have done nothing but 5 gallon batches with it. No big issues at all 10 batches in aside from that it can be a pain to move around. I wanted something to do a 10 gallon big stout and this was cheaper than a 40qt. Also, I batch sparge.

If you do use it I can give you a couple of tips. Preheating is very important. Usually I use 4 gallons of 195 F water for 20 min. Once the mash water is added I put two blankets on top of the cooler. Even in the Texas summer it will drop 1-2 degrees over an hour if I don't do this. When I add the sparge water I usually use 185 F water, which from what I've heard is slightly hotter than most people use.

 

[Myke_J]

I use a 70 qt coleman extreme cooler and have done nothing but 5 gallon batches with it. No big issues at all 10 batches in aside from that it can be a pain to move around. I wanted something to do a 10 gallon big stout and this was cheaper than a 40qt. Also, I batch sparge.

If you do use it I can give you a couple of tips. Preheating is very important. Usually I use 4 gallons of 195 F water for 20 min. Once the mash water is added I put two blankets on top of the cooler. Even in the Texas summer it will drop 1-2 degrees over an hour if I don't do this. When I add the sparge water I usually use 185 F water, which from what I've heard is slightly hotter than most people use.

I use a pretty similar setup, Coleman Xtreme 70qt, except I fly sparge. I just did two 5.5 gal batches on Friday, both were 10# grain bills. I got 75% efficiency on the first and 80% on the second. I usually get 80-85%, but haven't had time to brew much lately so I screwed up my sparge on the first batch. I've done as small as a 8# batch and as large as 32#. I usually get the best efficiency around 12-18# batches, but still get 80% with 25-30# batches.

I do a lot more 5gal batches with my 70qt cooler then 10gal ones and don't have problems either way. I generally preheat with whatever amount my strike water is at around 180-185 and let it sit for 20 mins or so, then stir it until it drops to my strike temp. I dough in and stir it extra if I'm high on my mash temp and then let it sit with the lid closed for the duration of my mash time. I've never insulated my mash tun at all. I brew outdoors and have done it in near freezing temps up into the low 80's and the most temp I've lost over 60 mins is about 2 degrees.

 

[Ziggybrew]

I use a 70 qt coleman extreme cooler and have done nothing but 5 gallon batches with it. No big issues at all 10 batches in aside from that it can be a pain to move around. I wanted something to do a 10 gallon big stout and this was cheaper than a 40qt. Also, I batch sparge.

If you do use it I can give you a couple of tips. Preheating is very important. Usually I use 4 gallons of 195 F water for 20 min. Once the mash water is added I put two blankets on top of the cooler. Even in the Texas summer it will drop 1-2 degrees over an hour if I don't do this. When I add the sparge water I usually use 185 F water, which from what I've heard is slightly hotter than most people use.

Same here. I do preheat, but don't use any extra covers and still only loose 1 or 2 degrees (not even on a hot day). I get good efficency for 5 gallons. Wanted the volume for huge beers or 10 gallon batches. My (batch) sparge water DOES also have to be hotter than normal. I'm happy with it.

 

[Manfish]

I do a regular batch sparge with a 60 qt cooler and I get 80-82% every batch. For the small batches we make I believe simpler is easier and all the fancy eqipment is just for show, YMMV.

Then if your using that big of a cooler and batch sparging and getting that kinda eff%... I wonder if its my crush then? I've talked to the owner at the LHBS and he swears to me he gets 85% with the crush from his store. Now, maybe he is just jerkin me around, I dunno... but not sure what else it can be. I guess I will find out soon as we bought our own mill and will be doing that ourselves here soon!

 

[phatuna]

If you really want to dive down into efficiency, you should read up on Kaisers material: http://braukaiser.com/wiki/index.php/Main_Page

there are some spreadsheet in there that will allow you to pinpoint exactly why your efficiencies may be off. Taking gravity readings throughout your process (1st run, 2nd run, 3rd run, pre boil, post etc.)

 

[cheezydemon3]

WOW! I was assuming an efficiency based on the final ABV. I am not so concerned that I will take 5 readings. Is it good beer? Close enough. But my more fermentable wort was resulting in more alcohol, but less malt flavor. Is that about right?

I mean my grains absolutely float freely in my mash.

 

[smokinghole]

One thing to consider is the actual dimensions of the grain bed. I have Coleman 36qt coolers and the 52qt cooler also. The only difference is the 52qt cooler is taller so I have the same LxW dimensions of the grain bed. I was considering a 70qt cooler also but at this point I'm not going to be doing 10g batches anytime soon.

 

[Ziggybrew]

If you really want to dive down into efficiency, you should read up on Kaisers material: http://braukaiser.com/wiki/index.php/Main_Page

there are some spreadsheet in there that will allow you to pinpoint exactly why your efficiencies may be off. Taking gravity readings throughout your process (1st run, 2nd run, 3rd run, pre boil, post etc.)

Hey, this site is awesome. Thanks!!!