2 beers, one mash help

[Jtk78]

Twice now I've done one mash and gotten enough for two 5.5 gallon batches. I did not do it parti gyle style. I mixed all of the runnings, then split them to get two even worts.

I've done a blonde ale and an amber (steeped grains while blonde was starting to boil).

I also did two wheat beers. I made one a hoppy-ish and one a cherry wheat.

They are talking about lot of rain this Saturday so I'd like to knock out another 10-11 gallons. I'm looking for ideas. I have WY1318, WY1272, and WY3944 on hand.

I was thinking about trying a NEIPA and a Wit if possible. What else could work? Thanks in advance.

 

[IslandLizard]

Maybe aim for 2 beers of a similar grist content?

The Wit requires an extensive wheat charge in the mash your NEIPA doesn't provide. So you'd be mashing twice. Not a big deal, as you can do it while the NEIPA is boiling. Use part of the 2nd and/or 3rd runnings as your strike water. Make sure to have enough DP to convert your flaked wheat and oat adjuncts.

 

[IslandLizard]

Make sure to start those starters today... That still doesn't give you a lot of time to cold crash.

 

[mattdee1]

I've tried a few different things with 10gal batches in an attempt to, on the one hand, get lots of beer for my time; and on the other hand, get some variety in the results.

If I want variation in grains, then since I only have one mash tun and one burner, my only real option is to use one "base" grain bill and add a steeped grain mixture into half of the batch. The steeped grains and associated water are small enough in quantity that they can be done on my kitchen stove. I steep the grains, boil the extract, chill it, then add it to one of the fermentors. I used this method to do an amber/brown combo (see photo) and a kolsch/alt combo. The recipes need a bit of tweaking, but it is a viable technique.

I've found that the easiest and most "forgiving" way to get some variety out of 10gal by splitting it is to simply play with different post-brew ingredients -- i.e., different yeasts and different dry hops. I recently did an APA with S-05 in one bucket and T-58 in the other, with different dry hops as well. Both beers were great, and you'd never know they came from the same base batch. The S-05 one was a typical citrusy west coast type pale ale, while the T-58 one had this awesome yeast character to it that clashed in a glorious way with the fruity hops.

 

[Jtk78]

Make sure to start those starters today... That still doesn't give you a lot of time to cold crash.

That's the plan, which is why I'm trying to figure out what I'm doing tonight.

I would really prefer one mash if at all possible.

I've tried a few different things with 10gal batches in an attempt to, on the one hand, get lots of beer for my time; and on the other hand, get some variety in the results.

If I want variation in grains, then since I only have one mash tun and one burner, my only real option is to use one "base" grain bill and add a steeped grain mixture into half of the batch. The steeped grains and associated water are small enough in quantity that they can be done on my kitchen stove. I steep the grains, boil the extract, chill it, then add it to one of the fermentors. I used this method to do an amber/brown combo (see photo) and a kolsch/alt combo. The recipes need a bit of tweaking, but it is a viable technique.

I've found that the easiest and most "forgiving" way to get some variety out of 10gal by splitting it is to simply play with different post-brew ingredients -- i.e., different yeasts and different dry hops. I recently did an APA with S-05 in one bucket and T-58 in the other, with different dry hops as well. Both beers were great, and you'd never know they came from the same base batch. The S-05 one was a typical citrusy west coast type pale ale, while the T-58 one had this awesome yeast character to it that clashed in a glorious way with the fruity hops.

Do you happen to have the recipe for the amber / brown? I may be able to do the NEIPA / brown ale with some steeped grains. When I did the blonde / amber, I just put the grain bag with specialty grains in the kettle of warm wort while I was boiling the blonde. After about 40mins I turned on the 2nd batch. I have 2 kettles and 2 propane burners, which makes it easier.

 

[Jtk78]

Here's what I was thinking for the NEIPA / Wit combo

50% 2 row (10# total)
25 % white wheat malt (5# total)
15% flaked wheat (3# total)
10% flaked oats

This should give me an OG of about 1.050. The IPA would get 8 total oz of hops, 3 Citra, 3 Mosaic, and 2 Amarillo. The Wit would get .5oz coriander, .5 Oz bitter orange, and perhaps chamomile.

Think it's too much wheat for the IPA, huh?

Or....

87% 2 row (20# total)
13 % flaked oats (3# total)

Steep the following
1# crystal 60
.5# victory malt
.25# chocolate malt for a brown ale based on the recipe found here. https://www.homebrewtalk.com/showthread.php?t=30187

OG would be about 1.060. I wouldn't be worried about getting conversion out of the steeped grains.

 

[Davemci]

I have done a lager/ ipa split a few times. The ipa gets a pound of honey and 6ish Ozs of hops post boil, along with ale yeast.the Lager gets nothing but lager yeast.1 u drink soon, the other not so soon.

 

[IslandLizard]

Here's what I was thinking for the NEIPA / Wit combo

50% 2 row (10# total)
25 % white wheat malt (5# total)
15% flaked wheat (3# total)
10% flaked oats

This should give me an OG of about 1.050. The IPA would get 8 total oz of hops, 3 Citra, 3 Mosaic, and 2 Amarillo. The Wit would get .5oz coriander, .5 Oz bitter orange, and perhaps chamomile.

Think it's too much wheat for the IPA, huh?

Or....

87% 2 row (20# total)
13 % flaked oats (3# total)

Steep the following
1# crystal 60
.5# victory malt
.25# chocolate malt for a brown ale based on the recipe found here. https://www.homebrewtalk.com/showthread.php?t=30187

OG would be about 1.060. I wouldn't be worried about getting conversion out of the steeped grains.

That's a lot of wheat for an IPA, even more so for a NEIPA, maybe cut it down a bit. For comparison, Little Sumpin' has like 30% wheat in it, I brewed it a few times, pretty yummy with WY1968. 1318 should work great too.

I'd use a bittering charge with Warrior or so, and save all the other hops for the whirlpool. Boiling those for an hour kills most of their goodness.

On the other side, with the Brown, keep in mind, Victory really needs to be mashed, not steeped, so you could add it to the main mash. I often use Victory with 2-row to get a Maris Otter-like biscuit maltiness. MO or 2-row/Victory works great in your NE IPA too.

 

[aeviaanah]

I just did a Guinness clone and best bitter. Steeped the dark malts on the side. I found brewers friend ingredient/recipe database to be extremely helpful in figuring out what I could get away with.

 

[Kerrbrewer]

Have you considered BIAB in one kettle?

 

[mbobhat]

+1 on steeping some grains if you want variety in the two beers.

 

[Jtk78]

......
I'd use a bittering charge with Warrior or so, and save all the other hops for the whirlpool. Boiling those for an hour kills most of their goodness.

On the other side, with the Brown, keep in mind, Victory really needs to be mashed, not steeped, so you could add it to the main mash. I often use Victory with 2-row to get a Maris Otter-like biscuit maltiness. MO or 2-row/Victory works great in your NE IPA too.

I am going to go with the NEIPA / brown ale, both with the 1318. I had read about the Victory malt needing to be mashed, so 1# of that will go in the mash tun. I looked in my stock and I have 1.75lbs of 2 row. So it will look like this;

16.75# 2 row
3# flaked oats
1# victory
Mash at 154 for 1hr

Steep;
1# crystal 60L
.25# chocolate malt

NEIPA hops
Boil 10 mins
.75oz Citra
.75oz Mosaic
.75oz Amarillo

Whirlpool
.75oz Citra
.75oz Mosaic
.75oz Amarillo

Dry hop 48hr after pitch
.75oz Citra
.75oz Mosaic
.75oz Amarillo

Dry hop 3 days prior to packaging
.75oz Citra
.75oz Mosaic
.75oz Amarillo
I did my last NEIPA with a similar hop schedule and it came out great. Mixing it up slightly to see how different they are.


Brown ale hops
1oz Fuggle - boil 60min
1oz East Kent Golding-boil 15min

I just did a Guinness clone and best bitter. Steeped the dark malts on the side. I found brewers friend ingredient/recipe database to be extremely helpful in figuring out what I could get away with.

Thanks you for that tidbit. I will look at that and bookmark it.

Have you considered BIAB in one kettle?

I have two 8 gallon kettles. Not sure how that would work. I got the kettles and great prices though, so no regrets. This will be the third time in a row I'm splitting 1 mash. I just needed a kick in the tail to find the next set of beers. It was kind of a last minute decision to brew.

I will update this thread as these batches progress to let you know how they turn out.

 

[jekeane]

I've been drinking so I may not mine understand what's happening here. I think starter time was a consideration so this may not work this time.

But if you try this method again I just did a Schwarzbier where I gathered enough wort for a 9 gallon batch boiled it as if doing a full batch of Schwarzbier. Then post boil I pulled 1 gallon of wort and steeped some cara Munich and cara Rye. Brought that to a boil for a minute or two and added it to a smaller fermenter with some more of the Schwarzbier wort. I got a 5 gallon batch of Schwarzbier and a 2.5 gallon batch of Czech Dark lager doing this.

 

[mattdee1]

Do you happen to have the recipe for the amber / brown?

Looks like you've already decided on what you're brewing, but just for the record, the amber recipe I used was basically the "Common Room ESB" recipe from this site:

https://www.homebrewtalk.com/showthread.php?t=83878

I called it "amber" because I dialed back the hops, and amber was a more fitting description of the result.

For the brown, I steeped 1lb of chocolate malt.

But if you try this method again I just did a Schwarzbier where I gathered enough wort for a 9 gallon batch boiled it as if doing a full batch of Schwarzbier. Then post boil I pulled 1 gallon of wort and steeped some cara Munich and cara Rye. Brought that to a boil for a minute or two and added it to a smaller fermenter with some more of the Schwarzbier wort. I got a 5 gallon batch of Schwarzbier and a 2.5 gallon batch of Czech Dark lager doing this.

One problem that many might run into with this method is fermentation temperatures. If you only have one temperature controlled chamber and you simultaneously ferment 5gal + 2gal in there, then you're not going to hit the target fermentation temperature on both because they're so different in mass. I attempted something similar to this early on and I found that the smaller batch, while still drinkable, had some weird estery (or something) artifacts that I didn't care for. I attributed that problem to the fact that the temperature was being controlled based on the temperature of the larger batch, so the smaller one was probably fluctuating all over the map during the most critical fermentation time period (i.e., first 48-72 hours). I can't be 100% certain that this is the explanation, but it's something to consider, especially since the larger batch had no such off flavors.

 

[Jtk78]

Mattdee, thanks for the recipe. I will be keeping that for future reference as well.

I don't see myself doing two batches that different in size, but I wonder if controlling temp off of the smaller vessel wouldn't work better.

It's 4am, I'm just finishing a cup of coffee and it's out to the garage to get this party started. I'm not as prepped as I usually am, but oh well.