10 gallon BIAB with external 120v RIMS.

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robcj

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Location
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I've always been a BIAB brewer since I started brewing in 2010. I was initially attracted to the simplicity--everything I needed to brew in one kettle, which at the time was a paper-thin aluminum 7.5 gallon kettle that came with a turkey frying stand.

Fast forward five years and like most people in this hobby, I've steadily upgraded my gear to the point where it's hard to call my BIAB setup simple: 18.5 gallon stainless kettle with welded ports for thermometer and valve, bazooka tube, chugger pump, plate chiller and of course my Wilserbrewer BIAB bags. And camlocks. Camlocks are great.

This setup has netted me some good and sometimes fantastic beer. It generally works great--with one exception that is common to BIAB: mash temperature control.

I used to start at a higher temperature and let it fall over the course of the mash so that it averaged out at my target mash temperature but I was never satisfied with the lack of precision. I tried direct heating from my propane burner stand but I tended to overshoot the temperature. I tried recirculating while direct heating and I managed to burn a Wilserbrewer bag--the pump sucked it down to the bottom of the kettle and it melted.

I was committed to BIAB but I was frustrated and really wanted total control over all elements of my brew process. I read many amazing eBIAB build threads here for systems featuring internal RIMS setups but they were typically 240v and if they were 120v they were for smaller batch sizes. I brew 10 gallon batches and I need portability--I brew both on my deck and in the garage depending on the weather. More importantly, I often brew with a friend at his home. I can't rely on access to 240v. I also wanted the flexibility of using other kettles in the future and didn't want to commit my current kettle by adding a port for a heating element.

I spent a lot of time researching this forum and other online resources, specifically looking for examples that would prove the viability of an external 120v RIMS tube with 10 gallon batches. Not to reach my strike temperature or to boil, but just to dial in my mash temperature. I was still worried about thermal loss via the kettle and whether a 120v RIMS tube could keep up--but it seemed plausible so I bit the bullet and purchased an 18" RIMS tube and 5500w 240v element (which I run on 120v at 1375w for very low watt density) from brewhardware.com as well as a tabletop plug and play controller (built around a SYL-2352) with a 4" probe from auberins.com.

I had time to assemble it all yesterday and brewed with it today. My friend came over and we brewed an amber ale in my kettle plus a Pliny clone in his--both 10 gallon batches. I'm very happy to report that the external 120v RIMS worked perfectly. We were able to precisely hold our mash temperatures and I liked that we could use it (one after the other) on both kettles given that it's external. I also installed a wireless remote that controls power to my pump--very convenient.

I wanted to share my thinking and report my success here for others simply because I couldn't find examples of my exact situation when I was researching it. I hope this helps someone else down the road.

Next step is the building of portable platform where I can mount my pump, RIMS tube and chiller with expansion room for a future hopback acquisition. I'll add some photos when I wrap that up.
 
This is exactly what I was thinking of doing with a blichmann rims rocket setup. So cool. Glad it worked, and I'll be following for sure.
 
Long time lurker on this website. I rarely respond, but this made me go ah hah! I'm a BIABer myself and I've been making upgrades to my system but have been struggling with the same problems you faced. I really like this idea.
 
Glad to hear your success. Is there a reason you went with RIMS over just trying to insulate better?

Since he heats the kettle with a gas flame my thoughts are it might make insulating things more complicated and cause headaches during cleanup..

from his little list of stuff he has for his current BIAB system, i'm guessing to add some toys as well :mug:
 
Glad to hear your success. Is there a reason you went with RIMS over just trying to insulate better?

Since he heats the kettle with a gas flame my thoughts are it might make insulating things more complicated and cause headaches during cleanup..

from his little list of stuff he has for his current BIAB system, i'm guessing to add some toys as well :mug:

All of the above, really.

I went with RIMS for the flexibility, precision and yes--for fun.

I did experiment with temporary insulation during mashing--sleeping bags and towels specifically. It mitigated the issue but did not solve it and I found it to be a hassle.

I didn't want to wrap the kettle in an insulating material like Reflectix as I felt I would have to worry about burning it during heating or boiling or coming apart during transport--and it would make it more difficult to clean my kettle.

I know that others have found success with these insulating tactics but I did not feel that it was an optimum solution for me.

My solution certainly isn't inexpensive and some BIAB brewers might scoff at the way I've complicated what originated as a simple brewing process but it works for me. Temperature is such a critical brewing variable--from mashing to fermenting to serving. I have temperature control devices for fermenting and serving so it just made sense to mash with one too.
 
This is exactly what I was thinking of doing with a blichmann rims rocket setup. So cool. Glad it worked, and I'll be following for sure.

Long time lurker on this website. I rarely respond, but this made me go ah hah! I'm a BIABer myself and I've been making upgrades to my system but have been struggling with the same problems you faced. I really like this idea.

Great--glad my story was helpful in some way. I've only brewed once with the equipment I purchased from brewhardware.com and auberins.com but so far I am impressed. I also had to communicate with both companies during my ordering process and I was pleased with the customer service.
 
Looking forward to seeing the pictures. It sounds very interesting.

I'll be sure to take good photos during my next brew session, probably next weekend.

One issue I'm experiencing is compacting of the grain at the bottom of the bag during the mash. I'll be experimenting with the depth to which I insert my return hose and pump flow rate during the mash. This is not a RIMS issue but a recirculation issue.

I'm also tempted to buy a basket for this setup.
 
I started rebuilding the platform for my pump, RIMS tube and chiller today.

It's made from plexiglass, two pieces of plywood and a supermarket produce tray. I can store my cables, remote pump switch and PID controller box inside the tray. It's very portable with handles built in to the short sides of the tray.

The lid is made from the plywood and plexiglass. The plywood is sandwiched together but the bottom piece is smaller and fits inside the tray so that the lid stays put. The plexiglass is on top and is intended only to prevent the plywood from getting wet.

The RIMS tube came with mounting bolts that thread into nuts welded to the triclamps. The mounting bolts are attached to the lid and raise the RIMS tube up above the lid. The pump is also bolted to the lid. The wort chiller can't be bolted as there is no way to mount is like that--instead I will drill holes through the lid and use zip ties to keep it in place. I did this on my first build and it worked well.

Everything is mounted to facilitate my process. The kettle would be positioned to the left of platform--all connections to the kettle are made on that side: pump inlet, rims output and chiller output. I tested all hose connections to ensure they could be made with minimum lengths and without kinking.

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I decided to add a recirculation port to my kettle lid--I was previously just feeding the return hose into the kettle and mash but this prevented me from fully closing the lid.

Yesterday I used a step bit to cut a hole into the lid (started with a 3/16" pilot hole) and installed a weedless bulkhead with camlock on the outside and hose barb on the inside. I'll add hose inside as needed to bring the wort return into the mash.

Looking it over now, I'm pretty sure my hose will kink right before the camlock due to the vertical orientation so I've placed an order for an elbow fitting which I'll place between the bulkhead and camlock.

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I brewed a 10 gallon coffee milk stout with this system today. Worked great except I don't like spilling wort everywhere when I move around my hoses to reconfigure between mashing and chilling. I need to come with a solution, likely involving three-way valves. My goal is to be able to do the following without moving any hoses:

1. Recirculate with pump and RIMS back to the kettle inlet.
2. Recirculate with pump and chiller back to the kettle inlet.
3. Transfer with pump and chiller to fermenter.

I believe I'll need a three way valve after my pump to switch between RIMS and chiller, then another after my chiller to switch between recirculating and transfer. This will require two inlet ports on my kettle lid and dedicated hoses if I don't want to swap the hose between the RIMS and chiller outputs. I already have a dedicated transfer hose with aeration tip. I think it would be nice to add an inline thermometer between the chiller and three way valve--possibly an inline oxygen stone there too.
 
I brewed a 10 gallon coffee milk stout with this system today. Worked great except I don't like spilling wort everywhere when I move around my hoses to reconfigure between mashing and chilling. I need to come with a solution, likely involving three-way valves. My goal is to be able to do the following without moving any hoses:

1. Recirculate with pump and RIMS back to the kettle inlet.
2. Recirculate with pump and chiller back to the kettle inlet.
3. Transfer with pump and chiller to fermenter.

I believe I'll need a three way valve after my pump to switch between RIMS and chiller, then another after my chiller to switch between recirculating and transfer. This will require two inlet ports on my kettle lid and dedicated hoses if I don't want to swap the hose between the RIMS and chiller outputs. I already have a dedicated transfer hose with aeration tip. I think it would be nice to add an inline thermometer between the chiller and three way valve--possibly an inline oxygen stone there too.
I use three way valves in my setup to not have to diconnect any lines at all during brewing.. I use 24v dc pumps as well with are permanently installed inline...I hve pics in my build thread if your looking for any ideas..
 
I use three way valves in my setup to not have to diconnect any lines at all during brewing.. I use 24v dc pumps as well with are permanently installed inline...I hve pics in my build thread if your looking for any ideas..


Thanks! I will definitely check out your build thread for ideas.
 
This has me intrigued! I've recently switched to all electric and have been pondering a RIMS tube from Brewhardware for dialing in my mash temp. Are you using any sort of false bottom or is the bazooka tube doing the trick for you when you are recirculating?

Your setup is what I envision myself moving towards. Are you boiling in the same kettle or pumping to another kettle?
 
This has me intrigued! I've recently switched to all electric and have been pondering a RIMS tube from Brewhardware for dialing in my mash temp. Are you using any sort of false bottom or is the bazooka tube doing the trick for you when you are recirculating?

Your setup is what I envision myself moving towards. Are you boiling in the same kettle or pumping to another kettle?

This is a BIAB (brew-in-a-bag) setup so I have a bag in the kettle during the mash. I also have a bazooka tube installed as backup. I pull the bag and grain from the kettle after the mash and boil in the same kettle.

I still use propane to heat up to my mash temp and to boil. The RIMS tube's primary role is to maintain the mash temperature. It works great on both 5 gallon and 10 gallon batches.

The Brewhardware.come RIMS tube is very well made. I like the design, particularly the housing for the electrical end of the element. I'm probably going to build a 3 gallon electric system at some point and just swap in the same element and housing from this system when I use it. The triclamp setup makes it modular.
 
Very nice! Sounds like a great setup you have going on there.

The brewhardware products are great quality! I have one of their heat sticks that I use in my boil kettle, and the quality is amazing! I'll be putting this RIMS tube on my wishlist.
 
Thank you for sharing this. I'm in the middle of a new build of my own and realized my original plan isn't going to work to control the mash temp. So I'm leaning towards a rims build and only using 115 volt to drive the element.


Why does a 5500 watt element driven on half power only produce 1375 watts?
 
Here are some additional photos from my brewing session last Sunday, showing the system and platform during mash recirculation as well as the Auber plug and play controller during the step up to mash out. (The propane burner is required during the step.) The key fob next to the controller turns my pump on and off.

System (Mash).jpg


Platform (Mash).jpg


Controller (Mash Out).jpg
 
Here are some additional photos from my brewing session last Sunday, showing the system and platform during mash recirculation as well as the Auber plug and play controller during the step up to mash out. (The propane burner is required during the step.) The key fob next to the controller turns my pump on and off.

This is very cool. My experience with BIAB was a disaster. I was like a total newbe. Your thread makes me wish I'd given it another chance. I built my new mash tun already.


What is the box you used to mount the pieces into?
 
I just bought a cheap p38i pump and did my first ever BIAB with recirculation.Didnt go well.The little 1.7 GPM would fill up the 7" of head space to the top of the bag/basket.I needed to keep unplugging it to let the bag drain and balance out with the wort outside the bag...Don't know what Im going to do.Bit of a bummer
 
I just bought a cheap p38i pump and did my first ever BIAB with recirculation.Didnt go well.The little 1.7 GPM would fill up the 7" of head space to the top of the bag/basket.I needed to keep unplugging it to let the bag drain and balance out with the wort outside the bag...Don't know what Im going to do.Bit of a bummer

If you are having overflow issues then you either need to improve the flow of wort through the grain or restrict the output of the pump with a valve.

Given that your pump is only pushing 1.7 GPM then I believe the former to be the solution. It is hard to picture without photos of your setup but it sounds like the grain is being significantly compacted and not allowing wort to flow through.

My suggestion would be to either increase the size of your bag or basket--which might not be possible if it is as large as your kettle will accommodate--or run the output from your pump right into the grain as opposed to above. That should rouse the grain into suspension.

Are you doing full volume, no sparge BIAB? That's what I'm doing--my bag is actually larger than my kettle and the grain is freely suspended in the full volume of water. (There is some compaction due to the suction of the pump but I was able to mitigate the issue by feeding the return from the pump into the mash rather than just letting it fall or splash from above.)
 
This is very cool. My experience with BIAB was a disaster. I was like a total newbe. Your thread makes me wish I'd given it another chance. I built my new mash tun already.

What is the box you used to mount the pieces into?

Ha--I've had my share of disasters with BIAB, including two occasions where the bag burnt or broke. Some people seem to crank out great beer with the simplest of BIAB setups--I just keep adding gear to mitigate my issues. But that's part of the fun for me.

The box is a plastic produce tray like the one seen here:

http://www.ipakmachinery.com/tray-styles/returnable-plastic-container-produce-tray/

A restaurant gave it to me once to carry home my takeout. I asked if they wanted me to return it and they laughed because they had dozens of them. After dinner I immediately began scheming how to use it for brewing.

I store my controller and cables inside the box when they are not in use. I mounted a plywood base with a plexiglass cover on top of the box and used that to mount my components.
 
Ha--I've had my share of disasters with BIAB, including two occasions where the bag burnt or broke. Some people seem to crank out great beer with the simplest of BIAB setups--I just keep adding gear to mitigate my issues. But that's part of the fun for me.


Sorry, this is a bit off topic.

Same here. I took some towels into the garage, that 30 seconds was enough for my bag to melt to the bottom and when I grabbed it a good bit of grain came out. That was it for me and I went back to what I know. I'm not going to have a HLT this time though.

Do you plan to stick with the bag or will you get a mash tun?
 
Do you plan to stick with the bag or will you get a mash tun?

I'm sticking with the bag. It's unlikely I'd burn or break the bag with my current setup.

I ran into issues before when I direct fired the mash to increase or maintain temperature with my propane burner and had my pump on for recirculation without inserting the return into the mash. The grain compacted and the bag was in prolonged direct contact with the kettle bottom while the burner was on--pretty much a recipe for a burnt or melted bag.

With the RIMS tube, I no longer use the propane burner to heat the mash with the exception of the step up to mash out and even then I raise the bag slightly from the bottom of the kettle by pulling more of it up and over the side of the kettle. I suspect I will actually remove the mash out from my process sooner rather than later.
 
I just bought a cheap p38i pump and did my first ever BIAB with recirculation.Didnt go well.The little 1.7 GPM would fill up the 7" of head space to the top of the bag/basket.I needed to keep unplugging it to let the bag drain and balance out with the wort outside the bag...Don't know what Im going to do.Bit of a bummer

I modified my basket to help with the overflow issue. Also I plan to make spacers to attach to the basket rim so that when I put the basket in the kettle they create a small gap between the basket rim and the kettle ridge it rests on. That way if the level gets too high it falls right back down the wall of the kettle.

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Power equals voltage squared divided by resistance. Thus, for a given load (heating element) the power consumed varies with the square of the voltage. Doubling the voltage provides 2 squared, or 4, times the power. Halving the voltage provides 1/2 squared, or 1/4, times the power.
 
As per one of my earlier posts, I grew tired of disconnecting and reconnecting hoses throughout the brewing process and spilling wort all over the place so I upgraded my brewing platform with three-way valves to eliminate the issue.

I installed a three-way on the outlet of my pump so that I easily route the flow to my RIMS tube (during the mash) or my chiller (after the boil).

I also installed a three-way on the outlet of my chiller so I can easily route the output to the my kettle (for recirculating during chilling) or a fermenter (when chilling is complete).

The output of my RIMS tube is always back to the kettle via a weldless port in the kettle lid. There's a second weldless port in the lid as well to receive the flow from the chiller (when recirculating during chilling).

I haven't tested it yet but I'm planning a brew for next weekend. Ideally I should be able to set up my platform and connect all hoses before the brew, then only have to operate valves as the brewing process unfolds.

Future considerations still include the addition of a hopback--though I'm starting to feel like "whirlpooling is the new hopbacking" and maybe I don't need it--and the possibility of hard plumbing the connections between the pump, RIMS tube and chiller.

I'd love to be able to label my hoses as I measured them all so that they made their connections over the shortest distance possible without kinking. I tried a Sharpie today but I can see it will just rub off. Some sort of waterproof tag might work if attached to the camlocks. Has anyone else found a solution for this?

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I may steal the 3 way valve idea. I have a new system on the way and I was concerned about changing hoses.
 
I may steal the 3 way valve idea. I have a new system on the way and I was concerned about changing hoses.

The 3 way valves are the way to go... Ive been using them myself. I mounted mine onto the rims though in an attempt to minimize wasted wort sitting in hoses. It eliminated having to move any lines or hoses around in the brewing process.

also I would be careful about any 3 way valves on the cold side of the chiller since they hold and release liquid trapped inside whenever they valve position is changed making it a potential place for infections to hide and start. (even more so than a smaller ball valve.)
 
I agree. I understand the three way's purpose there but you are asking for trouble. If you want to use it, I would put a camlock or other QD between the PC and the valve. This would allow you to remove the valve and sanitize it separately. Alternatively, while running boiling wort through it before chilling, cycle the valves in both directions returning the boiling wort to the kettle. So slowly so as the capture the liquid that hides in the body of the valve ("behind the ball").
 
robcj,

I am very close to putting this system together for myself.. I'm still undecided on the method of wort return. I have a Brewhardware "Spincycle" whirlpool installed and may see if I can tuck the bag under it and fold around it at the top. May be hard to untuck it and remove the bag after mashing. My bag will sit on a false bottom from Brewhardware https://www.brewhardware.com/product_p/biabbottom17.htm I am also looking at running a Blichmann RIMS Rocket 240v on 120v or Brewhardware RIMS tube 5500w 240v at 120v. I would be interested to know how you have liked this setup now that you have had it for a while. Have you made any tweaks or improvements?
 
robcj,

I am very close to putting this system together for myself.. I'm still undecided on the method of wort return. I have a Brewhardware "Spincycle" whirlpool installed and may see if I can tuck the bag under it and fold around it at the top. May be hard to untuck it and remove the bag after mashing. My bag will sit on a false bottom from Brewhardware https://www.brewhardware.com/product_p/biabbottom17.htm I am also looking at running a Blichmann RIMS Rocket 240v on 120v or Brewhardware RIMS tube 5500w 240v at 120v. I would be interested to know how you have liked this setup now that you have had it for a while. Have you made any tweaks or improvements?

Connecting some dots here, but the only reason I can think of for tucking the bag under the Spincycle would be to use it during the mash. Why would you want to use this device during the mash?
 
Connecting some dots here, but the only reason I can think of for tucking the bag under the Spincycle would be to use it during the mash. Why would you want to use this device during the mash?
I need to return the wort for recirculating somewhere and I have this piece already installed so I thought maybe it would work. I believe Colorado Brewing Systems uses this setup with a basket rather than a bag. I was hoping not to drill another port for say a lock line return or floating hose. I thought about trying to put the whirlpool on a cam lock setup in the pot put it just puts it to far into the pot.
 
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