1-2 bbl start up

[Raoul_Duke_PhD]

I wanted to get some ideas of a good nano start up system. I am currently running a 15 gallon Blichmann system with a tower of power and RIMS rocket. Can I just scale this up, literally? I was looking at utilizing a 2 kettle system (55 gal). Will the TOP and RIMS rocket be enough to maintain recirculation temperature? Any help would be appreciated.

 

[02RedWS6TA]

You're going to need minimum 2 5500 watt elements in the boil kettle for that size batch. 3 if you step up more than 55 gallon kettle. So, in short, no you're not going to be able to scale up from that.

Edit: it's out of my range as far as help but you're going to want at least a 50 amp panel and two ulwd elements in the boil kettle.

You can check out places like the electric brewery for panels or places like spike for turn key systems. I believe they have a 50 gallon system.

Single vessel turn key Colorado Brewing systems makes them up to 100 gallon set ups.

 

[Raoul_Duke_PhD]

You're going to need minimum 2 5500 watt elements in the boil kettle for that size batch. 3 if you step up more than 55 gallon kettle. So, in short, no you're not going to be able to scale up from that.

The Blichmann kettles come with 2 heating elements. I'm asking if the one pump, tower of power and RIMS rocket will be enough to recirculate and heat as a RIMS system? If not, what can I replace them with?

 

[Raoul_Duke_PhD]

In other words, can I simply replace with bigger kettles and call it a day?

 

[stevehaun]

Once you get above 1 barrel - rims or herms is really not practical (too much thermal mass relative to wort flow). At 1 barrel you can use rims or herms to maintain temps.

 

[02RedWS6TA]

The Blichmann kettles come with 2 heating elements. I'm asking if the one pump, tower of power and RIMS rocket will be enough to recirculate and heat as a RIMS system? If not, what can I replace them with?

I assume the boil kettle has a 4500watt element then you're using a 220v rims rocket? It's not going to cut it at 55 gallons.

At 55 gallon kettle you'll need two 5500 watt elements in the boil kettle and a hefty herms coil with a 5500 watt element in a hlt then a mash tun. Someone might make a custom HLT/mash tun with a large enough false bottom to run an element under it but I'm not sure.

 

[BrunDog]

Once you get above 1 barrel - rims or herms is really not practical (too much thermal mass relative to wort flow). At 1 barrel you can use rims or herms to maintain temps.

Larger systems can do RIMs. -they are just larger. That said I think very large systems use steam heated mash tuns, augers, etc.

 

[madscientist451]

So the question is, can you use a RimsRrocket with a 55 gallon kettle/mash tun?
If one doesn't have enough power. maybe just add another? You'd have to get another control module a second pump, and have two outlets on the kettle.
The cost of those items may cause you to think of a better, cheaper way to accopmplish the same thing, but maybe that set up would work for you.
The Data sheet on Blichmann's web site says that one Rims Rocket can step mash a 20 gallon batch, so I suppose two units could do a 40 gallon batch.
I'd contact Blichmann and ask them. Good luck with your project.

 

[madscientist451]

After some thought this sounds like a workable idea.
I went on the Morebeer site and came up with these cost estimates:
Prices are rounded off:
1 55 gallon Blichmann Kettle with
2 Boil Coils $1100
1 55 Gallon Ketttle for mash tun $675
2 Rims Rocket 240v $480
2 TOP control units $1150
55 Gallon false bottom $199
(I might use brewing basket similar to Colorado Brewing Systems)
2 High temperature pumps $400
Not included is a table/stand to put everything on, hoses, connectors, and if using a mesh basket, a hoist to lift the spent grain.

Total of what is listed above: $4004

The Colarado Brewing System Nano Brewer Dual is $5300
but comes with a hoist arrangement and a plate chiller.
Their system should be a little faster since pumping from the mash kettle to the brew kettle isn't required.

Since you already have one RIMS rocket and a controller you can take about $850 off the above price?
There are some pros/cons to using a RIMS in this kind of arrangement.
Sabco has a 1bbl, 3 kettle, gas fired with electric RIMS for $16K+.

Lots to think about, my 2 cents is a system that has been tested and refined is worth a little more money.
You can probably build something like the CBS with components you find on your own for a little less.

 

[02RedWS6TA]

After some thought this sounds like a workable idea.
I went on the Morebeer site and came up with these cost estimates:
Prices are rounded off:
1 55 gallon Blichmann Kettle with
2 Boil Coils $1100
1 55 Gallon Ketttle for mash tun $675
2 Rims Rocket 240v $480
2 TOP control units $1150
55 Gallon false bottom $199
(I might use brewing basket similar to Colorado Brewing Systems)
2 High temperature pumps $400
Not included is a table/stand to put everything on, hoses, connectors, and if using a mesh basket, a hoist to lift the spent grain.

Total of what is listed above: $4004

The Colarado Brewing System Nano Brewer Dual is $5300
but comes with a hoist arrangement and a plate chiller.
Their system should be a little faster since pumping from the mash kettle to the brew kettle isn't required.

Since you already have one RIMS rocket and a controller you can take about $850 off the above price?
There are some pros/cons to using a RIMS in this kind of arrangement.
Sabco has a 1bbl, 3 kettle, gas fired with electric RIMS for $16K+.

Lots to think about, my 2 cents is a system that has been tested and refined is worth a little more money.
You can probably build something like the CBS with components you find on your own for a little less.

Building your own CBS 100 gallon system would be the way to go. Have them or spike build the kettle/controller. And source the basket from arbor fab, elements from the electric Brewery, and the rest of the fittings from a place like brewers hardware. Building a house system is easy enough. Their chiller sucks so I'd go with something better like a big dudda diesel or the sabco chiller.

 

[Raoul_Duke_PhD]

After some thought this sounds like a workable idea.
I went on the Morebeer site and came up with these cost estimates:
Prices are rounded off:
1 55 gallon Blichmann Kettle with
2 Boil Coils $1100
1 55 Gallon Ketttle for mash tun $675
2 Rims Rocket 240v $480
2 TOP control units $1150
55 Gallon false bottom $199
(I might use brewing basket similar to Colorado Brewing Systems)
2 High temperature pumps $400
Not included is a table/stand to put everything on, hoses, connectors, and if using a mesh basket, a hoist to lift the spent grain.

Total of what is listed above: $4004

The Colarado Brewing System Nano Brewer Dual is $5300
but comes with a hoist arrangement and a plate chiller.
Their system should be a little faster since pumping from the mash kettle to the brew kettle isn't required.

Since you already have one RIMS rocket and a controller you can take about $850 off the above price?
There are some pros/cons to using a RIMS in this kind of arrangement.
Sabco has a 1bbl, 3 kettle, gas fired with electric RIMS for $16K+.

Lots to think about, my 2 cents is a system that has been tested and refined is worth a little more money.
You can probably build something like the CBS with components you find on your own for a little less.

I called Blichmann and they said the RIMS rocket would work for just maintaining temp, but no go on temp ramping. The Colorado Brewing system seems like a great deal.

 

[Raoul_Duke_PhD]

Building your own CBS 100 gallon system would be the way to go. Have them or spike build the kettle/controller. And source the basket from arbor fab, elements from the electric Brewery, and the rest of the fittings from a place like brewers hardware. Building a house system is easy enough. Their chiller sucks so I'd go with something better like a big dudda diesel or the sabco chiller.

They seem like they're the best deal for the money.

 

[Raoul_Duke_PhD]

I also wanted to ask a few other things. Should my fermenters and brite tank be considerably bigger than my batch sizes? Say, I wanna do 2 bbl, how big should the fermenter and brite tank be?

 

[Dcpcooks]

Lots to consider re fermentor size. If you plan to sell your beer I'd suspect you'll end up wanting to do double brew days at some point. So I'd start there. 2 bbl batch x2= 4 bbl plus head space of 20-30% puts you in a five bbl fermentor and bright tanks.

If you do the math per batch your better with larger batches in my opinion. I'd say you want 3-6 unitanks rather than a dedicated bright tank.

 

[02RedWS6TA]

I also wanted to ask a few other things. Should my fermenters and brite tank be considerably bigger than my batch sizes? Say, I wanna do 2 bbl, how big should the fermenter and brite tank be?

For personal use or a start up brewery?

Personal use I'm sure 2bbl is fine. If I was starting a brewery on a 2bbl system I'd want both 2 and 4bbl tanks myself, that way you can double batch your popular beers.