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Old 10-28-2007, 01:07 AM   #1
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On a previous thread Shafferpilot mentioned the necessity to increase burner to liquid surface area in order to facilitate boiling on a large scale.
I stole this idea (and if I decide to go through with it, the parts) from an RV water heater.
Another problem may be trying to weld to the thin aluminum pot.
BTU's can be controlled by burner orifice size and an adjustable high pressure regulator.
If anybody has any background in - thermodynamics, engineering, or just messing around with this type of stuff - and could help me design this, please let me know!
I'm looking for a system to handle 25-30g and from what I've heard, a standing burner won't cut it.

 
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Old 10-28-2007, 11:55 AM   #2
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WOW! how do the big boys do it? do they have a similar system to what you've illustrated above?

i'm now taking reservations for open spots in my car to go see this in action when it's up and running!!

 
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Old 10-28-2007, 12:44 PM   #3
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I'm wondering if maybe a couple electric elements may work. They would be easier to install into the pot. I could even built them onto a separate mount and drop it in. Either way, I guess I should add a bonding lug to the pot.

So, say (2) 240V, 4500w elements on a dedicated 50A.

Of course, getting the 8-3w/g (maybe 6awg if I go aluminum) through the underground conduit going to my garage should be fun, but I've been wanting to get more power out there anyway.

The 4500W elements are available cheaply ($15) throughout the internet, so the real downfall is getting adequate power to them.

At about $.10/kwh, a 2 hr usage would cost me about $1.80 vs. (guessing) 180,000BTU's(~2gal/hour) @ average of $2.50/gal would be about $5.00.
Pretty minor I guess...

Any thoughts on whether 9000w would be efficient enough for 25-30g?

Has anybody ever heard of any problems with a submersible element in the wort?

 
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Old 10-28-2007, 12:54 PM   #4
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MonsterMash does large volumes. I can't remember exactly, but I thought it was 20-25 gals. He used to use burners but switched to electric (maybe just the HLT, though) so he could automate the process. I'd PM him and see what he thinks. I don't see any reason why you shouldn't be able to use a burner and large diameter pots. Morebeer also sells 20 gallon setups (and used to sell 40 gallon setups) that used burners.
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Old 10-28-2007, 12:57 PM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SenorWanderer
WOW! how do the big boys do it? do they have a similar system to what you've illustrated above?

 
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Old 10-28-2007, 01:17 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 5isnotenough
I'm wondering if maybe a couple electric elements may work.
Electric elements directly in the wort would be too high a point source of heat and would cause scorching. In addition to the scorching, they would be exceedingly difficult to clean.
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Old 10-28-2007, 01:27 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fingers
Electric elements directly in the wort would be too high a point source of heat and would cause scorching. In addition to the scorching, they would be exceedingly difficult to clean.
http://home.chattanooga.net/~cdp/boilnew/boilnew.htm

Yes, I believe you are right, and this article touches on that, too. I'm going to look further into the "extra low watt density" mentioned...

Also, any thoughts on if a constant stirrer (like the one shown in the article) may be enough to prevent scorching?

 
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Old 10-28-2007, 01:43 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fingers
Electric elements directly in the wort would be too high a point source of heat and would cause scorching. In addition to the scorching, they would be exceedingly difficult to clean.
Lots of brewers in the UK use direct heat from electric elements.
I know a of few who use kettle elements.
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Old 10-28-2007, 02:12 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fingers
Electric elements directly in the wort would be too high a point source of heat and would cause scorching. In addition to the scorching, they would be exceedingly difficult to clean.
In theory I guess this could happen but not in my experience. I use two 3kw elements in my boiler and have never scorched my wort.

As far as cleaning goes, I leave the wet hops in the boiler after brewing and clean it out the next day. The acidity cleans the elements withut me having to do anything.

/Phil.
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Old 10-28-2007, 02:17 PM   #10
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Hey Phil.
I've just been mooching around your website.
Followed the link from Jim's place.
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