When does a lager go to secondary?

I have a lager in primary right now. It's been 12 days now and it's still fermenting as quickly as it was on day 3... right around a bubble every 16 seconds. My cellar temps fluctuate between 34 (it's been very cold here lately) and 50, but any change in temp is gradual since my lagering bunker is underground.

Right now there is a ton of trub. So am I better off leaving my beer in primary for an extra week or so? Or should I rack off early to secondary and let it finish fermenting without all the trub?

What say you?

Which yeast are you using? Did you do a diacetyl rest?

I'd say perhaps a hydro reading is in order, and if it's close to your expected FG, the diacetyl rest should happen until fermentation is complete.

The yeast is White Labs German Lager Yeast.

I've not yet begun the diacetyl rest yet. I thought I was supposed to wait until the fermentation slows before doing that.

What is the SG?
Have patience while fermenting.
Colder means more time.

ok ok ok... I'll go take the SG... brb....


The OG was 1.067.

Toot said:

The yeast is White Labs German Lager Yeast.

I've not yet begun the diacetyl rest yet. I thought I was supposed to wait until the fermentation slows before doing that.

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If you leave your brew in the primary until all fermentation is done, then you don't need to do a diacetyl rest. Not all lager yeasts need the rest, but if you were planning on doing one then when your sg is 3/4 of the way to terminal gravity, you raise your primary temps up a little to around 60f until fermentation is finished and then rack to secondary and cool to lager.

Thanks for the info.

OG = 1.067

SG after 12 days in a carboy = 1.040

It's steady, but it's sloooow. I still have half an inch of krausen.

Toot said:

It's steady, but it's sloooow.

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Sounds like a lager to me!!

Toot said:

Thanks for the info.

OG = 1.067

SG after 12 days in a carboy = 1.040

It's steady, but it's sloooow. I still have half an inch of krausen.

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I vote leave it alone for another week. I would wait until it drops down into the mid 20s. The colder your cellar is, the longer it will take. Generally I ferment lagers in the low 50s, so the low 40s and upper 30s are a touch low for the primary. Relax....dont worry....have a homebrew

So what's the tradeoff? On the one hand, the lagering is sloowww. On the other hand the longer it's on the trub, the more risk of off flavors. But I'm guessing if it's cold, I can get away with it being on the trub for longer, right? I mean, the yeast should work better than most bacteria in the 34-45 degree range anyway, wouldn't you say?

So give it another 4-7 days in primary before the diacetyl rest?

The main worry with leaving beer on the trub is autolysis...where the yeast begins to consume itself. If your beer is still fermenting, you're probably not in much danger of that happening. As long as you are getting steady bubbles, I would give it at least 4 days...better 7.

Much below 50f and your lager will take a looooong time to ferment out. Like was said, have patience and don't take the beer off the primary yeast until fermentation is finished.

Tank you ladies and gents! I'm in no hurry, I just want to make sure my procedures are as good as possible, given my conditions. I cracked the cellar door a little more, so maybe that'll get the temp up a bit.

boo boo said:

Much below 50f and your lager will take a looooong time to ferment out. Like was said, have patience and don't take the beer off the primary yeast until fermentation is finished.

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Like boo boo said I would leave it be. I have done this 3 times and bottled after the ferment was up. Carbed at ale temps. Then refridgerated for 6-8 weeks. It worked out well. Very crisp & clean. Its like a cool steam beer.

You can check out John Palmers website on how to brew lagers. It should answer all your questions

http://www.howtobrew.com

Go to: Brewing your first extract, What's different for lagers... Chapter 10

Without checking, I think he says that you can move it over the 2nd shortly after vigorous activity. Then chill it to lager temps 6-8 weeks maybe longer. After that, you do the diacetyl rest. Which is basically a few days at warmer temps to complete the ferment. It requires alot of patience to me during the 6-8 weeks of waiting.

I checked, he said leave until its done bubbling.... rack the 2ndary and chill. Lagering time depend on how cold you go. I've seen several recipes do it like I stated above.

About autolysis... He says it can occurr but I think it takes a lot longer than most people think. He's had the wort sitting on yeast for several months on the primary w/o issue. I think the worry about autolysis is more likely paranoia on most peoples parts. I really wonder how many people have had the problem? I wonder if this usually happens to newbies, thinking it was autolysis when it was really poor sanitation.

Last week I was at my LHBS and a guy there said you don't have to sanitize new fermentors!!! Said he heard this on a podcast. LOL. Might of been confused with food grade bucket fermentors. You can pre-treat non-food grade with baking soda and water. Neutralizes the plastic and make it suitable for use. As long as it wasn't used for pickles!!! I remember somebody here in HBT who did this who made a pickle beer!!!

I really like the bottle lagering method for my first lagers. Its like making an ale but you use lager yeast and ferment 47-65'F. I used Superior Dry Lager Yeast. If you try it I don't think you'll be disappointed. I like this because it didn't tie up my fermentor for a long time. My way is 3 weeks tops. I'm trying to stockpile lagers before it gets warm.

Good Luck!!

I'm low on space and I don't have enough bottles right now, but I have a TON of space in my very cold wine cellar. I get your point that bottle conditioning is fine and simple, but it doesn't work for my situation. It'll be staying in a carboy until the secondary is complete. In fact, it's going to sit there until early april. This is going to be a true Maibock.

Gotcha,

If you wait that long you will need to make a yeast starter at bottling time.