Fermentation snuck up in me!

CornyKegs 728
Homebrew Talk - Beer, Wine, Mead, & Cider Brewing Discussion Forum

Help Support Homebrew Talk - Beer, Wine, Mead, & Cider Brewing Discussion Forum:

This site may earn a commission from merchant affiliate links, including eBay, Amazon, and others.
E

elleric

Well-Known Member
Joined
Oct 4, 2011
Messages
47
Reaction score
5
So odd~ usually I start checking on my ale gravity after three days and then check as I have to so I can raise the temp for a diacetyl rest at about 75% of the way through fermentation.

The Irish red from northernbrewer I just made though, started at 1.045 and the kit estimated 2 weeks primary. Now after 3 days, 1.011 already! I was only expecting it to go to 1.010 or 1.009 ish total!

I chilled the wort to about 60, used a filtered fish pump for about 30 mins, pitched about 15 mins into aeration and then set the temp controller to 64 with a 1 degree variance on both heating and cooling.

The yeast was American ale II, I made a 2L starter (1.035 gravity, with a stir plate) and I use wyeast nutrient.

What can cause this expedited ferment? And are there any issues with this decreased time? I don't think the lack of a good diacetyl rest will be a huge issue but no real clue there.

This was also my first time doing a full wort boil if that matters.
 
Usually, a healthy fermentation only takes between 24 hours and 72 hours. The rest of the time is just to give the yeast a chance to clean up some off flavours and for the yeast to fall out of suspension. Sounds like you had a very healthy fermentation!

On a side note, do you find diacetyl rests are necessary in your ales? Usually they are only done with lagers, as the yeast flavours in an ale overpower any diacetyl (also, diacetyl is considered a good thing in many beers like stouts)
 
2 weeks by the directions is to keep new brewers from bottling the day after the bubbling in their airlock stops.

It is quite normal for the gravity to be where you are after 3 days.

I never measure my gravity until 3 weeks when I am ready to bottle.

I suggest leaving your beer at the cool temperature for 2 weeks raise it a little for 1 week then check for final gravity. The less you mess with it the less the risk of infection.
 
theredben said:
Usually, a healthy fermentation only takes between 24 hours and 72 hours. The rest of the time is just to give the yeast a chance to clean up some off flavours and for the yeast to fall out of suspension. Sounds like you had a very healthy fermentation!

On a side note, do you find diacetyl rests are necessary in your ales? Usually they are only done with lagers, as the yeast flavours in an ale overpower any diacetyl (also, diacetyl is considered a good thing in many beers like stouts)
Click to expand...

I'm still pretty new to brewing, (less than a year) so I am kind of in a 'do what they tell you to' state still. Listening to Jamil I get the idea that he pitches below his intended ferment temp and then raises it to ferment (in my case pitch at 60, ferment at 64) Then towards the end of fermentation raise the temp up a few degrees for the diacetyl rest (I raised this one to 68) I was under the impression this was his process for all beers not just lagers and I had to copy my process from somewhere... What risk do I run doing this with ales? Raising the temp is just a matter of a few button presses so there isn't really any work there.
 
I'd just bottle it and let it clear up in the bottle, it's pretty clear you won't have that much more fermentation going on... and this way you can drink it faster. :D.
 
elleric said:
I'm still pretty new to brewing, (less than a year) so I am kind of in a 'do what they tell you to' state still. Listening to Jamil I get the idea that he pitches below his intended ferment temp and then raises it to ferment (in my case pitch at 60, ferment at 64) Then towards the end of fermentation raise the temp up a few degrees for the diacetyl rest (I raised this one to 68) I was under the impression this was his process for all beers not just lagers and I had to copy my process from somewhere... What risk do I run doing this with ales? Raising the temp is just a matter of a few button presses so there isn't really any work there.
Click to expand...


That is a VERY good method. keep doing that and you will make fantastic beer :mug:
 
gospurs said:
I'd just bottle it and let it clear up in the bottle, it's pretty clear you won't have that much more fermentation going on... and this way you can drink it faster. :D.
Click to expand...

Well, I can't do that yet! I keg and I was expecting about 2 weeks to get going on this and no empty keg right now! I have to wait for one of my kegs to blow first (have a wiezen that's close) or for the extra I just ordered from b3 to get here.

Needing to wait for things at least means I won't rush it!
 
gospurs said:
I kinda disagree - that method is way overkill for a Betty Crocker extract Irish Red.
Click to expand...

I'm actually a little insulted by this. Betty Crocker?

The temp control either has an impact or it doesn't. The temp change at stages either has an impact or it doesn't.

If your argument is that the diacetyl rest isnt needed for an irish red then that is fine and you probably know more than i do but it sound like the argument is that it's ok to have less attention to detail or a less complete process because you arnt ready for all grain? Isn't the time you are getting started and learning the best time to actually nail down a good process? And get accustomed to it?

I'm not seeing the downside here. Why is making that end of ferment adjustment a bad thing? It quite honestly took 30 seconds to press the temp controller buttons
 
Ok, I apologize, in retrospect, that was rude.

It strikes me as pretty unnecessary for an extract Irish Red - as others have stated, it's an ale with quite a lot going on, and whatever minuscule difference said process will have on the overall flavor will pretty readily be outweighed by other factors to the point where it would almost certainly be impossible to distinguish beer on which this had been done and beer on which it had not in a double-blind test.

Personally I'd liken it to busting out the high-precision kitchen mandolin to chop a carrot for stew. Then again, if I can cut a corner and it actually will not have a perceptible effect on the outcome of my brew - you can bet that I will.

So, different strokes, I guess.
 
I am basically going to make a starter, but not for the typical purpose.

What I want to do is start with one vial of White Labs California Ale Yeast and grow the yeast to the point that I will have 4 times as many cells as what I started out with in the one vial.

I will then split the "starter" into four equal parts and then refrigerate them for later use. Before each brew day, I will make a new starter from one of those four containers.

My question is - How do I determine how big of a starter to use to increase the original cell count by four times.

Using Mr. Malty, the calculator is really just made for making a beer starter for one brew. I am wondering if there is still a way to use the Mr. Malty tool to do what I am trying to do. Alternatively, is there another tool that might work?

One big problem I have is that the Mr. Malty tool only tells me how many cells I need for a batch of beer. It doesn't tell me how many cells I will be starting with.

Thank you.
 
jarrodaden said:
I am basically going to make a starter, but not for the typical purpose.

What I want to do is start with one vial of White Labs California Ale Yeast and grow the yeast to the point that I will have 4 times as many cells as what I started out with in the one vial.

I will then split the "starter" into four equal parts and then refrigerate them for later use. Before each brew day, I will make a new starter from one of those four containers.

My question is - How do I determine how big of a starter to use to increase the original cell count by four times.

Using Mr. Malty, the calculator is really just made for making a beer starter for one brew. I am wondering if there is still a way to use the Mr. Malty tool to do what I am trying to do. Alternatively, is there another tool that might work?

One big problem I have is that the Mr. Malty tool only tells me how many cells I need for a batch of beer. It doesn't tell me how many cells I will be starting with.

Thank you.
Click to expand...

a fresh vial is approximately 100 billion cells. Just use the calculator to work out a starter that results in 400 billion cells and you will have 4 vials worth of yeast.

Please note that your storage may not match the vial's shelf life.
 
jarrodaden said:
I am basically going to make a starter, but not for the typical purpose.

What I want to do is start with one vial of White Labs California Ale Yeast and grow the yeast to the point that I will have 4 times as many cells as what I started out with in the one vial.

I will then split the "starter" into four equal parts and then refrigerate them for later use. Before each brew day, I will make a new starter from one of those four containers.

My question is - How do I determine how big of a starter to use to increase the original cell count by four times.

Using Mr. Malty, the calculator is really just made for making a beer starter for one brew. I am wondering if there is still a way to use the Mr. Malty tool to do what I am trying to do. Alternatively, is there another tool that might work?

One big problem I have is that the Mr. Malty tool only tells me how many cells I need for a batch of beer. It doesn't tell me how many cells I will be starting with.

Thank you.
Click to expand...

This is my process which is similar to yours.

Day -2: Create 1.5-2L starter in 1gal Growler (I use Mr.Malty tool and its usually 1.5-2L for my 5Gal batch.)

Day 0 (brewday:)
-Make an additional 2L starter.
-Stick the starter that has fermented out in Fridge for quick 2-3hour Chill to take some of the yeast out of suspension. decant and pitch slurry to Brew.
-Pour 2nd starter back into 1gal Growler.(there is usually a bit of slurry left on the bottom.)

Day +2:
-Place the 2nd batch into fridge for a few hours. (sometimes overnight)
-Decant excess wort. divide the slurry into 4 parts. and pour into 1pint mason jars that have sterile water/glycerine mix.
-place 4jars in freezer


The problem I have is that the Jars take up toooooo much valuable room, so i'm going to start doing slants and petri dishes.
 
Scuba_Stan said:
This is my process which is similar to yours.

Day -2: Create 1.5-2L starter in 1gal Growler (I use Mr.Malty tool and its usually 1.5-2L for my 5Gal batch.)

Day 0 (brewday:)
-Make an additional 2L starter.
-Stick the starter that has fermented out in Fridge for quick 2-3hour Chill to take some of the yeast out of suspension. decant and pitch slurry to Brew.
-Pour 2nd starter back into 1gal Growler.(there is usually a bit of slurry left on the bottom.)

Day +2:
-Place the 2nd batch into fridge for a few hours. (sometimes overnight)
-Decant excess wort. divide the slurry into 4 parts. and pour into 1pint mason jars that have sterile water/glycerine mix.
-place 4jars in freezer


The problem I have is that the Jars take up toooooo much valuable room, so i'm going to start doing slants and petri dishes.
Click to expand...

have you considered using the smaller jelly jars for the storage phase?
 

Similar threads

brewbuddynick
Can somebody help me with a high final gravity. In search of solutions or cause of problems.
Replies
10
Views
809
Bobby_M
Bobby_M
Ironton Brewing
A38 slow fermentation
Replies
1
Views
698
JohnSand
JohnSand
Langerz
"Odd" Fermentation Gravity Change
Replies
6
Views
506
hotbeer
hotbeer
Mr Drinklestien
Marzen Recipe Review
Replies
23
Views
1K
Mr Drinklestien
Mr Drinklestien
H
First Lager - Slow Start
Replies
5
Views
806
VikeMan
VikeMan

Latest posts

Back
Top