Carb Problem

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mwmoose152

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I brewed a wheat beer which sat in the primary for a few weeks, secondary for a month, and then put in a keg. This was my first time kegging, so I don't know if I screwed up, but i put the C02 on it 19 days ago at 13 PSI at 36 degrees, I sampled a few times over the past week (a little anxious), and it still seems flat. There is no head, and the beer tastes flat.

Did I screw up along the way? Was I supposed to put priming sugar in the beer, or should I just wait longer?

Thanks, all!
 
Sounds like a co2 leak somewhere assuming you are sure you have the gas on and are sure the co2 is actually entering the keg.
 
C02 definitely in the tank. Gas definitely on. Burped the keg a few times. What should I do for resolution? Reseed lid?
 
You have a leak somewhere in there it sounds like but I am surprised you do not have an empty tank at this point. Put some starsan suds or soap suds around the lid and connecters... If you see bubbles popping up you have a leak where the bubbles are forming. Then depending on what's leaking you may have to re seat the lid or whatever. You definitely shouldn't add priming sugar if carbing with co2.
 
Turn the pressure up to at least 20 psi to carbonate beer. Beer does not absorb enough CO2 @ 13psi to carbonate it. I carb mine @ 30 psi and it takes about three days. If you do it at 20 it should take 5-7 days. Either way you have to have over 15 psi or you will be waiting forever.
 
joel4482 said:
Turn the pressure up to at least 20 psi to carbonate beer. Beer does not absorb enough CO2 @ 13psi to carbonate it. I carb mine @ 30 psi and it takes about three days. If you do it at 20 it should take 5-7 days. Either way you have to have over 15 psi or you will be waiting forever.
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If by forever you mean 10 to 14 days. I carb my beer with 12PSI at 40* and everything works just fine...
 
IffyG said:
If by forever you mean 10 to 14 days. I carb my beer with 12PSI at 40* and everything works just fine...[/QUOTE

I have never tried to carb at 12 psi, but i am pretty sure it wont work to carb to a sufficient level. Pubs keep their kegs at 12-13 psi and their beers don't carbonate more while they are being stored. From what I know about beer you need at least 12.5 psi of CO2 for beer to absorb CO2. So if you are carbonating your beer at 12 psi your regulator is most likely reading wrong. Why would you wait 10-14 days to drink beer when you could have it in 3-5 days anyways. This person asked a question about why his beer isn't carbonating and you tell him to do something he has already tried. That was really helpful.
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Joel I'm sorry but you are mistaken. Beer will carbonate just fine at carbonation temps and 10 psi. It just takes a bit of time. I run my kegerator and keezer at 38 degrees and my beer carbs up fine at 10 psi. Yes, you can run a higher psi for a quicker carb, and many times I do, but you always run the risk of over carbing when you do that. The sure way to get perfectly carbed beer is to set it and forget it at about 9-10 psi for most ales being served in the 38 to 40 degree temperature range.

As to how pubs run their systems, they are often dealing with system balance issues due to their extended line runs. They have to account for that when they decide on their serving pressures. If a pub needs 13 psi to balance their beer line length, they can protect the beer from over carbonation by increasing the storage temp by a few degrees.
 
Zen_Brew said:
JOEL I'm sorry but you are mistaken. Beer will carbonate just fine at carbonation temps and 10 psi. It just takes a bit of time. I run my kegerator and keezer at 38 degrees and my beer carbs up fine at 10 psi. Yes, you can run a higher psi for a quicker carb, and many times I do, but you always run the risk of over carbing when you do that. The sure way to get perfectly carbed beer is to set it and forget it at about 9-10 psi for most ales being served in the 38 to 40 degree temperature range.

As to how pubs run their systems, they are often dealing with system balance issues due to their extended line runs. They have to account for that when they decide on their serving pressures. If a pub needs 13 psi to balance their beer line length, they can protect the beer from over carbonation by reducing the storage temp by a few degrees.
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I don't know if you read the original question but he has had his beer on at 13 psi@36 degrees for 19 days and it seem flat to him. He also said there were no leaks. If you wanted to solve this problem what would you do? Probably not carb at 10psi @38 degrees and hope for better results. If that works for you that is great but it is not working for him. As for the pub lines yes they are longer but even if they were short lines you would end up with very "soft" beer if you left them @ 9-10psi until the end of the keg. Beer does not hold in CO2 over extented periods of time if the pressure is below 12.5 psi
 
mwmoose you seem to be doing everything right. After 19 days at 13 psi your beer should be carbed right about perfect for a wheat beer. It sounds like the co2 isn't flowing, or is leaking out as others have said, but a leak should have left you with an empty tank unless you have a very large co2 tank.

Try burping your keg with the relief valve a couple more times. Hold the valve open for a good 3 or 4 seconds and make sure it comes back up to pressure. It should take a few seconds to come back up to pressure which you should be able to hear. If it does, then you know you have good flow of co2. At that point I can only see two possibilities. Either you have a leak, or your co2 gauge is misreading the output pressure. You can turn the main gas valve off at the tank and bleed the line all the way down and make sure the gauge reads right at zero. If it goes all the way down to zero, then I would think the reading at 13 psi should be ballpark close. Close enough that you should not have flat beer after 19 days.
 
joel4482 said:
I don't know if you read the original question but he has had his beer on at 13 psi@36 degrees for 19 days and it seem flat to him. He also said there were no leaks. If you wanted to solve this problem what would you do? Probably not carb at 10psi @38 degrees and hope for better results. If that works for you that is great but it is not working for him. As for the pub lines yes they are longer but even if they were short lines you would end up with very "soft" beer if you left them @ 9-10psi until the end of the keg. Beer does not hold in CO2 over extented periods of time if the pressure is below 12.5 psi
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Joel, when I answered your post I was not attempting to solve the OP's problem. I was pointing out some misinformation that a beer would never carbonate at 13psi. In fact 13 psi and 19 days at 36 degrees in a correctly functioning system will get you a correctly carbonated hef. The fact that the OP's beer is not carbonated is not due to the fact he had the pressure set to low.

I completely understand the concept of a quick carb at high pressure, rocking the keg, and other such techniques to get you beer up to carb quickly. That does not change the fact that you are not entirely correct in some of your carbonation assumptions that you are presenting as hard facts.
 
Zen_Brew said:
Joel, when I answered your post I was not attempting to solve the OP's problem. I was pointing out some misinformation that a beer would never carbonate at 13psi. In fact 13 psi and 19 days at 36 degrees in a correctly functioning system will get you a correctly carbonated hef. The fact that the OP's beer is not carbonated is not due to the fact he had the pressure set to low.

I completely understand the concept of a quick carb at high pressure, rocking the keg, and other such techniques to get you beer up to carb quickly. That does not change the fact that you are not entirely correct in some of your carbonation assumptions that you are presenting as hard facts.
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I am on here to help people with specific problems they are having. I never said his beer would not carbonate at 13psi. I was saying that it takes a lot longer. What he was doing was not working so I told him something I thought would help him. The information I have presented is facts. I work at a brewery and know how we do things and why.
 
It's been my experience that setting the psi at serving pressure for two to three weeks will result in proper carbonation. This is factually the best method in my opinion and in the reading I have done from those that been in the game for years.
 
joel4482 said:
I am on here to help people with specific problems they are having. I never said his beer would not carbonate at 13psi. I was saying that it takes a lot longer.
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Umm... really?

joel4482 said:
Beer does not absorb enough CO2 @ 13psi to carbonate it.
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joel4482 said:
Why would you wait 10-14 days to drink beer when you could have it in 3-5 days anyways. This person asked a question about why his beer isn't carbonating and you tell him to do something he has already tried. That was really helpful.
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A) I don't mind waiting because at 3-5 days in the keg, the beer is still green and tastes better after a bit of time
B) I never said anything to the OP, I was just pointing out misinformation in your post

To the OP: I'd make a pressure tester for the corny keg. I made one out of a 0-60 PSI gauge, an MFL gas disconnect and a 1/4 MPT to flare adapter. I found that my keg that had no visible leaks and wasn't carbing was losing pressure slowly. Swapped out my gaskets and the keg works just fine now.
 
joel4482 said:
I have never tried to carb at 12 psi, but i am pretty sure it wont work to carb to a sufficient level. Pubs keep their kegs at 12-13 psi and their beers don't carbonate more while they are being stored. From what I know about beer you need at least 12.5 psi of CO2 for beer to absorb CO2.
Click to expand...

Just wanted to point out that your logic is 100% correct assuming the beer is already carbed to 12 PSI. It will not absorb more unless you increase the pressure on the regulator. However, when you start with uncarbed beer it will carbonate to an equilibrium with anything, provided there are no leaks in the system.
 
joel4482 said:
I don't know if you read the original question but he has had his beer on at 13 psi@36 degrees for 19 days and it seem flat to him. He also said there were no leaks. If you wanted to solve this problem what would you do? Probably not carb at 10psi @38 degrees and hope for better results. If that works for you that is great but it is not working for him. As for the pub lines yes they are longer but even if they were short lines you would end up with very "soft" beer if you left them @ 9-10psi until the end of the keg. Beer does not hold in CO2 over extented periods of time if the pressure is below 12.5 psi
Click to expand...

This is really really wrong. Beer holds whatever carbonation 12 PSI equates to at a certain temp forever if kept at 12 PSI. It holds 3 PSI forever if kept to 3 PSI. There is no "lower limit".

OP - The only thing I can think of is how full is your keg? If it's full all the way up to the lid, (as in, almost overflowing), the lack of headspace and contact area will mean very slow carbing. If it's just below the bottom of the gas diptube or lower, then this is not the issue....

Maybe you just like more highly carbonated beer? 12 PSI for nearly 3 weeks is at equilibrium, and it won't carb further unless you change something else, (although the others here are right, 12 PSI at 36F SHOULD be around the correct level of carbonation for that style!). Are you sure your fridge is at 38F? If it is at more like 45F, the equilibrium carbonation volume will be lower, and the beer will be flat indeed at 12 PSI...
 
shortyjacobs said:
Are you sure your fridge is at 38F? If it is at more like 45F, the equilibrium carbonation volume will be lower, and the beer will be flat indeed at 12 PSI...
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Even if that's the case you are talking about a difference between 2.2 and 2.5ish volumes of CO2. 2.2 wouldn't seem flat (at least to me it's not). Perhaps the OP is expecting the super fizzy nature of a commercial wheat beer and instead is getting something appropriate for a mild.

To the OP: have you successfully carbed a beer with this set up in the past?
 
IffyG said:
Even if that's the case you are talking about a difference between 2.2 and 2.5ish volumes of CO2. 2.2 wouldn't seem flat (at least to me it's not). Perhaps the OP is expecting the super fizzy nature of a commercial wheat beer and instead is getting something appropriate for a mild.

To the OP: have you successfully carbed a beer with this set up in the past?
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I dunno, this says 2.2 to 2.7....I feel like that's significant, (I'd certainly notice a difference between 2.2 and 1.7, for example, which is the same difference)...

I agree though, expecting fizzy wheat, getting not so fizzy wheat...
 
I was pulling numbers from memory, but I do agree that there would be a difference between 2.2 and 2.7. However, 2.2 is not flat by any stretch of the imagination. It's not super carbed, but you do get bubbles and head formation (at least in my experience).
 
shortyjacobs said:
OP - The only thing I can think of is how full is your keg? If it's full all the way up to the lid, (as in, almost overflowing), the lack of headspace and contact area will mean very slow carbing. If it's just below the bottom of the gas diptube or lower, then this is not the issue.
Click to expand...

Good point shorty, I had not considered that. If the keg is super full there would be less surface area exposed to absorb co2 and it would carb much slower. Sometimes I will have a keg with only like 4.5 gallons in it and I will lay it down with the co2 post facing up on top of the the other kegs in my keezer. It carbs much faster as the entire length of the keg now exposes surface area to the co2.
 

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