Pale Ale Recipe Idea

Ok so I am new to all grain and I am going to jump into the all grain business here for my next brew. I have devised a recipe for a Pale Ale as a Clone to Short's Brewing Company's: Pandemonium Pale Ale. First I have no idea what I am doing exactly, but I have read the flavor profile of these malts and tried to get a Burnt Orange colored, Slighly carmal, Bitter/sweet 50/50 balance beer. I am looking for some ideas to tweek this recipe to perfection because it is going to be a Fathers Day Present. Please help me. Thanks Dan

Pale Ale
American Pale Ale

Type: All Grain
Date: 5/30/2009
Batch Size: 5.00 gal
Brewer: Dan
Boil Time: 60 min


Grain Bill
0.50 lb Rice Hulls (0.0 SRM) Adjunct 4.60 %
7.75 lb Pale Malt (2 Row) US (2.0 SRM) Grain 71.23 %
1.00 lb Caramel/Crystal Malt - 40L (40.0 SRM) Grain 9.19 %
0.75 lb Cara-Pils/Dextrine (2.0 SRM) Grain 6.89 %
0.50 lb Munich Malt - 10L (10.0 SRM) Grain 4.60 %
0.25 lb Caramel/Crystal Malt -120L (120.0 SRM) Grain 2.30 %
0.13 lb Special B Malt (180.0 SRM) Grain 1.19 %....Too Much Carmal???

Hop Schedule
0.50 oz Glacier [7.40 %] (60 min) Hops 13.7 IBU
0.50 oz Glacier [7.40 %] (30 min) Hops 10.5 IBU
0.50 oz Ahtanum [5.20 %] (15 min) Hops 4.7 IBU
0.50 oz Ahtanum [5.20 %] (5 min) Hops 1.9 IBU

1 Pkgs American Ale (Wyeast Labs #1056) Yeast-Ale

Well, I think it's a bit too much caramel. You've got 2.13 pounds of crystal/caramel malts with the carapils. I'd definitely cut that down. The special B would be fine without so much of the other crystal malts. I'd lose the 120L, and probably ditch the carapils.

Secondly, it won't hurt anything, but you don't need rice hulls. If you want to toss them in, it won't hurt, but you're just throwing money away by adding them.

Too much caramel for my taste. Personally, I'd kill off the C120 and Special B. Then I think you'd have a very balanced, good, refreshing beer. I'd even scale the C40 back to half a pound personally.

With that, you've got a Mid-4% - 5%ish beer depending on your efficiency. You should be at the bottom of the range for the style in both gravity and IBU. Should be balanced and tasty

Of course this is all to my taste. I'm sure others will disagree

edit: Yooper beat me. God I'm a slow typer I agree with her on the rice hulls.

Yes, way too much in the crystal malts. You are at about 20%, at least twice as much as you need IMO. Cut back to ~5% for the 40L, ~3% for the CaraPils if you want to use it, pick either 120L or Special B if you want and use just a bit 1-2 ounces. Replace the deleted crystals with additional base malt. If you are looking for a color tweak in the burnt orange direction add an ounce of dark roasted like Carafa or chocolate malt. Agree with Yooper in that there is no reason to use rice hulls here. Just curious, why did you include them?

I heard that by adding the rice hulls in your mash you decrease the dough balls and they help prevent stuck mashes.

I do want a carmel note to come through in the beer. The beer I am trying to mimic isn't a textbook PA. It is certainly on the darker side of the PA SRM and is lower on the gravity. It has a ABV under 5% for Pandemonium Pale Ale. According to the Beer Smith program I have a predicted OG @ 1.058 for my beer, it should ferment to 1.012 giving me an ABV of 5.13%. I placed my efficiency at 70% because, well I just don't know what a probable efficiency will be so 70% seemed right.

I am taking the 120L crystal and Special B out. Can I substitute any crystal to get the desired SRM. I was thinking a little 60L crystal instead of the 40L???

Crystals aren't just about color, there's a different flavor imparted by 60L versus 40L - although either would be fine. 60L's a little more caramel-ey. You'll get a good amount of color from the Munich (an EXCELLENT choice in an IPA), remember.

Rice hulls can be important with beers with a lot of rye or wheat malt, but are usually unnecessary when doing a beer that's 100% barley-malt. Rye gets sticky, wheat has no hull, so when those become a large percentage of the grist you can run into issues with sparging.

Here is the revised recipe. I think I want to keep a very small portion of the Special B. I like the flavor profile, it seems like in the correct amount it will be what my beer needs. 1/8th a pound will impart a marginal flavor, so I think I am going to keep it in there. I scaled back the carapils, but I still have it in there. What can I say I love a frothy foamy head on my brew. The Base is uped and the 40L is down a bit. My IBU's are balanced back to where I wanted it. And I made the decision to go with 20L munich instead of the 10L. The rice hulls are gone due to your comments on them. Disregard the post before this one. Here is the revision...

Type: All Grain
Date: 5/30/2009
Batch Size: 5.00 gal
Brewer: Dan
Boil Size: 6.00 gal
Boil Time: 60 min
Brewhouse Efficiency: 70.00

Grain Bill
9.25 lb Pale Malt (2 Row) US (2.0 SRM) Grain 85.06 %
0.75 lb Caramel/Crystal Malt - 40L (40.0 SRM) Grain 6.90 %
0.50 lb Munich Malt - 20L (20.0 SRM) Grain 4.60 %
0.25 lb Cara-Pils/Dextrine (2.0 SRM) Grain 2.30 %
0.13 lb Special B Malt (180.0 SRM) Grain 1.15 %

Hops Schedule
0.50 oz Glacier [7.50 %] (60 min) Hops 13.4 IBU
0.50 oz Glacier [7.50 %] (30 min) Hops 10.3 IBU
0.50 oz Ahtanum [5.20 %] (15 min) Hops 4.6 IBU
0.50 oz Ahtanum [5.20 %] (5 min) Hops 1.9 IBU
1 Pkgs American Ale (Wyeast Labs #1056) Yeast-Ale



Beer Profile

Est Original Gravity: 1.055 SG
Measured Original Gravity: 1.010 SG
Est Final Gravity: 1.013 SG Measured Final Gravity: 1.005 SG
Estimated Alcohol by Vol: 5.42 % Actual Alcohol by Vol: 0.65 %
Bitterness: 30.2 IBU Calories: 43 cal/pint
Est Color: 10.1 SRM

I think you'll have a winner on your hands

DShoaf said:

Calories: 43 cal/pint

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shouldn't that be at least 143?

AZ_IPA said:

shouldn't that be at least 143?

Click to expand...

BeerSmith basis the calorie calculation off of the actual OG and FG not the estimated ones, and it always defaults the actual OG to 1.010 and the actual FG to 1.005 which is where it gets the 43 calories from.

I'd strongly consider switching out the Cara-Pils for flaked barley. 0.25# in 5 gallons isn't enough to cause haze issues but it should drastically improve foam stability and lacing assuming you do all the other foam positive things like pitch the proper number of healthy yeast cells and control fermentation temperature.

I'd strongly consider switching out the Cara-Pils for flaked barley. 0.25# in 5 gallons isn't enough to cause haze issues but it should drastically improve foam stability and lacing assuming you do all the other foam positive things like pitch the proper number of healthy yeast cells and control fermentation temperature.

ChemE said:

I'd strongly consider switching out the Cara-Pils for flaked barley. 0.25# in 5 gallons isn't enough to cause haze issues but it should drastically improve foam stability and lacing assuming you do all the other foam positive things like pitch the proper number of healthy yeast cells and control fermentation temperature.

Click to expand...

you can say that again

Can someone describe Ahtahnum hops to me? What are they similar to? I think I do have access to them, but I want to try this recipe with hops I know.

Here's where I go to find a description of what hops do for the beer. http://beeradvocate.com/beer/101/hops

There is a bit more info on Ahtanum hops here for you too. http://www.brewboard.com/index.php?showtopic=86160

aren't carapils unnecessary if you already have crystal malt in your grain bill?