Overcarbed

Hey guys...So I started a thread on Friday night, commemorating the first sip of my first beer. The beer was an AG Brooklyn Brew Shop Chestnut Brown Ale.
Here are some specifics:

• Brewed 1/12/12
• Fermented in the low 60s for 1 week
• Moved to a 65 degree environment for 2 more weeks
• FG readings were 1.014 on three consecutive days
• I cold crashed approx 48 hours
• Bottled, avoiding any potential infections/aeration
• Kept in a 70 degree environment for 3 weeks
• Put in fridge after 3rd week and left in fridge for 6 days to get nice and chilly
• Popped first beer 3/2/12

Well, when I popped the cap, I heard the hissing of escaping carbonation. I was overjoyed that I wasn't one of those folks that was going to have flat beer, I HAD CARBONATION!

As soon as I started pouring though, I noticed that yes...I certainly DID have carbonation. TOO MUCH. I let the beer warm up a bit and sit, allowing for the head to relax. Then I poured the rest of the beer (which was also foamed up in the bottle) into the glass.

Aside from a lambic carbonation type, the taste was...good. It was malty for sure, but it sorta had a "clean" finish to it. I know that sounds like a good thing, but I'm not so sure it's right for that type of style (Brown Ale). I'd take a few swallows, get the hints of malt, etc., but then it'd finish crisp and clean. When I'd burp, I'd actually taste a "clean" finish as well. Does that seem normal?

I'm not a seasoned taster. I can't sit here and tell you all sorts of tasting notes, but what I can say is that it just tasted too clean for a Brown Ale. Too crisp and clear. And obviously, too carbonated.

Having used the online priming calculator, I'm confident that I used the right amount of priming sugar, and I'm extremely confident that fermentation was finished. I'm also so OCD about cleanliness/sanitizing that I can't imagine that it'd be an infection.

The ONLY thing I can think of would be that I SLOWLY and CAREFULLY returned my hydrometer samples back to the carboy after taking FG readings. I was told, that if I was everything was impeccably sanitized, that this wouldn't be an issue, as long as I didn't splash it when returning it to the carboy, which I certainly did not.

Can anyone help me with what I may be experiencing here? Why so much carbonation? What "tastes" am I getting here?

Thanks!

The carbonation might be lending the "clean" taste you're talking about, to varying degrees. It could be a recipe issue as well, and without seeing your grain bill it's hard to say.

That being said... you should probably just let it age longer. If you're sure you want less fizz, you can easily degas the beer even without re-capping. But as far as finish goes, that's how my porter was for the first month after it became drinkable, and now it's rich and full-bodied from start to finish.

IMO, you should stick the bottles in your closet and brew something new. Have one of yours every week or so, and when they get really good, they're done. That's when you'll start freaking out about not having enough left!

Here is something very illuminating that Revvy told me regarding my issue with gushers:

Revvy said:

Nope. more than likely the fact that some gushed and some were under is really just because they're just on the cusp of being ready.

Inconsistant carbonation, usually simply means that they are not ready yet. If you had opened them a week later, or even two, you never would have noticed. Each one is it's own little microcosm, and although generally the should come up at the same time, it's not an automatic switch, and they all pop on.

A tiny difference in temps between bottles in storage can affect the yeasties, speed them up or slow them down. Like if you store them in a closet against a warm wall, the beers closest to the heat source may be a tad warmer than those further way, so thy may carb/condition at slightly different rates. I usually store a batch in 2 seperate locations in my loft 1 case in my bedroom which is a little warmer, and the other in the closet in the lving room, which being in a larger space is a tad cooler, at least according to the thermostat next to that closet. It can be 5-10 degrees warmer in my bedroom. So I usually start with that case at three weeks. Giving the other half a little more time.

If you watch Poindexter's video on time lapsed carbonation, you will see that in many instances, before a beer is carbed it my gush, that's not from infection, or mixing of sugars, but because the co2 hasn't evened out- it hasn't been pulled fully into the beer. Think of it as there's a lot of co2 being generated and most of it is in the headspace, not in the beer, so there's still "over pressure" in the bottle, so it gushes when it is opened.

But when the beer is truly carbed it all evens out, across the bottles.

Video Link: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FlBlnTfZ2iw

You just caught some before they evened out, and others had. The 3 weeks is kinda just an average, some take longer some sooner.

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It sounds like your process was fine, so give it another couple weeks and see if things even out. Mine did!

Kerin said:

The carbonation might be lending the "clean" taste you're talking about, to varying degrees. It could be a recipe issue as well, and without seeing your grain bill it's hard to say.

That being said... you should probably just let it age longer. If you're sure you want less fizz, you can easily degas the beer even without re-capping. But as far as finish goes, that's how my porter was for the first month after it became drinkable, and now it's rich and full-bodied from start to finish.

IMO, you should stick the bottles in your closet and brew something new. Have one of yours every week or so, and when they get really good, they're done. That's when you'll start freaking out about not having enough left!

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I don't really have a grain bill, as this was a kit from BBS (Christmas present). Since it's my first batch, I'm not too worried about it, as I've since moved on from kits and have a better handle on my grain bill/yeast/etc.

So you think I should take them out of the fridge and let them come back to room temp? And let them just hang for a week or 2 or 3?

rifraf said:

Here is something very illuminating that Revvy told me regarding my issue with gushers:



It sounds like your process was fine, so give it another couple weeks and see if things even out. Mine did!

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Yea, I read that awhile ago as well. But since I'm only doing 1-gallon batches, I only have 10 beers. I've had 5 of them thusfar, and ALL of them were pretty much overcarbed. Are you saying that if I left them at room temp for another 2-3 weeks, that the carbonation will go down? I wasn't aware that was possible.

If so, should I take the remaining 5 out of the fridge and bring them back to room temp and let them sit another week or 2?

Any other opinions on this?

I would give it a shot. It's not that you have less carbonation after a couple extra weeks, it's that the CO2 that has been generated is forced back into suspension in the beer. That happens better at warmer temperatures, and if it hadn't happened completely before you threw them in the fridge then you might have the issues you're talking about.

Pull them out, give them another week or two at 70 and pop them in the fridge for 2 days and see if it goes away. If it doesn't, at least you've eliminated this possibility and can start potentially trouble shooting other things like your priming calc, potential infection, or something else.

Edit: which online priming calc did you use? I'm not familiar with any because I do 5g and mostly use the pre-packaged priming sugar but I know some of those online tools start to wonk out with things like partial boil, late malt addition, etc. Maybe it's being thrown off with a 1g batch or maybe you lost more in the trub than expected. Smaller volumes will inherently be more sensitive to over/under priming.

For the most part the other posters have covered this issue, but I will say these two things:

1) I'd actually suggest you let them age at room temp for a couple weeks. Fridging the beer is good for clarification and CO2 quality, but it doesn't help the flavors of the beer condition, age, and improve because at fridge temps those biochemical reactions are slowed down by thousands of times. You want the flavors mingling at warmer temps, and the yeast cells to be able to continue their cleanup and conversion of the materials in your beer.

2) 1-gallon batch? Ow. While I applaud the idea of doing small batches to get the hang of things, 10 bottles of beer is so few that by the time you sample enough to know it's ready, most of them will be gone. Do 3-gallon batches at the very, very least.

rifraf said:

I would give it a shot. It's not that you have less carbonation after a couple extra weeks, it's that the CO2 that has been generated is forced back into suspension in the beer. That happens better at warmer temperatures, and if it hadn't happened completely before you threw them in the fridge then you might have the issues you're talking about.

Pull them out, give them another week or two at 70 and pop them in the fridge for 2 days and see if it goes away. If it doesn't, at least you've eliminated this possibility and can start potentially trouble shooting other things like your priming calc, potential infection, or something else.

Edit: which online priming calc did you use? I'm not familiar with any because I do 5g and mostly use the pre-packaged priming sugar but I know some of those online tools start to wonk out with things like partial boil, late malt addition, etc. Maybe it's being thrown off with a 1g batch or maybe you lost more in the trub than expected. Smaller volumes will inherently be more sensitive to over/under priming.

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Here's the priming calculator I'm currently using:

http://www.tastybrew.com/calculators/priming.html

@Kerin- I'd love to do 3 gallon batches. I'd love to do 5 gallon batches. I simply don't have the room right now. I'm living in a shell of a condo unit because it's for sale. We cleared out EVERYTHING to make it so it's ready to show at a moment's notice. I'd love to step up, but can't right now.

JeffoC6 said:

I'm living in a shell of a condo unit because it's for sale. We cleared out EVERYTHING to make it so it's ready to show at a moment's notice. I'd love to step up, but can't right now.

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Oh, damn. My heart goes out to you, brew-bro. May your fortunes improve.

even if it's a small batch i wouldn't bother returning hydro samples to the fementor, i'd just as soon not take any and give it lots of time to finish.

JeffoC6 said:

Here's the priming calculator I'm currently using:

http://www.tastybrew.com/calculators/priming.html

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Hopefully someone with experience using these can pop in. Did the Brooklyn Brew kit not give you instructions on how much to use? I was actually going to get that for Christmas but they were backordered so I ended up with a standard 5g kit. I've been thinking about a BB kit for all-grain experience/1g bottle for experiments.

Hopefully you get some more space soon :cheers:

rifraf said:

Hopefully someone with experience using these can pop in. Did the Brooklyn Brew kit not give you instructions on how much to use? I was actually going to get that for Christmas but they were backordered so I ended up with a standard 5g kit. I've been thinking about a BB kit for all-grain experience/1g bottle for experiments.

Hopefully you get some more space soon :cheers:

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They did not advise how much to use, so I used that calculator based on peoples' recommendations on here. I've been using that calculator ever since (have bottled 5 batches already). I simply find the style that I brewed and then use the amouint of priming sugar recommended. I still don't understand what I couldve done wrong?

Hmm, no idea. Unfortunately I'm stumped. Have your other batches all come out well carbed? Hopefully someone else pops in with some guidance!

Since this was my first beer to finish, I don't know if the other 4 (that I've already bottled and used this calculator for) are going to have the same issues or not. I'm worried now.

The BBS instructions say to use 3 Tablespoons of honey in 1/4 cup of water for priming sugar, did you use more?

JeffoC6 said:

Since this was my first beer to finish, I don't know if the other 4 (that I've already bottled and used this calculator for) are going to have the same issues or not. I'm worried now.

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What did you use as your priming sugar? How much did you use?

rifraf said:

I would give it a shot. It's not that you have less carbonation after a couple extra weeks, it's that the CO2 that has been generated is forced back into suspension in the beer. That happens better at warmer temperatures, and if it hadn't happened completely before you threw them in the fridge then you might have the issues you're talking about.

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So, someone stop me if I am wrong, but beer absorbs CO2 better at fridge temps than @70 degrees.

Slimy_Hog said:

The BBS instructions say to use 3 Tablespoons of honey in 1/4 cup of water for priming sugar, did you use more?

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Per the calculator I referenced (http://www.tastybrew.com/calculators/priming.html) I used .5 ounces.

I've used this calculator for the 4 other subsequent brews that I bottled. Could it be that even though I'm entering my finished volume as "1 gallon," I should be adjusting it due to the fact that I'm not really bottling exactly 1 gallon due to the trub/yeast cake that I'm leaving behind?

HELP

Draken said:

So, someone stop me if I am wrong, but beer absorbs CO2 better at fridge temps than @70 degrees.

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Other way around, it absorbs better @70.

@Jeffo in theory yes. It's not an issue I've had w/ 5 gallon batches but I would think that a smaller volume of beer will be more sensitive to over/under priming. Someone will probably correct me if that's wrong.

What yeast did you use that can finish primary at 60 in one week? EC-1118???

To further lower the risks, brew a bigger batch, let it primary 2-3 weeks, bottle after solid hydro readings (don't pour it back in, keep the sample and test the same sample over and over) and bottle condition for 4 weeks.

My first brew was over carbed and I cut my suggested amount of priming sugar in half ever since.

A few notes -

My first beer was over-carbonated as well. It will mellow out over time. I brewed an altbier. 3 weeks after bottling, meh. 6 weeks after bottling, better. Just be patient.

What was the final volume? My issue was I assumed 5 gallons for my final volume before adding the priming sugar. Mistake on my part.

If the beer does not mellow out, I've been told to make an ice water bath, place the beer in there, decap the bottles for 10 minutes, and apply fresh caps.

Good luck with your next brew.

icanbenchurcat said:

What yeast did you use that can finish primary at 60 in one week? EC-1118???

To further lower the risks, brew a bigger batch, let it primary 2-3 weeks, bottle after solid hydro readings (don't pour it back in, keep the sample and test the same sample over and over) and bottle condition for 4 weeks.

My first brew was over carbed and I cut my suggested amount of priming sugar in half ever since.

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Huh? Did you actually read this thread? I left in the primary for 3 weeks, took 3 consecutive 1.014 FG readings and then bottled.

I also can't brew bigger batches...See the end of page 1.

PhillyMike said:

A few notes -

My first beer was over-carbonated as well. It will mellow out over time. I brewed an altbier. 3 weeks after bottling, meh. 6 weeks after bottling, better. Just be patient.

What was the final volume? My issue was I assumed 5 gallons for my final volume before adding the priming sugar. Mistake on my part.

If the beer does not mellow out, I've been told to make an ice water bath, place the beer in there, decap the bottles for 10 minutes, and apply fresh caps.

Good luck with your next brew.

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I'm thinking the final volume was obviously just under 1 gallon, since there was a bit of yeast slurry on the bottom of the carboy.

So can I take my overcarbed brews out of the fridge (they've been in there for 8 days) and return them to 70 degree room temp and give them another week to "settle?" Then, return them to the fridge a week later? Will this skunk the beer?

im confused on your priming sugar issue. my first kit was their chocolate maple porter and it came out great so i bought their book and they spell out how much to use for bottling. the way i see it, your still learning the ropes like many of us. your only talking about 5 beers so go ahead and take them back out and see what happens. worst case scenario you will ruin 5 beers. otherwise just go ahead and drink them and see how your next ones come out.

CPFITNESS said:

im confused on your priming sugar issue. my first kit was their chocolate maple porter and it came out great so i bought their book and they spell out how much to use for bottling. the way i see it, your still learning the ropes like many of us. your only talking about 5 beers so go ahead and take them back out and see what happens. worst case scenario you will ruin 5 beers. otherwise just go ahead and drink them and see how your next ones come out.

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I am too. I was told by everyone on here to not consult kit directions, so I didn't. I used the bottle priming calculator that I linked earlier in this thread to determine how much priming sugar to use.

I guess I'll take out the remainder of the beers and get them back up to room temp for another week, then try them again next week.

JeffoC6 said:

So can I take my overcarbed brews out of the fridge (they've been in there for 8 days) and return them to 70 degree room temp and give them another week to "settle?" Then, return them to the fridge a week later? Will this skunk the beer?

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It'll be fine, man. Just don't leave them out in the sun or under direct lighting and it won't skunk at all.

Kerin said:

It'll be fine, man. Just don't leave them out in the sun or under direct lighting and it won't skunk at all.

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^this...skunking is not caused by repeated warming/cooling of the beer...it's caused by a reaction between hop-derived compounds and UV light (hence the importance of using amber bottles). Slightly off-topic, but I actually had a DFH 90 Minute IPA get skunky on me while I was drinking it on a restaurant's exposed outdoor deck on a very hot August day! Guess I should have drunk it quicker!