Since he asked three years ago, I'm only guessing that he knows by now.
Spotted Cow-like brew?
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Since he asked three years ago, I'm only guessing that he knows by now.
Boerderij_Kabouter
Well-Known Member
The yeast in Spotted Cow is Wyeast's Koelsch 2565. "Farmhouse ale" means nothing. It is just a marketing thing to give some credit to Wisconsin's dairy industry and to point out that they use corn in the recipe. Corn is a large crop in WI.
As may have already been mentioned, I am 90% sure the yeast in SC is dead.
As may have already been mentioned, I am 90% sure the yeast in SC is dead.
Grimm
Well-Known Member
wikki must be wrong then, they state, and i've heard elsewhere that the "farmhouse ale" term/style originated from the saison.
Spotted cow may use the koelsch 2565 but i have to disagree with the origination of the term farmhouse ale.
Spotted cow may use the koelsch 2565 but i have to disagree with the origination of the term farmhouse ale.
Boerderij_Kabouter
Well-Known Member
The term farmhouse ale is real, and I love them. However, Spotted Cow does not fall into that category. The Cow is a farmhouse ale in name but not by style. Unless of course you want to claim that the farmhouse style does not necessarily define what is and is not a farmhouse ale and that the style intentionally allows for regional and stylistic variance.
At the end of the day, if you brew a Spotted Cow like beer, hand it to anyone worth their salt (in beer knowledge), and tell them it is a farmhouse ale, they will be disappointed. It is not funky, austere, or any of the subtle and great things that make a simple farmhouse ale wonderful. The cow is a simple beer with a good amount of corn and very little bitterness. It is a great gateway beer for those new to non-BMC and is a fine beer for tossing a few back. It is by no means a complex or subtly beautiful beer. Not to knock it, just being real about what it is and is not.
Of course, this is all my opinion, and discussing different opinions is the spice of life. It may well be that Dan Carey crafted Spotted Cow with those great Belgian farmhouse ales in mind, but wanted to tailor it into a flagship beer style for the lager drinking Wisconsinites of his home state. So he took out the funk, replaced it with a fruitiness ala the Koelsch yeast fermented warm, and used corn as a thumbs up to the lager and Miller crowd so wide spread in the land of cheese.
tom-A-to tom-ah-to, use loelsch yeast fermented around 68º.
At the end of the day, if you brew a Spotted Cow like beer, hand it to anyone worth their salt (in beer knowledge), and tell them it is a farmhouse ale, they will be disappointed. It is not funky, austere, or any of the subtle and great things that make a simple farmhouse ale wonderful. The cow is a simple beer with a good amount of corn and very little bitterness. It is a great gateway beer for those new to non-BMC and is a fine beer for tossing a few back. It is by no means a complex or subtly beautiful beer. Not to knock it, just being real about what it is and is not.
Of course, this is all my opinion, and discussing different opinions is the spice of life. It may well be that Dan Carey crafted Spotted Cow with those great Belgian farmhouse ales in mind, but wanted to tailor it into a flagship beer style for the lager drinking Wisconsinites of his home state. So he took out the funk, replaced it with a fruitiness ala the Koelsch yeast fermented warm, and used corn as a thumbs up to the lager and Miller crowd so wide spread in the land of cheese.
tom-A-to tom-ah-to, use loelsch yeast fermented around 68º.
Grimm
Well-Known Member
right on, and thanks for the clarification. i love the farmhouse/saison ales myself.
On 10-25-2007 (!), Short Drive posted a clone recipe on this thread for Spotted Cow that included the following instruction:
90 minute mash; 30 at 154; 60 at 170
It is not clear to me what is meant. I understand the first two parts of the instruction: 90 minute mash; 30 at 154. That's straightforward...mash the grains and corn for 30 minutes at 154°. Now what? Do you increase the temp of the mash to 170° and let it go for another hour? I was under the impression that once the mash is completed, hotter "sparge" water is slowly poured/sprinkled over the grains. Is this instruction telling me to mash for an additional hour at a higher temperature? Can someone enlighten me...I seem to be in the dark!
glenn514
90 minute mash; 30 at 154; 60 at 170
It is not clear to me what is meant. I understand the first two parts of the instruction: 90 minute mash; 30 at 154. That's straightforward...mash the grains and corn for 30 minutes at 154°. Now what? Do you increase the temp of the mash to 170° and let it go for another hour? I was under the impression that once the mash is completed, hotter "sparge" water is slowly poured/sprinkled over the grains. Is this instruction telling me to mash for an additional hour at a higher temperature? Can someone enlighten me...I seem to be in the dark!
glenn514
You are correct, the instructions to mash at 154 for 30 and 170 for 60 means you need to somehow raise the temperature of the mash after 30 minutes... There are a couple ways to do this... folks who mash in a keggle or other type of brew-kettle can simply fire up their burner and use that to raise the temp. The other way is to add hot water to raise the temp... if doing the later, the original strike water volume needs to be as small as possible so that a huge amount of near-boiling water isn't required to raise the temp from 154 to 170. In this instance BeerSmith is your friend as it will tell you all the necessary volumes and the specific temps needed to meet the desired temps.
storunner13
Well-Known Member
I'd mash for longer than 30 minutes...probably 60 minutes. Then sparge as usual. At 170˚ the enzymatic activity is stopped.
Jersh and storunner13...
Thank you for your replies. I also posted this same question as a stand-alone thread, and had some replies there, as well. The consensus seems to be that I should mash at 154° for a full 60 minutes, and then pour another 6-7 quarts of water heated to 170° s-l-o-w-l-y over the mash and into the original liquid. Then, "tea-bag" the grain bag a few times, and set it aside, catching all the liquid I can to pour back. Then, turn up the heat and start the 60-minute boil.
Does that sound reasonable and proper procedure?
glenn514
Thank you for your replies. I also posted this same question as a stand-alone thread, and had some replies there, as well. The consensus seems to be that I should mash at 154° for a full 60 minutes, and then pour another 6-7 quarts of water heated to 170° s-l-o-w-l-y over the mash and into the original liquid. Then, "tea-bag" the grain bag a few times, and set it aside, catching all the liquid I can to pour back. Then, turn up the heat and start the 60-minute boil.
Does that sound reasonable and proper procedure?
glenn514
storunner13
Well-Known Member
It sounds pretty close to good. I would read up on https://www.homebrewtalk.com/f39/easy-partial-mash-brewing-pics-75231/ which will give you some great tips. In it it suggests heating up 2 gallons of sparge water in a separate 5 gallon pot (if you have it) and then putting in the grain bag for 10 minutes, dipping it now and then. Otherwise, if you don't have the other bigger pot, I'd just pour the 6-8 quarts of water (slowly) over the grains, and not dip. Dipping will get all that concentrated wort back on the grains. Keep in mind, you'll loose a good amount of water to the grains themselves. But you CAN squeeze the bag to get out some more liquid. Despite ancient homebrewing wisdom, you won't extract any tannins. Be careful though, that bag will be hot!
Yup, storunner13, I have those pages on simple all grain brewing...without the pictures...in my brewing notebook/log.
I believe I will simply heat another 2 gallons of water in a second pot to 170° and do the "tea-bag" thing with the grain bag. That makes the most sense to me, and I did catch where leaving it sit in the sparge water for 10-15 minutes increases efficiency.
I haven't ordered the ingredients yet, and probably won't until early August. SWMBO and I will be in Texas and Kansas for the last half of July, and I don't want any ingredient boxes sitting outside my front door!
glenn514
I believe I will simply heat another 2 gallons of water in a second pot to 170° and do the "tea-bag" thing with the grain bag. That makes the most sense to me, and I did catch where leaving it sit in the sparge water for 10-15 minutes increases efficiency.
I haven't ordered the ingredients yet, and probably won't until early August. SWMBO and I will be in Texas and Kansas for the last half of July, and I don't want any ingredient boxes sitting outside my front door!
glenn514
