O'Hara Celtic Stout, have info, need suggestions

Tomorrow, I'm possibly brewing a batch of O'Hara's Stout. I've looked on the net for some recipe clones but have come up relatively empty. The only source I have for any info pertaining to this brew is an account from a guy who supposedly was drinking with the brewmaster one night and got him to divulge some of the ingredients and some specifics.

Here is what I have thus far:

Only 1 Roasted malt is used; Roasted Barley. No chocolate malt, etc.

Challenger hops for bittering
Fuggles for late addition
IBU's = 45

Their own strain of yeast.

Now, I need to build a recipe around this. Its kind of like an Algebra equation.
I would assume that they use Marris Otter, and I assume they let this one finish a little high, somewhere near 1.020. I'd like to finish between 1.015 and 1.020. Sound good?

Also, I've seen reference to lactic acid being used for Guinness, and being that these 2 beers are "relatively" close, I can't discount the probability that there is some lactic acid in this.

Hope for some good info from you guys.

The lactic acid in Guinness comes from an addition - about 3%, i've heard - of soured Guinness. But a lactic acid addition would be a reasonable substitute for a homebrewer, particularly for stability issues.

They likely use MO as a base, but Golden Promise is also a possibility. In this case MO would be my personal preference.

To get a more accurate reading on their FG, you could just let a bit of it go flat and test with a hydrometer. You could also try to get a good look at the color at the same time; that will basically ballpark the proportion of roasted barley to base.

Oh, and White Labs and Wyeast both offer a yeast strain from Guinness called Irish ale. I suspect that's your best bet, as I don't believe(?) O'hara's bottle conditions.

skyforger, you're right down 28th st from me, cool

I see that their FG yields a 4.3% ABV, and if I calculate that the FG is near 1.020, then I woud need an OG of around 1.055 give or take.

So far I have come up with:

9lbs Marris Otter
13oz Roasted Barley
6oz Crystal 80
2oz Victory malt

1.5oz East Kent @ 60min
.5oz Centennial @ 30 min
.5oz Fuggles @ 10 min

Grand Rapids is a great place to be a brewer!

I think that a FG of 1.020 is a bit high for a dry irish stout; they tend to be between 1.012 to 1.015. 1.020 is more in the imperial stout range - pretty sweet. It's my understanding that most Irish stouts start in the mid-40's.

In the same vein, I would think twice about using crystal 80; it may add a sweetness or richness foreign to the style. I would let a good Marris Otter take care of the maltiness. The Victory is a good thought, though. It adds a nice aromatic complexity.

You could consider adding body with oats, if that's what you're going for with the crystal. Again, probably not authentic. Dry Irish stouts have that name for a reason. But why else do we homebrew if not to tinker?

The hop schedule confuses me a bit. East Kent Goldings are practically a noble hop - rich in aroma, few AA's. Why bitter with them if you're using Centennials anyways? If anything, I would reverse the order (recalculating quantities, of course) of those two. Of course, Irish stouts typically don't have any real hop aroma to them at all; if you want hop flavors and aromas, by all means have 30 and 10 minute additions. But if you want to stay strictly in style, I would just use bittering hops. Maybe a small 30-minute addition.

The IBU's, as you stated in your first post, should be pretty high. I know AA quantities vary, but for typical hops of the varieties you list, I calculate about 30 IBU's - 15 too low. If you want it to be less hoppy, but still have a bit of a bite, this would be good. It would also perhaps be good if you brew with really hard water, like I do; I generally need to bump down IBU's a bit if I don't dilute my well water with distilled.

I see you said you were brewing 'tomorrow,' yesterday. Sorry to bring all this to bear in the 11th hour. If you've already made the beer according to the recipe you posted....well, I don't really see a problem with that. It just might end up a bit more like an export stout in the end.

The dryness of Irish stouts is accentuated by the roasted unmalted barley. It can have a high(er) FG and seem dryer than that because of the higher %s of roasted.

True, some of the dry character comes from the ingredients. But it still won't seem that dry if finished at 1.020. BJCP guidelines specify a FG of 1.007-1.011 for the style; though this is certainly a guideline rather than a rule, and the brewer of course should brew to their taste rather than numbers in a style booklet, I would say that any gravity over about 1.015 won't seem very much like a dry irish stout.

Again from the BJCP: The dryness comes from the use of roasted unmalted barley in addition to pale malt, moderate to high hop bitterness, and good attenuation.

Yah I brewed it already. I ended up hitting 1.065 OG, expected 1.067-8 I think. Pretty excited about that. I mashed at 156*. I'll be kegging it in about 2 weeks. I'll let everyone know how it went.

How long will it be fermenting? I would let it go at least 2-3 weeks, then test it a few days in a row with the hydrometer to make sure it's finished... Letting it go a little longer once fermentation has completed won't be a bad thing.

If you have a lot of trub in the fermenter, you could rack off of that once fermentation has finished. Although it's probably not really needed when the brew will only be in the fermenter for ~1 month (you can't plan these things too tightly, I'm learning)... The more I brew, the more I realize that you don't need to pull the brew out of the fermenter right away (once fermentation has completed)... You can let it sit there for a few more weeks, until you can get everything lined up to keg/bottle it...

Are you planning on pushing this with nitro or just plain CO2? You planning to force carbonate it with CO2 (from the tank) or with sugars? So far, I'm really liking how my home brews come out when primed with honey, and then bottle conditioned for 2+ weeks (at 70F)...

I'll be kegging this in probably another 10-15 days. At that point it'll be a month or so old. I would REALLY like to put this on beergas but I don't know if I'll have the money for a Nitrogen tank and fill. I just today got the holes drilled in the kegerator and the faucets in place. So I haven't even kegged a beer yet, tuesday is the day!