Fermenting for the first time

I just brewed my first AG yesterday. I have a sanke fermenter with a setup I bought from brewershardware.com that seems to be working great.....anyway my question is this. How long until I start seeing some yeast activity in the blowoff tube?

I know it depends on the beer and the yeast. I brewed a raspberry wheat (10g) and used two white labs yeast containers. I plate chilled the wort to 65*-68* and aerated it with oxygen through my oxygenation/thermometer setup I got from morebeer @ ~4 LPM the entire time. I brewed yesterday and it has been in the fermenter for 10 hours. The thermowell is giving me a 64-66* reading, which is ideal for the yeast (according to the label)

I woke up this morning and gave the beer in the keg a good agitation. I am starting to see some blowoff beginning....just wondering how long it takes until the yeast starts to really go crazy.

Thanks
Joe

https://www.homebrewtalk.com/f39/fermentation-can-take-24-72-hrs-show-visible-signs-43635/

As Revvy is going to say in a few more minutes, it can take 24-72 hours before signs of an active fermentation. Even then, your airlock may not show anything. Just think of the airlock as a fun show that sometimes comes to town most of the time.

I'm surprised you're seeing activity already- with only two vials of yeast for 10 gallons, it might take a while to really get going. It depends on the OG and the age of the yeast, but unless the beer was 1.040 or less, two yeast vials was probably underpitching.

So, be patient and wait it out.

The OG was 1.040

Is it a good idea on my next batch to purchase three white lab vials for a 10g batch?

I would purchase 1 vial and do a big starter instead of wasting money on multiple vials. I do 10 gallon batches and ferment in sankes and I have yet to see any blow off at all.

Check out mrmalty.com and click on the "yeast pitching calculator". It'll take the batch size, age of the yeast, etc into consideration and calculator how many yeast cells are recommended for your batch. It's a really good tool, especially for liquid yeast and/or big batches.

ThANKS YOOPERBREW!

Just checked this morning. IT IS GOING INSANE!!!!!!!!!!

The way I look at it is this way. White Labs has the tools to create vials of yeast that are sanitary, specific to any types of beers and in all reality they are not that expensive. $5 a vial is not gonna break me.

"I would purchase 1 vial and do a big starter instead of wasting money on multiple vials. I do 10 gallon batches and ferment in sankes and I have yet to see any blow off at all." - I used two vials and 28 hours later the show is incredible so far (so violent I had to put my 1 gallon arrowhead airlock into 5 gallon bucket to alleviate the mess)...well worth $5 more....perhaps 1 vial and a big starter for a sanke and 10 gallon batch isn't enough

Basically what I am getting at....IMO it doesn't sound like wasting time making a starter is worth it.....if I am getting the same results with an extra $5 vial of white labs yeast....does this sound right or am I way off?

Can you replicate 70-140 billion yeast cells by rehydrating a dry packet of yeast with a starter?

Does the time spent making the starter outweigh spending an extra $5 for an extra vial of white labs to get the sam results?

Thanks
Joe

A starter is not just about re hydrating yeast. As far as making a sanitary yeast environment for the starter, it's the same you're doing for your fermenter. You could spend $15 on 3 vials of yeast, or $5 on one and 30 minutes to make a starter and have more healthy yeast. Under pitching will ferment your beer, but may cause off flavors from the yeast being stressed form working too hard.

making a starter takes 10 mins*. I don't make $30/ hour so yes, yes it is worth it in my eyes.

10 mins of actual work plus a day or so letting it sit - if anything it gives me something to do when SWMBO is getting ready or when I get home 15 mins early from something.

my liquid yeast costs about $7.00 I then harvest to help replicate certain traits of the strain I like. So really it ends up costing me about $1.75 for yeast per 5 gallon batch.

lets look at the math (we'll use 5 gallon batches to make it easy and then I'll give you the 10 gallon savings as well)

make a starter out of 1 vial, split it amongst 2 batches (price now drops to 3.50 for yeast per batch) now harvest your yeast and wash it from the trub off both batches and make another small starter with them - this then gives you another 2 batches bringing the overall yeast per batch price down to 1.75 versus $7/batch

Now let's say you match 12 batchs per year - smart yeast usage comes to 21/year. 1 vial/batch comes to $84/year just in stretching out your yeast you could make TWO EXTRA EXTRACT KITS. If your all grain then you could stretch that even farther. JUST by making 4 batches out of 1 vial of yeast.

Now using your numbers you spend $10 on yeast for a 10 gallon batch. Lets say you did a step starter for this and really built up the yeast (maybe a total of 3 ten min. work sessions) you could take that rather large starter, split it in two and make two 10 gallon batches from the one $5 of yeast (as you pay). then if you harvest and wash yeast from each of these and spend another 3 ten min. work sessions you could get another 2 10 gallon batches). So for 1 hours worth of work split among a couple days, you get 40 gallons of beer and you only spent $5. by doing it YOUR way, you are looking at getting 40 gallons and spent $40 (a $35 dollar difference) do you value your time WELL over $35/hour for something you enjoy? I don't

if you did 12 ten gallon batches per year and stretched out your yeast, you would be looking at $15/year (based off of you saying yeast costs you $5/vial). Your way of using 2 vials per 10 gallon batch at 12 bathces/year would have you spening $120/year a difference of $105/year - that is QUITE A FEW BATCHES OF BEER that you can buy just out of your savings and what 1 hour split among a week!

I got into brewing for 3 reasons:

1. buying craft beer is expensive
2. buying craft beer limits me to what the masterbrewer wants to produce and what season they want to brew it (I like an octoberfest in the spring sometimes and a nice heavy holiday porter in the summer sometimes)
3. I like workingon my own things and creating things rather than just going to the store and letting them do all the work for me - buying 2 vials is just letting the store and the yeast do all the work. by making a starter and harvesting yeast I'm more involved and more of the creator rather than the consumer

If the extra dollars don't bother you then pitching an extra tube or two of yeast is fine. I much prefer dry yeast because it's 30 minutes of re-hydration and toss it in. Some styles however need yeasts that are not available dry, especially to us home brewers. If you spent $10 extra on 10 gallons of beer that's $1.00 a gallon. I've found however that LHBS don't always have multiple vials of yeast in the styles that I would want to use so making a starter is the way to go.

...and at $10 for yeast per 10-gallon batch, that works out to $0.13 per pint of beer just for yeast, which is about 1/4 of the total cost per finished pint in ingredient costs. If you can bring that cost down to around $0.02 per pint by making your own starters, you're making money the more homebrew you drink!

It makes alot of sense. I see alot of fancy stirplates and beakers and so forth which is what turned me off to making starters. It seems like alot of unecessary equipment to do what you all just described....is it really necessary to own this type of equipment in order to make yeast starters?

I just use a jug and some DME when I make a starter, which is rare for me.


edit - obviously some sanitizer for the the jug!

Not sure what DME is.....

dried malt extract


easy starter for people without money:

1. bring water and Dried malt extract to boil
2. cool in an ice bath in sink
3. put into a growler, 22oz botle, whatever that has been cleaned and sanitized throughly.
4. dump in vial of yeast.
5. cover with sanitized piece of aluminum foil.

Let it sit a couple days, pour off most of the liquid and dump into wort.

If your making a 10 gallon batch off of 1 vial, I would do a step up starter make the starter decant liquid and make another batch of DME and water, cool and pour onto yeast and let it ferment.

So to make a starter is it a good idea to start out with a vial of white labs or do the dry packets work as well?

a starter will work for dry yeast - I don't see an issue (someone correct me if I'm wrong) however dry yeast does not have the same "touchiness" as liquid yeast.

Liquid yeast is like driving around in a 100,000 car. you just don't take it to the gas station for a car was. Dry yeast is like driving the POS car your older brother gave you when he went to college, you might take it to the car wash, but "heh why bother"

dry yeast is cheap and easy and very sturdy buggers. these you can just re-hydrate and dump into a batch (I would do 2 packets for a 10 gallon batch to not stress them too much) but don't be shocked when you don't get the exact profile you were looking for in a beer. Liquid yeast is designed to give beer certain characteristics. Thats why there is a whole large selection with variations of liquid yeasts and only like a handful of different stlyes for dry yeast.

If your using liquid, make a starter and harvest and re-harvest. If your using dry, ignore the starter just re-hydrate and then harvest and re-harvest. I took a $2 packet of dry yeast for a quick brew and ended up re-using it for 2 more batches by harvesting and washing so that really my yeast per batch was non-existent.

Very Cool..thanks

ILOVEBEER said:

It makes alot of sense. I see alot of fancy stirplates and beakers and so forth which is what turned me off to making starters. It seems like alot of unecessary equipment to do what you all just described....is it really necessary to own this type of equipment in order to make yeast starters?

Click to expand...

While this equipment is not necessary, it does make the job easier. You can build a stirplate for $10 or so if you have an old wall wart and computer fan lying around, but I've seen plenty of experienced brewers around here using a growler, tin foil, and shaking every time they walk by.

I recently pressure canned 21 quart sized jars of wort made from cheap 2-row. My cost, including propane usage and yeast nutrient, was probably around $6, or a little more than a quarter a jar.