how to use wort chiller plate without pump?

i wonder how to use a counterflow plate chiller by gravity feed. how would this work?
i imagine you have 2 pots, one with hot wort and one with ice cold water, at a high level. then through suction on the tubing one can transfer to two other respective pots at a lower level. and then repeat this until wort cold enough by placing lower pots to higher level. is this the general idea?
thanks!

I don't think your suction would hold out. even if it did, you'd be playing musical pots, and it'd be a slow chill since your water is getting warmer over time and not a constant cold temp fed by a larger source.
I just think the inconvenience would outweigh the cost of a pump from harbor freight.

sounds very long and tedious. Your better off buying the pump. I also recomend counterflow chillers because they are a bit easier to clean in my opinion but thats just me.

Also remember that the most important thing for preventing DMS is how quickly the entire wort gets down to about 150F, not how quickly it's at pitching temp; that's why Jamil and others prefer immersion chillers over CFC/plate chillers (ICs chill the entire wort at once)..

Not saying I have anything against ICs. Just saying I prefer CFC to Plate Chillers.

Also, DMS? Not familiar with what this stands for.

DustinHickey said:

Not saying I have anything against ICs. Just saying I prefer CFC to Plate Chillers.

Also, DMS? Not familiar with what this stands for.

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DiMethylSulfide

It gets boiled off during the boil, but can be created while the wort is above 140, but below the boiling point.

My personal opinion is that it's really only a concern for very light beers, like those made with pilsner malt, and then not so much if you do a 90 minute boil. For pale ales, a regular 60 minute boil is plenty.

And I think that the time it takes a CFC to chill a 5 gallon batch to pitching temps is quick enough. If Jamil and the others want to make extra sure and use a recirculating IC, then more power to them. Until I see some hard data, I will continue to use my CFC.

Hmm. ok. That makes sense. Thanks for the info.

hmm.. so you guys reckon pump is a must. but then wouldnt we need two pumps? one to reciruclate cold water and one to recirculate hot wort?
there's no tricky way to bypass this pump story?
I have made a brutus setup with two pumps for this reason in my hometown. but now I made a small 20litre setup in my other house and wanted to bypass the tedious pump story..

and by the way, i meant i had a counterflow chiller plate (even though i don't know how one would be without the counterflow, i took it for granted that all plates are counterflow).

You feed the inlet with tap water. No pump necessary there. And you could run the tap water through a pre-ciller IC if needs be.

I have never needed to.

I do gravity feed the last gallon or two through my Therminator but I expect you could suck start a Volkswagen before you could suck start one of these.

ok that makes sense.. damn i didnt think of the tap water solution..
then i'll bite the bullet and get a pump and stop whining!

akardam said:

ok that makes sense.. damn i didnt think of the tap water solution..
then i'll bite the bullet and get a pump and stop whining!

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Yup. Just make sure you have the proper female to female coupling for the hose.

ok mate, cheers! i'm bound to screw up but it won't be the first time..

Homercidal said:

My personal opinion is that it's really only a concern for very light beers, like those made with pilsner malt, and then not so much if you do a 90 minute boil. For pale ales, a regular 60 minute boil is plenty.

And I think that the time it takes a CFC to chill a 5 gallon batch to pitching temps is quick enough.

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I tend to agree; for a light pilsner-based beer it might be an issue, but as long as your chilling is reasonably fast then it's unlikely to matter for other brews.

OTOH, an immersion chiller isn't any more expensive or harder to use, so the possibility was enough to tip my choice in that direction.

http://www.mrmalty.com/chiller.php has the one-sided discussion of Jamil's POV for those interested.

Also, check out the WortWizzard. It is another way to go instead of pumping. It uses venturi effect to suck beer through the chiller into the carboy. I would of went with it but I wanted a bit more of a GPM to the carboy. The thing is rated for 4' of head instead of the 12 my pump will provide.

I've seen gravity feed from kettle to fermentor through a plate chiller with no problems. I'm probably going the wort wizard route though.

Gfei said:

I've seen gravity feed from kettle to fermentor through a plate chiller with no problems. I'm probably going the wort wizard route though.

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What he said...I gravity feed through a plate chiller, no problems at all.

Yes. Wort can be fed through a Therminator via gravity. The more, the better. But, forget about throttling the throughput for incresed efficiency. You got one pass at open throttle and that is it.

Too much restriction and you'll lose siphon.

@Gila, I don't think I understand a single thing you said. for example, what does 'throttling the throughput for incresed efficiency'?

@Gfei and @cw_racefan, how exactly do you gravity feed from kettle to fermentor?

My kettle is slightly above the level of my fermenter on my stand, so I just run a 1/2" line from kettle to my chiller (slightly below output from kettle), and then another 1/2" line from chiller into fermenter. As long as the bottom of the output hose from the chiller is low enough, it works fine. I can also throttle the output using the ball valve on my kettle to adjust the output temp. Basically all you're doing is reducing the flow so that you get the output temperature you want. Never had an issue losing a siphon with my pickup in the kettle. I don't have a Therminator though, it's one from Duda Deisel.

akardam said:

@Gila, I don't think I understand a single thing you said. for example, what does 'throttling the throughput for incresed efficiency'?

@Gfei and @cw_racefan, how exactly do you gravity feed from kettle to fermentor?

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It is a common practice to restrict the output of a Therminator to keep the wort in contact with the cooling plates longer to cool the wort more effectively in a single pass.

Not too many users of plate chillers recirculate the boil to bring the bulk down more rapidly. Some do. I am one.

The practice of throttling the throughput is most effective on the hottest days of the season when the water source is it's warmest. On days like this, I can drop my wort from the boil to the 70's in a single pass with low 60's water easy. But if I am to pitch a lager I need the wort much cooler.

Thus, I must restrict the output enough to accomplish this.

Since my chiller system is pump driven, no problems. But gravity feed and it is easy to lose the siphon if the output flow is too low.

thanks for the explanation Gila! i understand now what is going on. however, i dont know why most users do not recirculate.. its seems logical to me to recirculate. Are they any disadvantages when going through the plate in more than one pass, except the hassle?

akardam said:

thanks for the explanation Gila! i understand now what is going on. however, i dont know why most users do not recirculate.. its seems logical to me to recirculate. Are they any disadvantages when going through the plate in more than one pass, except the hassle?

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Lots of reasons. But here are just two;

1. Brewer is on a well and the well water temp stays a consitent 50'ish all season long.

2. Poor filtration methods. More contact equals more buildup of gunk.

GilaMinumBeer said:

Lots of reasons. But here are just two;

1. Brewer is on a well and the well water temp stays a consitent 50'ish all season long.

2. Poor filtration methods. More contact equals more buildup of gunk.

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I fall under #1. My well water stays in the mid 50's year round. Makes chilling in one pass super easy!