How to build a control panel (part 1)

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WAORGANY said:
Why don't we as a community keep these needed punches circulating on here and sell them from one builder to the next, pay it forward, and rent them from each other for a set cost, use flat rate shipping via USPS and just circulate them around via this site...just a thought..
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X2!!!!:mug:
Count me in for late December.
 
That's pretty enough to get me thinking of wanting to play too...nice rig, thanks for sharing.
 
eBayISAPI.dll


I cannot for the life of me figure out how to take apart the momentary switch to install. Kal says to twist the switches 1/4 turn and pull out, but that is not working with this switch. I ordered the cheaper plastic switches as well from Pioneer and those were a chore to pull apart. I finally figured out how to do it by continuing to turn the threaded nut off and forcing it to pop apart.
 
Sparky said:
Kal, while we're discussing switches, how come you did not do illuminated switches? Thus, eliminating the switch and light on your panel.
Like, these:
http://www.automationdirect.com/adc...luminated_-a-_Non-Illuminated/LED/GCX3241-24L
Click to expand...

Mostly consistency. 5 of the switches are only switches. There are no lights to combine them with. The only two that could be combined would be the two pump switches/lights. The automationdirect.com ones seemed a but "plasticy" too. But that's a personal choice.

Kal
 
joety said:
eBayISAPI.dll


I cannot for the life of me figure out how to take apart the momentary switch to install. Kal says to twist the switches 1/4 turn and pull out, but that is not working with this switch. I ordered the cheaper plastic switches as well from Pioneer and those were a chore to pull apart. I finally figured out how to do it by continuing to turn the threaded nut off and forcing it to pop apart.
Click to expand...

Not sure if they are the same ones as I got (plastic ones from pioneer with the yellow red/green contact blocks) but if they are there is a white release on the side of them
It pops off the contact block and what's left is basically the same as the lights

And if you are wondering no i didn't put the punches up yet...got sidetracked with honeydo stuff this weekend :(
 
No, this is the metal momentary switch. I was able to pull apart those plastic Pioneer ones after all.

It's the exact same switch Kal uses, it just does not want to turn 1/4 turn.
 
joety said:
It's the exact same switch Kal uses, it just does not want to turn 1/4 turn.
Click to expand...
Did you losen the two mounting screws first? The switches often ship with them all the way in and this pushes the operator (the part you turn) such that you can't turn it to remove it since turning it makes it move in a bit.

Kal
 
This switch has what looks like one mounting screwing and a lever bar that applies pressure to the side opposite the mounting screw. I did try loosening that screw, however. There are notches in the rear of the chrome shell around the push button. I am wondering if you need a tool to twist the button.
 
joety said:
This switch has what looks like one mounting screwing and a lever bar that applies pressure to the side opposite the mounting screw. I did try loosening that screw, however. There are notches in the rear of the chrome shell around the push button. I am wondering if you need a tool to twist the button.
Click to expand...
No tool should be needed. I can't tell you how it should work as I haven't seen the style you mention. If it's unclear, write to whomever sold it to you for instructions.

Kal
 
For some reason I can't get a picture to post of the momentary button I can't dissaemlbe, but I also have one more follow up question on the build.

I don't know if anyone else did this, but instead of buying the three pronged box connections for the probes from Kal's sources, I bought the stock one from Auber Instruments. It came yesterday, and I can see that attaching the leads to the connector will be like building a ship in a bottle. Did anyone buy this unit and do it successfully?

Also, one interesting note. Since I'm building a RIMS versus Kal's HERMS, I only have one 1500w element to control, so my panel is 120V vs 240V and I ordered two single pole mechanical contactors vs three double poles. I got the box this week and it includes two single poles and two double poles that look just like Kal's.
 
joety said:
I don't know if anyone else did this, but instead of buying the three pronged box connections for the probes from Kal's sources, I bought the stock one from Auber Instruments. It came yesterday, and I can see that attaching the leads to the connector will be like building a ship in a bottle. Did anyone buy this unit and do it successfully?
Click to expand...

Yep. Took some steady hands for the soldering part. Make sure you match the two red wires and white wire with the correct pin on the connector. They are numbered, so you can tell which wires belong on which pins. Also, make sure that the red wires and white wire are all the same length. I put some pictures of my RTD connectors on my build thread.

TB
 
SweetSounds said:
It comes apart - No need to thread the needle with a soldering iron
Click to expand...

Tiber_Brew said:
Yeah, that backshell screws off, giving you access to the pins.

TB
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Come on guys... I KNOW we are trying to be helpful, but how can you pass a chance up to tell him about ALL the non-existant tools he will need to solder through that tiny hole.... :D
 
Ohio-Ed said:
Come on guys... I KNOW we are trying to be helpful, but how can you pass a chance up to tell him about ALL the non-existant tools he will need to solder through that tiny hole.... :D
Click to expand...

lol

"You need to wrap a straightened, chrome plated paperclip around your soldering iron tip. Cut it to .682 inches long and use .0063 solder. Be careful not to shine too much light in the hole - It will degrade the joint! And try not to melt the insulation off the wire when you shove it in the hole with the solder and paperclip!

Let us know how it worked out, and take lots of pics!"

:ban:
 
SweetSounds said:
lol

"You need to wrap a straightened, chrome plated paperclip around your soldering iron tip. Cut it to .682 inches long and use .0063 solder. Be careful not to shine too much light in the hole - It will degrade the joint! And try not to melt the insulation off the wire when you shove it in the hole with the solder and paperclip!

Let us know how it worked out, and take lots of pics!"

:ban:
Click to expand...

Tiber_Brew said:
Don't forget the surgical grade plasma tip soldering iron. They're about $2200 on eBay, but makes the tight jobs easier.

;)

TB
Click to expand...

SweetSounds said:
lol @ orthoscopic RTDcon CuPb RTD Implantation
Click to expand...

NOW, we're talking... :D
 
joety said:
Ok, funny guys, now if anyone could tell me how to unscrew that friggin' momentary switch I will be set.

BTW: Thanks, I thought I tried backing it off but obviously not.
Click to expand...

Can't help ya on that switch, but really, that backshell comes off quite easily on that RTD connector and you shouldn't have much of a problem with it. Regardless, it will still take a steady hand when soldering to those tiny pins. A word of advice, slide some heat shrink tubing on the wires before you solder, then shrink it over the soldering to cover it a bit. that will also give the backshell something to clamp on to once you screw that back in place (you'll notice there are a couple small phillips screws on it). You want all the tension taken off the solder joints...

Good luck!
TB
 
Well, don't feel too badly. I bought some of those from the same place and couldn't figure it out either. I emailed for help and Tamas sent me his phone number to call. One minute on the phone and problem solved!
 
WOW!! Okay, Joety, time to start your own new build-thread since I have some questions as to whats going on here. Geez, have you been secretly doing the Joety smoke-screen, with the "I dunno how to remove the cover on my button" stuff while doing your build???

Ya, I see the layout photo in the bottom center. Time, you cough up what's really been going on!

PS - Nice:ban:
 
I know a fair amount about electrical even though I go braindead on stuff like this occassionally, having been taught by my F-I-L who used to build homes before he became a DBA, however, it is really just a RIMS (vs HERMS) 120 Volt/1500W take on Kal's setup. I will try to be better about taking pictures however, and will put something together.
 
Sorry for the confusion guys - I've added some extra text to my site explaining that some switches may come apart differently:

To mount the switches loosen the two mounting screws and then turn the operator a quarter turn to pull it free from the metal body. Some switches (most notably pushbuttons like the one above) may have a little L-shaped tab you have to pull out slightly first. Do not force the switch apart. They all come apart easily.
Click to expand...

See: http://www.theelectricbrewery.com/control-panel-part-1?page=9

(It'll take a hour or so for the page changes to be seen as I cache them to reduce server load).

Kal
 
Anyone have thoughts on whether I could get away mounting the heat sink inside the box? The SSR will only have 1500W at 120volts running through it to power the RIMS tube. My heat sink looks like the opposite side should be mounted to something.
 
joety said:
Anyone have thoughts on whether I could get away mounting the heat sink inside the box? The SSR will only have 1500W at 120volts running through it to power the RIMS tube. My heat sink looks like the opposite side should be mounted to something.
Click to expand...
How big is the box? How big is your heat sink? I'm assuming it's sealed/closed (no airflow)?

The trick with external heat sinks is that airflow or convection helps suck away heat from the heat sinks.

Assuming your box is 100% closed, install the heat sink inside and what happens is that the heat sink gets hot sucking heat out of SSR which then heats up the inside components (reducing their lifespan to some degree). The whole inside hit some max ambient temp and stays there as heat hits the sides of the box and outside air currents/convection helps keep the whole box cool, but everything inside runs hotter than if you have the heatsink outside.

It would likely be fine, but outside is always better.

Kal

Kal
 
OK for the how to get the momentary switch apart question... you've pry figured this out by now, but here goes: 1. Remove white safety catch 2. Pull switch from contact block.

Seems like it should be that simple (and it is) but somewhat scary while actually doing it

when trying to pull the switch apart and you feel like your about to break the switch; just pull harder... sts
 
joety said:
Anyone have thoughts on whether I could get away mounting the heat sink inside the box? The SSR will only have 1500W at 120volts running through it to power the RIMS tube. My heat sink looks like the opposite side should be mounted to something.
Click to expand...

kal said:
How big is the box? How big is your heat sink? I'm assuming it's sealed/closed (no airflow)?

The trick with external heat sinks is that airflow or convection helps suck away heat from the heat sinks.

Assuming your box is 100% closed, install the heat sink inside and what happens is that the heat sink gets hot sucking heat out of SSR which then heats up the inside components (reducing their lifespan to some degree). The whole inside hit some max ambient temp and stays there as heat hits the sides of the box and outside air currents/convection helps keep the whole box cool, but everything inside runs hotter than if you have the heatsink outside.

It would likely be fine, but outside is always better.

Kal

Kal
Click to expand...

I had a similar question:
https://www.homebrewtalk.com/f51/ssr-heat-concerns-147508/

The inside of the box never got over 100f.

Note that I used a 40amp SSR & Heat Sink for a 1500 watt RIMs heater.

I used this configuration a few times with no problems.
Depending on the components you have in the box, you could see very different results.

On my new box, the SSR's are on the outside.

Ed
 
rosier9 said:
OK for the how to get the momentary switch apart question... you've pry figured this out by now, but here goes: 1. Remove white safety catch 2. Pull switch from contact block.

Seems like it should be that simple (and it is) but somewhat scary while actually doing it

when trying to pull the switch apart and you feel like your about to break the switch; just pull harder... sts
Click to expand...

Haha, Rosier, that is exactly how I pulled my selector switches apart (I bought a bulk box so I had a few extra if they really did break when prying apart). The momentary switch is different, however, but luckily, as you can see above, someone figured it out for me. On the selector switches, I found the best way to pry them apart was just to keep backing off the retainer ring until it popped. It really does feel like it will break. Kal actually went with a different metal based selector switch as he felt these seemed to cheap to the touch, but I figured I'll take my chances as it would be a breeze to replace them if they did fail.
 

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