WLP644 -Brett B Trois

Williams 728
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I have four vials. One old two fresh. One semi fresh. Wish they had an option for this on yeastcalc!

Seems the Chris white and troester stir plate growth rates are DRAMATICALLY different.

Really didn't want to do a three step build up for this to use lager pitch rates. Seems with a week per step that I'm screwed at splitting the batch. Maybe I just say what the Hell and build a 4.5L starter (aside- don't try to build a 5 L starter in a 5L flask unless you like cleaning) and let it go. I'm a bit behind schedule for building the starter since I plan to pitch Friday next week and it's Sunday and I haven't done it yet. Tonight is the night though.

TD


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I just pitch one vial into a half gallon at 1.040 (like I always do), agitated it a few times a day, then pitch it after a week when there is a nice yeast cake, always works great and now I have four pint jars filled with the yeast.
Brewing isn't all the rocket science we pretend it is

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Made my starter.

Agreed that what works in a classroom or textbook doesn't always translate into practical use.

Since I can't brew as often as I'd like, I hate to end up with underattenuated beers. I want to try and get it right rather than hope for the best. Seem like I should be fine after hearing about the success others have had with their starters. The low cell count in those vials, which I think were intended for secondary conditioning or bottling rather than primary fermentation, just had me a bit alarmed.

Thanks.

TD


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TrickyDick said:
Made my starter.

Agreed that what works in a classroom or textbook doesn't always translate into practical use.

Since I can't brew as often as I'd like, I hate to end up with underattenuated beers. I want to try and get it right rather than hope for the best. Seem like I should be fine after hearing about the success others have had with their starters. The low cell count in those vials, which I think were intended for secondary conditioning or bottling rather than primary fermentation, just had me a bit alarmed.

Thanks.

TD


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I'm no rocket surgeon, but I made a 2l starter of 1.040 wort with my vial that was pretty fresh. I pitched that 3 days later into 5 gal of 1.055 wort and 12 hours later it was going strong. Two weeks after I was at 1.012 and tasting really good. It has been sitting another month past that and I haven't checked on it recently but don't expect much more movement and hope it doesn't go much further.
 
BrewinHooligan said:
I'm no rocket surgeon, but I made a 2l starter of 1.040 wort with my vial that was pretty fresh. I pitched that 3 days later into 5 gal of 1.055 wort and 12 hours later it was going strong. Two weeks after I was at 1.012 and tasting really good. It has been sitting another month past that and I haven't checked on it recently but don't expect much more movement and hope it doesn't go much further.
Click to expand...

Again, further evidence of keeping it simple. I got freaked out by the low cell counts in these cultures (2.5-4.0 Billion Cells) versus traditional yeast cultures (100 Billion). Got my starter going now. Thanks.

TD
 
Well after about a month of getting my starter where I wanted it and not having time to brew, I finally got to make my hoppy wheat with the brett trois last night. Finished the brew around midnight and checked at 5am and the airlock was bubbling away. Can't wait for this to finish. What FG should I be looking for with this? Also anyone use this strain with any dark malts. Thinking about doing the same recipe with some chocolate or midnight wheat thrown in and pitching on to the yeast cake when this one finishes.
 
I did a lovely Belgian Black Ale with this strain. I used caramunich and carafa special II for color without too much roast flavor so the yeast esters could still shine through. Came out nice. You should be approaching 1.010 in about 3 weeks or so.


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poobaca said:
Well after about a month of getting my starter where I wanted it and not having time to brew, I finally got to make my hoppy wheat with the brett trois last night. Finished the brew around midnight and checked at 5am and the airlock was bubbling away. Can't wait for this to finish. What FG should I be looking for with this? Also anyone use this strain with any dark malts. Thinking about doing the same recipe with some chocolate or midnight wheat thrown in and pitching on to the yeast cake when this one finishes.
Click to expand...

i'm going to try a porter once my current batch is done.... very curious.
 
My first batch done with trois was a porter and it was incredibly good. One of my favorite beers ive done to date. It finished very clean, which let the dark roasty malts shine through, while giving it an ever so slight fruitiness that was simply outstanding. The beer also aged very well despite it's lowish ABV.

Funny this comes up today, as I am doing the second batch of this tonight. Gonna add some cold brewed coffee and a little cocoa near kegging time to give it a little edge. Anyone found nibs or the belgian powder to be more effective/more desirable?
 
Well...wasn't thinking quite clearly when I finished up at 4:30am doing a double brew night/morning. Should have gone with a blow off tube. Not even sure that would have saved the mess. One of the most vigorous ferments I've seen. Had done a small starter a couple days prior. It's fermenting at about 70 degrees.

ImageUploadedByHome Brew1398602963.139317.jpg


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Thanks for the tip off!

I read your post, and quickly went to my Just Pitched brew and swapped off the airlock for a blow off. Granted its a poor mind blow off with hose connected to the stem of the three piece airlock, but it usually works pretty well. I also added fermcap.

Did you oxygenate yours? I purposely didn't because I read somewhere in here that it forced the Brett to work harder and make more delicious stuff.

TD


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TrickyDick said:
Did you oxygenate yours? I purposely didn't because I read somewhere in here that it forced the Brett to work harder and make more delicious stuff.
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Yeah I did aerate heavily. For this porter I wanted that really clean, slightly fruity ferment I have seen from trois before instead of getting anything funky.

Maybe a blowoff wont be needed for yours cause of the lack of aeration. Better safe than sorry.
 
Well, for what its worth, I had a starter in a flask sitting for a couple days in the fridge (thought it would take longer to ferment out). After cooling the wort, I ran some off into the flask after decanting the liquid to help re suspend the yeast. I had a foam cap on but the just boiled and cooled wort was poorly aerated. After I put the fermenters into the freezer, it had to cool the wort off a couple of degrees before I could pitch, so after about an hour or two there was a huge amount of krausen in the 5L flask waiting to be pitched. I sort of wonder if running a whirlpool recirculation in the kettle. introduced some air ...

TD


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So mine dropped from mid 1.070 something, to 1.011 in about ten days with no aeration. The aroma is unlike any beer I've had before. Although I'm not a fan of yeast washing, I may have to hang onto this sucker for a repitch sometime.

TD


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I'll be using this for the first time tomorrow in an IPA, ~70-75 IBU's, with mostly Galaxy and Citra hops. Some Amarillo in the dry hop too, can't wait!
 
TrickyDick said:
So mine dropped from mid 1.070 something, to 1.011 in about ten days with no aeration. The aroma is unlike any beer I've had before. Although I'm not a fan of yeast washing, I may have to hang onto this sucker for a repitch sometime.
Click to expand...

you don't need to wash, just collect some yeast cake in a jar, and it keeps well at least a few weeks at room temp.
 
I never wash anymore. Just bleach some pint jars, then after you finish racking to secondary dump your trub into the jars and seal them. If you refrigerate they stay good for months and months but you will need to make a starter. If you don't refrigerate then it lasts about a week and you can just shake up the jar and pitch it.

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I always found rinsing a PITA. To avoid that, I've started making a larger starter than needed, decanting, then taking some of the slurry and pouring it into a jar with some deoxygenated water (boiled in the mic for a few minutes then cooled). Keeps really well for months. I've been keeping my YG001 yeast around using this method for a couple brews and have had great success.

I don't know how this would work with a blend of souring bacteria though, since they grow at different rates. I guess it'd be no different than brewing a beer and then reusing the cake or rinsing the cake. It should work to some degree! :mug:
 
Good to know. I only pitched the Brett. No bugs. I think I'll collect some and refrigerate since I'm not sure when I'll be using it again.
TD


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First Trois brew in the fermenter at 1.08 OG! My brew assistant(wife) let some hops spill into the fermentor, so maybe it'll be a little extra hoppy? Anyhow here's my recipe for 5 gallons+2L:

12lbs pale 2 row
4lbs red wheat
1lb crystal 20L
1/2lb flaked oats

1oz Warrior @60
1/2 oz Citra @30
1/2oz Galaxy @15
1/2oz Galaxy @10
1/2oz Galaxy @5
1/2oz Galaxy @0
1/2oz Citra @0

Single infusion @152F for 90mins
Batch sparge @170F for 30mins

Entire 2L WLP644 starter(non airated) pitched @68F, placed into 72F warm room

I have 1oz each of Amarillo, Citra, and Galaxy that will be the dry hop for 7 days after fermentation has ceased.

My wort airates as it goes into the fermenter, hopefully not too much tartness shows up.
 
I just brewed my first all Brett beer. I basically just did The Mad Fermentationist Trois IPA Recipe but did a just a bit different. 47% pale ale malt. 38% Belgian wheat malt. 6% caramunich. 5% flaked wheat. 3% aromatic. 2% acid malt. Hops are chinook, centennial, and citra. I did a 600ml Starter, and then stepped it up to 2000ml.

10253749_10104563673343970_5104447993240202328_n.jpg
 
Conrad1 said:
I just brewed my first all Brett beer. I basically just did The Mad Fermentationist Trois IPA Recipe but did a just a bit different. 47% pale ale malt. 38% Belgian wheat malt. 6% caramunich. 5% flaked wheat. 3% aromatic. 2% acid malt. Hops are chinook, centennial, and citra.
Click to expand...

you're gonna be happy with it, guaranteed. give it time to finish and dry hop the hell out of it with those same hops!
 
Made a 500 ml starter for secondary fermentation of a wit beer. After 6 months it's gone from 1012 to 1004. Despite what I've heard that it is lackluster for secondary, I disagree. The wit was meh after primary, but now tastes awesome. Fruity, funky and just the right tang. Temp was at ~64 throughout. May let it sit for a few more months... or not!
 
At what FG are you guys bottling with this? I'm pretty sure that they will be consumed pretty quick, but I'd like to keep a few to see what happens over time. Just don't want any more bottle bombs.
 
From what I read in "Wild Brews" Brettanomyces are superfermenters when acting in conjunction with other yeast/organisms. However, when acting alone to ferment, they achieve typical attenuation values. That being said, I will soon be checking my FG of a 100% Trois fermentation and a "conan" yeast fermentation. I'll post the values later. From what I've read it might be prudent to bottle once its at or below 1.009, however I'm not very experienced with using Brett, and depending on the variables of your brew, you might have different results.

TD

edit-
so my brew, started at 1.074 OG, and with 100% Brett Trois, went to 1.008. The one with Conan only made it to 1.011. Mash was very simple 95% 2 row and 5% caramalt at 149º single infusion. added some corn sugar at end of boil.
 
i'm using trois for a real session pale ale. i'm gonna be working on it all summer, i think. first formulation is done, based partly on tasty mcdole's widely publicized pale session recipe. i'll post the recipe for discussion, if anyone in interested in discussing. the goal was a ~3.5 to 4.0% abv hoppy easy drinker with some body, and that special fruitiness that this wonderful strain brings. the first brew is just barely ready but i'm already thinking about the next version. gonna increase the late hops and give it a little more body, but drop the alc % a little. i really want it in the 3's. in this iteration i overshot the gravity due to efficiency miscalculation from such a light malt bill, so it's a bit bigger than i wanted. but it's shaping up to be a great bbq beer. base malts are belgian unless otherwise described. and all the barley is 2-row, for those of you counting rows.
i call it AmMo Pale.
22% wheat malt
20% pale ale malt
15% pilsener malt
16% crystal, thomas fawcett light (70 ebc = ~30-40 srm?)
15% thomas fawcett maris otter
4% acidulated malt
4% flaked oats
4% cara-pils
i hope that adds up to around 100%...
warrior, 60 min, 19.5 IBU
amarillo, 10 min, 0.65 g/L
mosaic, 10 min, 0.65 g/L
amarillo, 0 min, 0.65 g/L
mosaic, 0 min, 0.65 g/L
amarillo, dry hop, 1 g/L
mosaic, dry hop, 1 g/L
OG: 1.044
FG: 1.008
 
This strain would be an excellent choice for a session IPA. Something like Founders All Day IPA which is already very juicy would be amazing with the extra fruitiness that trois would bring. Great idea.
 
yep, it's just gonna be a matter of dialing in the body as the brett can leave it a bit thin (as everyone reading this already knows). my version keeps the IBUs (calculated around 30) and dry hop moderate, but it could be a nice playground for outrageous late/dry hopping
 
Anyone used Mandarina Bavaria hops with this strain? Got a simple 1.050 og 35 ibu recipe im doing this weekend with 4oz all end of boil additions.
 
dinnerstick said:
i'm using trois for a real session pale ale. i'm gonna be working on it all summer, i think. first formulation is done, based partly on tasty mcdole's widely publicized pale session recipe. i'll post the recipe for discussion, if anyone in interested in discussing. the goal was a ~3.5 to 4.0% abv hoppy easy drinker with some body, and that special fruitiness that this wonderful strain brings. the first brew is just barely ready but i'm already thinking about the next version. gonna increase the late hops and give it a little more body, but drop the alc % a little. i really want it in the 3's. in this iteration i overshot the gravity due to efficiency miscalculation from such a light malt bill, so it's a bit bigger than i wanted. but it's shaping up to be a great bbq beer. base malts are belgian unless otherwise described. and all the barley is 2-row, for those of you counting rows.
i call it AmMo Pale.
22% wheat malt
20% pale ale malt
15% pilsener malt
16% crystal, thomas fawcett light (70 ebc = ~30-40 srm?)
15% thomas fawcett maris otter
4% acidulated malt
4% flaked oats
4% cara-pils
i hope that adds up to around 100%...
warrior, 60 min, 19.5 IBU
amarillo, 10 min, 0.65 g/L
mosaic, 10 min, 0.65 g/L
amarillo, 0 min, 0.65 g/L
mosaic, 0 min, 0.65 g/L
amarillo, dry hop, 1 g/L
mosaic, dry hop, 1 g/L
OG: 1.044
FG: 1.008
Click to expand...

an update on this beer, for anyone interested (is anyone interested? is anyone out there?). it's on tap now but still carbing and settling. cloudy, pale straw color. moderate mango tropical fruit aroma, and one person picked up strawberry in the nose. super chuggable, especially as it's on the low side of carbonation. i'm not a fast drinker but i reckon i could get a pint of this necked pretty sharpish. for all the different base malts, you don't really get a complex malt backbone. it's just that really light biscuit flavor, no 'grainy' pils flavor. i think it could use a hint more body, but my tasting panel, sitting in the afternoon sun, was pleased with a real light summer beer. low pleasant bitterness, i think i'll boost that a tiny bit as well. the hops are subtle, it's not a grapefruit bomb, maybe it could/should be. the second version will be brewed soon, lower SG, higher oat %, skip the multi-base malt and go with all golden promise (bought a 25kg sack), maybe add in some unmalted wheat, bigger late hop addition to give just a few more ibu.
well there, i'm glad i got the opportunity to discuss with with you. yes you. thanks for reading.
 
Here is the recipe we did yesterday. Created a 1L starter Wednesday and it took off within 12 hours. Mashed @ 156F, boiled for 90 minutes. Very excited for this brew!

1401147537297.jpg
 
jfrank85 said:
Here is the recipe we did yesterday. Created a 1L starter Wednesday and it took off within 12 hours. Mashed @ 156F, boiled for 90 minutes. Very excited for this brew!
Click to expand...

i have no idea how anyone can work in base 16- pounds and ounces and quarts and flagons..... you really gotta know your math rather than just sliding around a flimsy decimal point! the reason i say that is not to be a dick about imperial measurements but trying to figure out roughly the percentage of wheat in your recipe. dunno if you've used this strain before but you might find that this strain really chews through everything leaving it a bit watery, which you can compensate for with high wheat or various unmalted grain additions.
i had to look up the mandarina hop, have you used it before? i had never heard of it but it sounds like it could be perfect with this yeast
 
Never used Mandarina, thought it would be a good pair. Has anyone had quick startup to quick drop out? Before I start yes I know that airlock activity is no indication of fermentation. I pitched a 1L 1.040 starter that has been started for 5 days prior to pitching into a 1.048 4 gallon wort @ 75F. Fermentation @ 80F took off STRONG within 12 hours and completely stopped ~30 hours after it started. The wort has a covering of yeast "patches" on top. Brett is a new critter for me so I'm not very well versed on its characteristics.
 
I agree regarding body, I've done several batches with this yeast and despite high percentages wheat or oats they all have very thin body. Still great and refreshing but tough to get big mouthfeel from

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Petekiteworld said:
I agree regarding body, I've done several batches with this yeast and despite high percentages wheat or oats they all have very thin body. Still great and refreshing but tough to get big mouthfeel from
Click to expand...

but it is possible, high % wheat malt, oat flakes, crystal works for me
 

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