BIAB OG too low...ideas please

Ok, been wanting to go from extract to all grain for awhile now. I went out and got the Zymurgy magazine with the urban brewing article in it. Looked easy enough, so last night I tried it.

First I want to say that it was really fun :rockin:, the process is a great step before doing a full-on all-grain sparge-lauter-and so on process. It just seemed a little daunting for me. I took pics of my BIAB process if that is interesting to anyone, just ask I'll post.

So, using beersmith 2 I put together a brown-ale type recipe. It was my first time using that too, so please don't rake me over the coals with my recipe! LOL I was shooting for a 3.5g batch for the fermenter with an O.G. of 1.060.

6 gallons in, 9 lbs of grain (7 2-row, 2 120) 156 degrees for an hour, then 168 degrees for 10 mins---voila mash done! It was cool, and it smelled awesome in my apartment!!!

Pre-Boil gravity was 1.044, beersmith 2 estimated 1.042. So, I was looking good. Told me to top off to 5.3 gallons and I did that and started a boil.

One hour boil done, and I was feeling good. Cooled it and transferred it into my primary. Oh No!!! 1.044 O.G. @ 4.50 gallons. Goal was 1.060 @ 3.5. I just didn't boil off enough liquid. I pitched my yeast and chalked it up to a learning process.....a very fun learning process!!!

So, I want to boost some gravity points either in my primary or secondary, I have a little molasses left over from a previous beer, or i have some DME. I don't know what, when, or how much to add. Suggestions Please!!!

Sounds like you topped up with water when you didn't need to. That would explain why your OG was so low. Next time, don't top off and I'll bet your OG and volume are right on.


Also, you said this was your first BIAB and that you had pictures.....

POST THEM!!!!


That's all for now.

Dialing in the amount you boil off is part of learning all grain. If you did this as a "stove top" batch then I am not surprised you only boiled off 0.8 gal. Just remember that number for last time, it should be pretty close to the same every time.

If it were me I wouldn't add anything to increase gravity. 1.044 sg should result in a nice session brown.

Here's the Start!!! That is my ghetto measuring stick, but it gives my brewday that rustic feel!

Here is 5 gallon starting point...yeah I meesed up at this picture, I caught the mistake and finished the top-off to 6 gallons! You can also see the huge grain bag!!!

Half of the grain!!!

Here you can see the entire grain I used...still waiting for my super sweet 1990 electric, apartment grade stove to heat the water!

Water: 162 degrees (little compensation for the grains) -- Check!
Slowly add grains while stirring to prevent dough-balls -- Check!
Waaay too excited about grains steeping in water -- Double Check!!

I think that this method is perfect for people transitioning to All-Grain, or especially people like me who live in apartments. For people in my shoes, you probably have a crap electric stove like mine! During the mash, I do not turn off the burner, instead I turn it to low, it keeps the temp. in the perfect range.

"Where did ya learn that at Cheech, drug school!?!" Nah it's just my hops, left over Cascade and Hallertau! I love this Hobby!!!:rockin:

Great pictures. I'm sure beer smith has DME and I bet it has molasses. Just add them to the recipe and adjust the amounts until you get the OG you want.

6 gallons in, 9 lbs of grain (7 2-row, 2 120) 156 degrees for an hour, then 168 degrees for 10 mins---voila mash done! It was cool, and it smelled awesome in my apartment!!!

Click to expand...

I think you mashed too high. If you mash high, you end up with low OG and high FG. If you do BIAB the temps in the bottom of the mash kettle tend to be higher then the temps on the top of the kettle, where you measure them. You need to stir BIAB a lot and measure the temps after stirring.

This is where the work comes in. You need to let the sugary goodness drip! 9lbs. of grain saturated with water can be a little heavy. I'm guessing 16-20 lbs. It will be easier if you get a stool or chair and stand on it so you are holding the bag at your waist; and not over your head, if you are on the ground.

WARNING: This is heavy and Hot so be careful! I have an easy and cheap remedy for this that I may reveal soon!

Scooby_Brew -- Thanks for that. I didn't stir too much, wasn't sure if I was supposed to. Next time I will stir more!

fifelee -- Geez, why in the heck didn't I think of that?!?? LOL, sometimes the easiest answer escapes me! Thanks a lot for the suggestion!

Post-Mash Dipstick...Right at 5 gallons. Lost exactly 1 gallon during 70 min mash. This is where beersmith said to top to 5.3, and I did so.

Don't worry boys and girls, I am a professional and this is a highly calibrated piece of equipment! This was my top-off amount.

...And the good stuff!!! You can see the post mash gravity reading cooling in the background.

Speeennnntttt!!! Came up to the 2.5 gallon mark on the bucket!

So now we boil like normal! Man that was fun!

Cool it...

Pitch it...

I know people may advise against it but I top off in the fermenter when necessary.
I take a SG reading and evaluate whether or not I want to do it depending on the volume I am trying to reach. Not super scientific but it has always worked out fine.

As you pointed out though, it is going to be a learning process until you are familiar with how your equipment behaves.

Man, it looks so good in there!

Shhhh...ancient family recipe!

Did you have any problems with the bag resting on the bottom of the pot and becoming scorched?

msa8967 -- Nope, I didn't have any issues with that at all.

Ah, the sweet, sweet sounds of an airlock!

I'm gonna do another BIAB next weekend. Does anyone want to see anything with my next brewday??? I am thinking of doing a kiwi hefeweizen.

Sure! Beer porn is always good.

dhickey said:

So, using beersmith 2 I put together a brown-ale type recipe. It was my first time using that too, so please don't rake me over the coals with my recipe! LOL I was shooting for a 3.5g batch for the fermenter with an O.G. of 1.060.

6 gallons in, 9 lbs of grain (7 2-row, 2 120) 156 degrees for an hour, then 168 degrees for 10 mins---voila mash done! It was cool, and it smelled awesome in my apartment!!!

Pre-Boil gravity was 1.044, beersmith 2 estimated 1.042. So, I was looking good. Told me to top off to 5.3 gallons and I did that and started a boil.

One hour boil done, and I was feeling good. Cooled it and transferred it into my primary. Oh No!!! 1.044 O.G. @ 4.50 gallons. Goal was 1.060 @ 3.5. I just didn't boil off enough liquid. I pitched my yeast and chalked it up to a learning process.....a very fun learning process!!!

Click to expand...

Couple of things. A little later in this thread, you mentioned that you were at 5 gallons before you topped up. If you were at 5 gallons with 1.044, there's no way you ended up with 4.5 gallons at 1.044. I'm saying this not because there's anything to do about it, but just as an awareness thing. Sugars don't go anywhere in the boil. So if you have less volume post boil than before you topped off, your gravity had to go up. So, if your preboil gravity reading was correct, at 1.044 for 5 gals, then your post boil would have to be 1.049 at 4.5 gals. Or if the post boil was right, then your preboil was really 1.040. So, one or more of your gravity or volume readings was off, not that there's anything you can do about it at this point.

As was mentioned earlier, this is all just part of learning your process. Beersmith will give you volumes and gravity based on where you tell it it needs to end up and where you lose volume along the way. Check your boiloff rate, it probably needs to be decreased.

dhickey said:

So, I want to boost some gravity points either in my primary or secondary, I have a little molasses left over from a previous beer, or i have some DME. I don't know what, when, or how much to add. Suggestions Please!!!

Click to expand...

I wouldn't add anything. BUT, if you want to, each pound of DME will add about .045 gravity points per gallon. So in a 3.5 gallon batch, each pound of DME would add something like .013 points to your "OG". But you would want to boil the DME in water first to sanitize, and you'd have to account for the water you added as well if you really want to know where you're going to end up.

One thing I would recommend would be to go back into your beersmith recipe and adjust your volumes according to what you actually saw and see if you can't get the numbers to line up. This will probably help with learning what changes make what difference as well.

discnjh -- My pre/post boil gravities threw me for a loop too. I thought the same thing, it's water boiling off and sugars left behind, so it must be more concentrated. I really think that I messed up a reading somewhere, but I was triple checking all readings. Not sure what to say about that. Also, I was hoping to put in actual numbers into beersmith and see what it suggested for my next batch. I don't know for sure how to do that. Still learning the program. Thanks a lot, for your insight.

dhickey said:

discnjh -- My pre/post boil gravities threw me for a loop too. I thought the same thing, it's water boiling off and sugars left behind, so it must be more concentrated. I really think that I messed up a reading somewhere, but I was triple checking all readings. Not sure what to say about that. Also, I was hoping to put in actual numbers into beersmith and see what it suggested for my next batch. I don't know for sure how to do that. Still learning the program. Thanks a lot, for your insight.

Click to expand...

Go to your water volumes tab for this recipe and start adjusting there. You could make a copy of the recipe and play with that if you don't want to futz with your original recipe. But the water volumes tab is where you can enter your boil off, trub-losses, etc. If you come across specific questions about what means what, I'm sure someone here will be happy to answer.

I'll say it - Stop taking pictures would be my advice. Once you become confident in your process then snap away.

samc -- What does snapping pictures have to do with the process? I am just using the best brewing resource that is available to me...you guys! I love to brew and this is what makes this hobby great, sharing ideas, and with the suggestions that everyone gives, I can have the best brewday possible with some great beer!

Thanks Everyone!!!

Simply put, concentrating on getting all your processes down correctly without taking the time to take pictures. Personally I like to put all my efforts to one task until I get it right. Now that I'm pretty experienced at brewing I can do lots of other things because the brew day is routine. If that is not the case for you, then multi-task away.

I've done a total of 4 BIAB batches and each time I learn more. My first batches gravity was way off like yours. It also is a brown that I am drinking now. It is still pretty good even though I made mistakes. My last batch was last weekend, a porter that was to come in at 1.062. I hit 1.058 so I am much closer. Didn't calculate my boil off correctly and had about 3/4 gallon too much so that might have been the difference.

The few things I have learned are this.

1 - I have the LBS double crush my grain, or I use a blender to get it very fine.

2 - Controlling your mash temp is key (as someone already stated) and it can get away from you very easily.

3 - I suspend my grain bag above brew pot using a string and pulley system to let much of the water drain from it. I use a small pot lid to lightly press the grain to get a little more water out.

Utilizing all my grain by making sure it was crushed really good and controlling my mash temps were the things I noticed that made the most difference. I still have a lot to learn but feel more confident that I'm getting a handle on it.

samc -- I definately understand where you're coming from. I would like to take more pics showing things im doing while it is going on, but my first priority is the brew. So, most my pics come during the downtime. If you noticed, it takes my stove about an hour just get to a boil. Thats when I do the pictures, while i'm waiting for the next step to happen. Thanks though!

KaiserBierMann -- I can't wait till I have a few batches under my belt, and get this process nailed down. Do you leave heat on during your mash? Are you stirring frequently? Or do you turn your burner off?

Today I decided to add a little molasses. Not because it is going to add too many points to my low O.G., but I had it in the cabinet and I wanted to add a little something to the flavor of the Brown. So, 4oz of molasses when in the carboy. I did add it to 6oz of boiling water, just in case something got into the bottle. It was opened 2 months ago after all.

dhickey said:

KaiserBierMann -- I can't wait till I have a few batches under my belt, and get this process nailed down. Do you leave heat on during your mash? Are you stirring frequently? Or do you turn your burner off?

Click to expand...

As soon as I hit my mash temps I turn off my heat. I've noticed that with my set-up that it will hold that temp for 30 mins or so. Once I see it drop a couple degrees I will fire it back up until I hit the mash temp again. Normally that holds until mashout.

As a side note. I brewed my 5th BIAB today and tried something different. I ran my grain through a blender last night to crush it a little further. I nailed my mash temps and not sure if the finely crushed grain made a difference or not but I missed the target OG only by .001. I'm pretty pumped that I'm finally getting the process tuned.

Hope this helps some...

KaiserBierMann -- Congrats man!! That's awesome that you are gettin it zeroed in! I am going to try another round either mid-week or Friday. I want to do a Hefe, but part of me says to try the same beer, and taste for differences. What's your opinion?